Terminal 2 at Sky Harbor Airport is CLOSING! (Phoenix: mattress, construction)

[pbenjamin]

I always liked it. The parking is real convenient.

[Valley Native]

Originally Posted by RJ312

Terminal 2 was the best terminal at Sky Harbor because it was uncrowded. In the last 2 decades, airlines without a major presence in Phoenix flew out of it. United was flying to hub cities like Denver out of it. Before the United-Continental merger, Continental was in 2. I liked when I’d have United or Continental flights because Terminal 2 was in crowded. It was old but not dealing with the Southwest or American (US Airways or America West prior to mergers) crowds was totally worth it. It was also reminiscent of old Phoenix before the massive growth.

T2 was great in its day, but it is now very obsolete and needs to be demolished. I would actually prefer if Sky Harbor didn't have separate terminals and could just have one gigantic terminal sectioned off for the various purposes: smaller airlines in one area, major domestic flights in another, and international flights separated from the rest. That would make it a lot easier for people to get around ... but I guess that's why we have the SkyTrain, so that if you're in the wrong terminal, you can just take the train to the other.

[cjseliga]

Originally Posted by Valley Native

That would make it a lot easier for people to get around ... but I guess that's why we have the SkyTrain, so that if you're in the wrong terminal, you can just take the train to the other.

True, but remember the SkyTrain is before security, where as other airports like DFW and IAH have a train connecting their various terminals/concourses after security. Having said that, the long term plan is to eventually make a connecting walkway going from the newly renovated north concourse of T3 over to T4 where Gates A15-A30 are.

I'm assuming this new connector with go under the taxiway like the SkyTrain does to the south of there. And I'm sure once they build Terminal West, where T2 is now, they will make a walkway after security to connect T3 to T-West.

[barca12]

I guess my question is why didn't they rebuild Terminal 2 to make it more modern. From what I understand they are turning it into a glorified bus stop. It will host transportation shuttles or buses that take you to planes directly on the runway. What was the Phoenix City Council and Mayor thinking? They allowed a perfectly good terminal to turn into a bus stop. Wouldn't it have made more sense to tear down and rebuild the terminal into a more modern one that could host additional planes and enhance the airport?

I think Phoenix needs more international flights. It's really holding back the city in terms of recruiting more corporate jobs and headquarters. You need more than good weather and cheap housing to lure Fortune 500 companies. I also read a lot of chatter about schools. Really what is preventing this city from taking that next step is a major international airport. Speaking from experience, the city has lost companies based on the airport alone.

Instead of tearing down Terminal 2, it would have been better off rebuilding it and making it an international terminal. Phoenix has direct flights to Asia particularly Tokyo and Hong Kong. They also need flights to Paris, Amsterdam, Copenhagen, and Rome.

[cjseliga]

Originally Posted by barca12

They allowed a perfectly good terminal to turn into a bus stop. Wouldn't it have made more sense to tear down and rebuild the terminal into a more modern one that could host additional planes and enhance the airport?

The terminal was outdated, even after being renovated a few times, and they are building a new terminal to replace Terminal 2, it will probably be called Terminal West and my guess is that they will start construction in the next 8-10 years.

They even created a terminal station for the Sky Train for this future terminal as it goes to the car rental facility. Trust me, with the number of airline passengers expected to double in the future, the people at Sky Harbor are indeed planning for it, it's just going to take some time.

[exit2lef]

There's simply no way that T2 could have been updated enough to make it compatible with current airline and passenger expectations. It had a strange layout with inefficient utilization of space. It was time for it to go. I'm just glad the historic mural is being relocated to the rental car center, which will be accessible via the Sky Train once phase 2 construction is done.

In terms of international service, that has nothing to do with T2. It has been a long struggle to expand direct service to cities outside North America, and that has more to do with corporate headquarters, tourism, and other factors affecting the Phoenix Metro Area as a whole than it does with any aspect of Sky Harbor's layout and operations.

[barca12]

Originally Posted by cjseliga

The terminal was outdated, even after being renovated a few times, and they are building a new terminal to replace Terminal 2, it will probably be called Terminal West and my guess is that they will start construction in the next 8-10 years.

They even created a terminal station for the Sky Train for this future terminal as it goes to the car rental facility. Trust me, with the number of airline passengers expected to double in the future, the people at Sky Harbor are indeed planning for it, it's just going to take some time.

I was aware the facilities were outdated. But what I was proposing was not to renovate but to tear the entire terminal down and the rebuild it completely. They are not creating another terminal. They are adding a concourse to Terminal 4 which will host more Southwest Airlines flights. In the distant future, they plan to create an international concourse at Terminal 4 but those plans are 10 years away from initiation.

They are not creating another terminal and are not replacing terminal 2. The space occupied by terminal 2 will be a bus stop to take passengers onto the tarmac directly to the planes.

Originally Posted by exit2lef

There's simply no way that T2 could have been updated enough to make it compatible with current airline and passenger expectations. It had a strange layout with inefficient utilization of space. It was time for it to go. I'm just glad the historic mural is being relocated to the rental car center, which will be accessible via the Sky Train once phase 2 construction is done.

