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Seems like the OP problem is mostly with Wingharts hours as opposed to the city in particular....I thought Winghart was waiting until they had their liquor license before extending hours into the evening, someone correct me I'm wrong...
Downtown Pittsburgh is not going to be a Bustling Nightlife Mecca, until its gets more people living downtown....Not to mention it has to compete with already bustling city neighborhood already filled with Nightlife....It's a work in progress people.
And no downtown success doesn't hinder on Suburbanites having Free Parking to come downtown...Parking is not the issue, people will pay to park if theirs something to drawl them downtown that they can't get anywhere else....Parking be damn. That's what downtown needs to get more nightlife, things/experiences that one can't find anywhere but downtown.
Yeah, but the liquor license is a go now for Wingharts, the booze has arrived. So not sure what's up with the Saturday, or any other day late. Dunno. I get mine at lunch.
It certainly sounds as if it's time for certain Market Square establishments to re-evaluate their hours, though, epicenter of off-hours stuff or not. But it's true that those couple of places are not indicative of dining downtown as a whole. They are only indicative of those establishments, and there's quite some variation as far as that goes. There will always be places that have hours that don't work out for us. I'm frustrated at a particular suburban shop in Wexford that closes at 6 on weekday nights, every weekday night. That doesn't make sense to me; I think it would make more sense to open later and close later, or at least, as is the tradition for some shops, be open late one night a week. But whatever. The proprietors can set whatever hours make the most sense for them. Ultimately I don't begrudge them that. I either go anyway within their hours if that's what I want, or I shop/dine elsewhere.
Seems like the OP problem is mostly with Wingharts hours as opposed to the city in particular....I thought Winghart was waiting until they had their liquor license before extending hours into the evening, someone correct me I'm wrong...
Downtown Pittsburgh is not going to be a Bustling Nightlife Mecca, until its gets more people living downtown....Not to mention it has to compete with already bustling city neighborhood already filled with Nightlife....It's a work in progress people.
And no downtown success doesn't hinder on Suburbanites having Free Parking to come downtown...Parking is not the issue, people will pay to park if theirs something to drawl them downtown that they can't get anywhere else....Parking be damn. That's what downtown needs to get more nightlife, things/experiences that one can't find anywhere but downtown.
you can' t compete when you're closed. the whole point of market sq's new look is for it to open for people like nuwaver. it's possible they need to hire someone else and given how recent their liquor license is it may take a few more weeks.
you can' t compete when you're closed. the whole point of market sq's new look is for it to open for people like nuwaver. it's possible they need to hire someone else and given how recent their liquor license is it may take a few more weeks.
Ok but that's Wingharts specific rant its not like his rant applies to all establishments within MSQ. Can't say oh "MSQ is a failure because this one establishment is late to the game" Next time one of you guys are in Wingharts you need to ask management when are they going to have later weekend hours, seems like enough regulars on here go in there quite often shouldn't be that hard.
I would like to see this too, but until more people actually live downtown instead of just commute in Monday-Friday we'll continue to see a trend of places only open during the week and when events are happening (Pirates are away this weekend, for instance). Downtown needs a critical mass of residents and then we'll see a more vibrant off-weekend atmosphere there.
Enough with the catch-phrases, I realize this is the go-to excuse for downtown closing early, but the OP did mention that there were tons of people trying to get into these restaurants and were disappointed to find out that they were closing early.
Not to mention that the city seems intent on chasing away any and all evening patrons with this ridiculous parking ticket fiasco, this is completely unacceptable for a city this size that is currently trying to have a rebirth.
I don't really see parking cost as being a big factor in dining downtown. You can easily park in most lots and garages for a $5 flat rate after five. Most of the downtown places open at night are fairly pricy so $5 isn't a much compared to dropping $100 for dinner at Meat and Potatoes or Nola.
I know we have talked ad nauseum on these pages about how Downtown restaurants need to stay open later on both evenings and weekends. I fully expect someone who either may or may not have owned a restaurant suggest that it makes no financial sense from a restaurant owners standpoint to do so, blah blah blah. That is with all due respect.
I headed to Market Square yesterday for dinner. I was dying for a burger and a beer. I headed to Wingharts. They had already put the stools up and were cleaning up by 5:15 pm. I decided upon Moe's. They were cleaning up also. There were literally dozens of people trying to get into these places. Some commented "Closed at 5pm?! It' not even dinner time yet" These businesses are losing a lot of money. Not to mention that it is a major turnoff and bad PR for the city. I decided upon Las Velas, where I had a great meal. I came out around 7:30 pm and found a $55.00 parking ticket on my windshield and noticed everbody esle on the square did too, despite blocking no fire hydrants or intertsections, and no parking meters, just vague signage. Anyway, the ticket was my fault. I just think that maybe the restaurants and the city itself could be a bit more visitor friendly on a Saturday Night if they want to attract visitors who spend money. There is a demand to stay open. Maybe some of the young professionals who will be in over their heads when they rent these new $1,000 plus per month apts. will find the need to turn tables a few nights a week to help staff the new demand. The time to change is upon us.
