Hundreds protest low wages at UPMC (Freedom, Wall: real estate, coupons, 2013)

[I_Like_Spam]

Originally Posted by eschaton

The primary difference between the 1970s versus now regarding labor organizing is employers didn't fight particularly hard against being unionized. They certainly didn't contract with outside "union avoidance" firms they paid millions of dollars to. They seldom threatened to close the workplace, held one-on-one meetings with employees to dissuade them from voting yes, held captive audience meetings where the employer got state its case (including brazen lies) without any union retort, and didn't often fire union activists in the workplace (something which is illegal even today, but the penalties are so weak for 50% of employers do with regularity).

That said, there are some differences between the workplaces of today and the 1970s which were not directly the fault of management. Most notably is the movement away from large centralized workplaces. A successful organizing drive requires some sense by the workers that they are an "us" as opposed to a bunch of isolated individuals. Far less workplaces these days have hundreds of people in them, and many people have jobs which isolate them from most or all of their comrades. Those are sh!itty terms to build solidarity.

I worked at a couple Greentree hotels back in the 70's, and one of them did have managers talk to the workers to inform us that they didn't want a union. As a teenager, if the union was trying to organize, I was unaware of it.

People like me, as a teenager, had no intention of spending years gaining seniority in a union workplace. Didn't intend to stay that long, that's the problem, people aren't anxious about continuing in the same employment for many years nowadays and even if they did, the business doesn't intend to stay there that long either.

The unions best angle nowadays is in the skilled trades, where they can provide employers with qualified staff. For "trades" like hotel housekeepers or kitchen help, almost anyone can be put on the job and get it done.

[Mugatu]

Watched the report on the news about this protest, and like those fast food worker protests a few weeks ago, they claim people are demanding UPMC pay $15/hr for unskilled jobs, like cafeteria workers. Just shut up. Say what you want about UPMC, but in no way does someone shoveling potatoes on a tray deserve a starting wage of $31,000 a year. That's ludicrous. There are entry level professional positions requiring a college degree that don't even pay that. You want a living wage, go better yourself and learn some skills. If UPMC's minimum wage was raised to $15/hour, there would be mass layoffs, so instead of $15/hour you might end up with $0/hour. Good luck with that.

[JimboPGH]

Originally Posted by Mugatu

Watched the report on the news about this protest, and like those fast food worker protests a few weeks ago, they claim people are demanding UPMC pay $15/hr for unskilled jobs, like cafeteria workers. Just shut up. Say what you want about UPMC, but in no way does someone shoveling potatoes on a tray deserve a starting wage of $31,000 a year. That's ludicrous.

CEO's making billions of dollars even when they help run their companies into the ground is ludicrous. It's also terrible for the economy.

Making a living wage, no matter the skill level of the work, should be a basic human right. It's also good for the economy.

[BarqCider]

while I don't like them fully, I think this area needs an HMO like Kaiser permanente out here. then upmc will be fighting another big boy.

[SteelCityRising]

Originally Posted by Mugatu

Watched the report on the news about this protest, and like those fast food worker protests a few weeks ago, they claim people are demanding UPMC pay $15/hr for unskilled jobs, like cafeteria workers. Just shut up. Say what you want about UPMC, but in no way does someone shoveling potatoes on a tray deserve a starting wage of $31,000 a year. That's ludicrous. There are entry level professional positions requiring a college degree that don't even pay that. You want a living wage, go better yourself and learn some skills. If UPMC's minimum wage was raised to $15/hour, there would be mass layoffs, so instead of $15/hour you might end up with $0/hour. Good luck with that.

They also delayed one of my Downtown deliveries this morning while they were busy NOT working and, ironically, complaining about not making enough money. Here's an idea. If UPMC is only paying you $9/hr. and only providing you with the opportunity to work 34 hours per week with limited benefits, then why not pick up a second job? I work the equivalent of two full-time jobs, and I live VERY comfortably by Pittsburgh standards because of them.