In terms of international service, that has nothing to do with T2. It has been a long struggle to expand direct service to cities outside North America, and that has more to do with corporate headquarters, tourism, and other factors affecting the Phoenix Metro Area as a whole than it does with any aspect of Sky Harbor's layout and operations.

Everyone understands that T2 could not have been updated. What they failed to address is why they couldn't rebuild a terminal on the site that hosted T2. Instead, they are going to occupy that space with a bus terminal.

I was not making any claims about T2 and international service. Rather, my position was if you are going to relocate United Airlines and others to T3, then perhaps they should rebuild T2 and make it an international terminal.

Denver built an international terminal long before there was a need. Denver does not have a large corporate presence or large population. Yet, they have one of the finest airports in the country. DFW was also very forward thinking when they created DFW International airport. These airports were created in anticipation of need and a means to lure companies and create jobs. If you build an international terminal and offer flights to Tokyo, Hong Kong, Sao Paulo, Paris, etc. more companies will relocate to Phoenix knowing it has the routes necessary to serve its clients. I can tell you that myself and other member of the Great Phoenix Economic Council have strongly recommended to the legislature about the importance of an international terminal at Sky Harbor.

I think what many citizens are unaware of is the disconnect between our corporate partners and the politicians. We have pleaded with politicians to create an international terminal as it is one of the first steps to really lure more corporations to Phoenix. The citizens seem to be oblivious to this. Mayor Kate Gallegos seems to understand and embrace this idea but I'm unsure about the rest of the city council and local politicians.

[exit2lef]

Originally Posted by barca12

We have pleaded with politicians to create an international terminal as it is one of the first steps to really lure more corporations to Phoenix. The citizens seem to be oblivious to this. Mayor Kate Gallegos seems to understand and embrace this idea but I'm unsure about the rest of the city council and local politicians.

I'm curious: Who are "we"? Is this a general term for concerned citizens who share your position, or are you referring to a position taken by GPEC? I've never known GPEC to openly criticize the city, so is this a leak of something that can't be said officially?

Also, the mayor's last name is Gallego (no s at the end).

[timothyaw]

Originally Posted by barca12

I... Phoenix has direct flights to Asia particularly Tokyo and Hong Kong. They also need flights to Paris, Amsterdam, Copenhagen, and Rome.

I didn't see any these destinations listed as direct connections from Sky Harbor (although the website does say check with airlines for updated info). Does anyone know of a site that has the latest info or is this correct?
https://www.skyharbor.com/flights/Wh...alDestinations

[cjseliga]

Originally Posted by barca12

They are not creating another terminal and are not replacing terminal 2. The space occupied by terminal 2 will be a bus stop to take passengers onto the tarmac directly to the planes.

Sorry, but you're mistaken, the new terminal will go just west of where T2 is currently, and like I said in my previous comments these things don't happen overnight and will take time to get going, like 10-20 years and of course lots of money to complete. Heck, they just completely renovated the T3 check-in/security, built a brand new beautiful south concourse for T3 and renovated the north concourse of T3 over the last 5 years, things take time. They are also going to build a new North Concourse for T3 (along with the new concourse currently under construction at T4, like you mentioned), just east of the newly renovated T3 North Concourse that just reopened, that will also include a post-security passenger connector between Terminals 3 and 4.

Yes, once they demo T2, it will be "bus gates", but only until they start constructing the new concourses of the new West Terminal. I mean if you have an extra $5.7 Billion laying around under your mattress that you would like to donate, then by all means they can build your dream airport lickety-split, so you can jet-off to far-flung places around the globe! I'm truly sorry that aren't building these new concourses and terminals as fast as YOU would like.



Here are the projects over the next 20 years:

Phase 1: Years 0-5. Estimated cost: $1 billion.

• Completion of Terminal 4 Concourse S-1 under construction: $248 million.
• Construction of a new Terminal 3 North Concourse with six additional gates: $178 million.
• Demolition of Terminal 2 and replace it with bus gates: $28 million.
• Trench the railroad tracks: $441 million.
• Acquire land north of the railroad tracks: $25 million.

Phase 2: Years 5-10. Estimated cost: $1.2 billion.

• Built a new west terminal concourse: $361 million.
• Initial development of north cargo and facilities infrastructure: $263 million.
• A post-security passenger connector between Terminals 3 and 4: $194 million.
• Redesign Sky Harbor Boulevard for better connectivity, capacity and security: $137 million.
• Build a cross-field taxiway on the west side of the airfield: $74 million.

Phase 3: Years 10-20. Estimated cost: $1.7 billion.

• Completion of the west terminal's south-side concourses, roads and processing facilities: $1.3 billion.
• Expand cargo capacity on the north side: $122 million.
• Build a second west-side cross-field taxiway: $50 million.

Phase 4: After 20 years. Estimated cost: $1.8 billion.

• Development of the west terminal's north-side concourses and related facilities: $1.4 billion.
• A service-road tunnel connecting north-side operations and the facilities area to the terminals: $225 million.
• Redevelopment of Terminal 4's international concourse: $194 million.