Here's the deal (and this is coming from someone who works in that industry):
Restaurant owners are NOTORIOUSLY greedy. If the demand exists on a regular basis, they will be open. Holidays? Open. Natural Disaster? Open. Bomb Threat? Open. If the potential to make money is there they are going to take a shot at it. If you walk in at 10 minutes until closing time
(like an a-hole) odds are they are going to keep their staff there for however long it takes to serve you. However one night of sporadically increased business does not justify staying open later on the odd chance that maybe this will be that one night of the month when people come pouring in after closing time. If they are closing early its because the demand doesn't exist, and your visit was the exception to that rule. If/When there are enough people downtown eating later on a consistent basis you will see different places staying open later, but not until.
If they are closing early its because the demand doesn't exist, and your visit was the exception to that rule.
The demand doesn't exist because people assume nothing will be open. That perception needs to change, but the only way it will change is if some pioneer restaurants remain open (which I think is already happening).
9% unemployment means, by definition, 91% employment (yes, U3 vs. U6 notwithstanding). A lot of young professionals are doing just fine.
Sometimes I think people in Pittsburgh are in denial about the recession, or just about how bad things are. I think things are doing okay in Pittsburgh, especially compared to decades past, so that may be lulling people into a false sense of security. I'm not trying to be gloomy, but things are pretty bad out there. Yes, we have jobs here, for now, but how do you have job security when the nation is so messed up?
I know a lot of people my age, and the majority of them have degrees and were unable to find jobs in their fields after graduating. And they have student loans to pay, too. Most of them are living with their parents! I was lucky enough to find a job in my field, but it doesn't pay a lot (although I do perfectly well on it). There won't be any $1000 lofts in my future, though. Usually, people are surprised to learn that I do not live at home or with roommates. That seems to be the norm for young professionals in their mid-20s in Pittsburgh.
Some commentary from someone else who has pretty much given up on patronizing Downtown establishments after dark:
1.) I can live with the extended parking meter enforcement hours and the higher hourly rates. With that being said I'm one of many I know who are NOT able to keep throwing 12 quarters per hour into a parking meter while I frolic. Want to park on-street for two hours Downtown? That will be 24 quarters, please! Pony up! If suburbs like Mt. Lebanon can have modernized parking meters that accept credit/debit cards so you can just swipe your card, indicate how much money/how much time you'd like to charge, and then be on your merry way, then why can't Pittsburgh? Parking citations add up. Trust me, this morning I paid my fifth $30 parking fine since moving here. $150 when you're on a very limited budget is a tough pill to swallow when I could just as easily drive to Ross Township, Homestead, or other suburban areas, park in a parking lot for free, and have just as enjoyable of a time.
2.) During the Three Rivers Art Festival I was only off work on a Sunday and decided to take my better half along to scope it out, especially for the free Pittsburgh Symphony Orchestra concert. Not only was the festival going on, but there was also a Pirates vs. Phillies game going on, and there were tens of thousands of people roaming the streets Downtown. If I'm not mistaken PrideFest events were also getting underway. With all of those events occurring simultaneously one would THINK you'd have plenty of dining options, correct? WRONG! We wanted to try NOLA. It was closed. We wanted to try Winghart's. It was closed. Several other nearby restaurants we wanted to try were also closed while the few that were open---Primanti Brothers (yuck), Moe's (meh), Oyster House (my partner hates even being NEAR seafood) didn't appeal to us. We ended up getting Subway. We were VERY disappointed. Since that terrible experience I've had no desire to ever return Downtown on my days off from work and instead scope out either East End neighborhood business districts or suburban areas. Downtown has to do something to win us back over. So far it hasn't.
3.) Housing options Downtown are still MUCH too limited. There are some extremely expensive (i.e. seven-figure) condos available right near Market Square. There is probably a condo or two available at Gateway Towers, but that building is so dated-looking and drab that I'd never consider living there. Most Downtown apartment buildings have waiting lists. You can't have that bustling 24/7 Downtown that many envision here in Pittsburgh if developers refuse to bring housing options to the marketplace (and those who are seem to be taking forever). Increase supply to meet the demand, and you'll see housing prices more attainable Downtown for the middle-class. For what it's worth I'm sure there definitely are some well-heeled young professionals in Pittsburgh, but for every one of them I know I know two others who are like me, my partner, and most of my friends---underemployed, nearly broke, and priced out of Downtown.
4.) It's not attractive or pleasant to walk to or from many surrounding neighborhoods of Downtown after dark. From Polish Hill I could commit suicide by walking back up Bigelow Boulevard or I could walk through an eerily-silent and industrial-feeling Strip District. NOT attractive to me. People in Lower Lawrenceville have the same trek. People in the Mexican War Streets would have to walk around Allegheny Commons. Even South Siders would have to walk through Uptown. I suppose you could take the trail along the Allegheny River to or from Millvale, but I don't know how "safe" I'd feel on that alone after dark. That monstrosity called the Civic Arena/Mellon Arena, along with Washington Place, hinders attractive pedestrian connectivity between the Hill District and Downtown. Downtown is near a lot of neighborhoods, yet it still feels isolated from them.
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If suburbs like Mt. Lebanon can have modernized parking meters that accept credit/debit cards so you can just swipe your card, indicate how much money/how much time you'd like to charge, and then be on your merry way, then why can't Pittsburgh? Parking citations add up. Trust me, this morning I paid my fifth $30 parking fine since moving here. $150 when you're on a very limited budget is a tough pill to swallow when I could just as easily drive to Ross Township, Homestead, or other suburban areas, park in a parking lot for free, and have just as enjoyable of a time. 