[JimboPGH]

Originally Posted by SteelCityRising

They also delayed one of my Downtown deliveries this morning while they were busy NOT working and, ironically, complaining about not making enough money. Here's an idea. If UPMC is only paying you $9/hr. and only providing you with the opportunity to work 34 hours per week with limited benefits, then why not pick up a second job? I work the equivalent of two full-time jobs, and I live VERY comfortably by Pittsburgh standards because of them.

Well good for you bubba, but some people want to have a life outside of work. And a lot of those people have kids to feed.

Nobody should HAVE to work two jobs just to make ends meet. A lot of people made heavy sacrifices in the labor movements of the late 19th and early 20th century to improve the quality of life of the working masses. Some people feel they have little choice but to continue that struggle, and I applaud them.

[Hopes]

Originally Posted by Mugatu

Watched the report on the news about this protest, and like those fast food worker protests a few weeks ago, they claim people are demanding UPMC pay $15/hr for unskilled jobs, like cafeteria workers. Just shut up. Say what you want about UPMC, but in no way does someone shoveling potatoes on a tray deserve a starting wage of $31,000 a year. That's ludicrous. There are entry level professional positions requiring a college degree that don't even pay that. You want a living wage, go better yourself and learn some skills. If UPMC's minimum wage was raised to $15/hour, there would be mass layoffs, so instead of $15/hour you might end up with $0/hour. Good luck with that.

The difference is the person starting in an entry level professional job eventually moves on to earn higher pay. The person shoveling potatoes is making below a living wage even if they've been working for 30 years. Every person in our country deserves a LIVING wage. Those entry level professional workers deserve a living wage too. The more positions start earning living wages, the more likely the entry level professional positions will pay more than living wage.

And if everyone went to college and bettered themselves, who would shovel the potatoes? Then the potato shovelers will make 60k because nobody will do the job because everyone bettered themselves. That's the case for other jobs nobody wants to do. Garbage men average 43k in the US and 60k in CA. Portable toilet cleaners average 50k. Crime scene cleaners average 60k and can make over 100k with a college degree. I could go on and on.

[UKyank]

Originally Posted by JimboPGH

Making a living wage, no matter the skill level of the work, should be a basic human right. It's also good for the economy.

Then what do you do with the people that are making $15/hr now doing a more demanding job? Or does everyone get a pay raise across the board then

[Hopes]

Originally Posted by UKyank

Then what do you do with the people that are making $15/hr now doing a more demanding job? Or does everyone get a pay raise across the board then

That's unlikely to happen automatically since it's UPMC. UPMC only cares about the bottom line. It's not concerned with employee satisfaction or negative publicity. If the job is more demanding, some might decide to move into the easier job now that it pays better. If UPMC has a difficult time finding people who are willing to do the more demanding job for $15/hour, the demanding job's salary range will increase.

Most workers would be surprised what their coworkers earn. There are some non professional positions at corporations that pay more than many of the professional ones.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by Mugatu

Watched the report on the news about this protest, and like those fast food worker protests a few weeks ago, they claim people are demanding UPMC pay $15/hr for unskilled jobs, like cafeteria workers. Just shut up. Say what you want about UPMC, but in no way does someone shoveling potatoes on a tray deserve a starting wage of $31,000 a year. That's ludicrous. There are entry level professional positions requiring a college degree that don't even pay that. You want a living wage, go better yourself and learn some skills. If UPMC's minimum wage was raised to $15/hour, there would be mass layoffs, so instead of $15/hour you might end up with $0/hour. Good luck with that.

Negotiation 101 is you always ask for more than you expect to get. This is true in collective bargaining or individual bargaining. Then gradually both the parties move once good-faith negotiation begins, until they come to something they both find mutually beneficial - or else something they both hate equally.

More specifically, why wouldn't UMPC be able to pay a decent wage? These sort of jobs are not going to be offshored to China. It's unlikely a robot will do many of these jobs within the next decade or two. UMPC has precious little in terms of competition in the region, and labor costs for unskilled workers make up a very small amount of hospital charges, meaning the change to bills will be relatively minor.