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So is this what makes Europe more happy than America? It would be simple if socialism was actually a determinant for happiness, but it isn't.
Most of Europe is far less happy than America, and another nation of wealth and socialism(Japan), is also far less happy than America.
So let us go over the list of happiest OECD(basically 1st world countries) to maybe see a pattern.
10. Belgium = Population 10.7 million
9. Norway = 4.7 million
8. New Zealand = 4.2 million
7. Switzerland = 7.6 million
6. Canada = 33 million
5. Ireland = 4.4 million
4. Sweden = 9.2 million
3. Netherlands = 16.4 million
2. Finland = 5.3 million
1. Denmark = 5.5 million
The large socialist countries of Europe(France, England, Germany) tend to be much less happy than Americans. If you take France as an example and just contrast it with England. France is more wealthy than England, they have much more beautiful land, they work fewer hours a week because of their expansive union membership. France is rated the best healthcare system in the world by the world health organization. Yet, France is generally much much less happy than England. England involves itself in wars across the world with the United States, yet France is generally a pacifist nation. Why would France possibly be less happy than England?
Pretty interesting post but of course the "happiness" indexes cannot be taken as the final say of reality and its helpful to pull in other factors. Germans probably are much less likely to report being "happy!" than say, Americans even if they are. I know that sounds subjective and totally unscientific but I do believe its true. Germans are more likely to report how it is, the good and the bad and not sugarcoat shi#. American's are notorious for reporting "I'm fine" with a smile when they are not. It's a much deeper issue than I am explaining now but there's some truth to it.
There was a report done on overtime hours in 1st world countries and ranks of happiness as well. The US, England and Japan all fell to the bottom. Countries like Germany and France make time for leisure and do not thrive on stress and working themselves to the bone.
Norway, Sweden, Denmark and Finland ALL make it to the top ten list you cite above. Democratic socialism is alive and kickin in at least 3 of those countries. For Americans like myself who often cite "socialism" as a model we appreciate, what we mean is the sort of democratic socialism that is at work in those countries, where capitalism also thrives, but certain societal "needs" are part of a clear socialist system.
As for the other countries in that top ten list, I don't doubt that some of them also have strong strains of socialism in their society. I don't know and I dont feel like doing internet research to prove a point right now. But it's worth a follow up.
Not trying to argue or disprove your theory but I don't think many people automatically associate socialism with happiness anyway. If you look at some of those (or all of them) countries on that top ten list and check out literacy rates, poverty rates, unemployment/employment rates, longevity....I think you could make some ties between certain forms of socialism and the health of a nation.
Happiness comes from an interconnected society that shares common values, so generally the people tend to agree on most things. It is from a society that sees each other as part of a larger family, and the socialist policies aren't as much seen as confiscation of property from one group to another, but rather is seen as a charity to benefit the people of what amounts to your extended family. Your nation, your people.
As a country grows in population, it tends to disconnect, and socialism is seen less and less as helping your extended family, but more as a redistribution of wealth from the people who will work, to the people who won't. And these welfare recipients are not seen as equals, they are seen a faceless group of people that aren't like you. The more people in a society, the more ideas there will be of how things should be run, and the more divisive a country becomes.
If you truly wanted to be like Europe, you would give much more power to the states and not the federal government(or even support secession). If you truly wanted to be more like Europe, you would block the immigration of peoples that are culturally so radically different that their presence will destroy the ties that bind us as one people. If you don't understand this, then I think you should again look at Europe. Do you know what one of the largest issues in Europe is right now? Immigration. The socialist states are collapsing because of immigration. And most European countries that refuse to close immigration entirely are wanting to heavily slow it, why? Because they want to force the people already in their countries to assimilate.
As someone stated before, you cannot have socialism and open-borders.
In response to all of the above: all of this is why programs to assimilate immigrants into the new society need to be multiplied manifold. They need to learn the language of their new country and home. They need to find work and may need help doing so if they are not fluent yet. Controls need to be set in place so that highly educated professionals who are immigrants don't end up cleaning the bus station and that the society also expands with their knowledge and skills. There are many examples of constructive integration going on, but no doubt, it's a hot button issue. Here as well as there.
I'm an internationalist at heart so I tend to sometimes look at immigration issues through another lense, but I'm not blind to the problems and heat with some of the tensions. Veils- for the most part, take them off in Europe, it prevents Muslim women from integrating with their new society. I'm sorry that it might offend the religious sensibilities at first, but societies whether in a diaspora or right in their "homeland" always have growing pains. Language: learn the language of your host country. And, if we are going to test new American citizens on American history, we better be dam* sure that our own natural born citizens know the answers as well. There's a lot of work to be done.
To say Finland is the happiest country in the world is like saying
the morgue is the happiest place in town. Nobody ever complains.
If boredom equals happiness for you then you'll be fine in Finland .
I personally have nothing against Finland though.
I've lived in New Zealand for a few years but I'm much happier in America.
I'd be much happier if the southern border was secured though.
Finnish people are tough and realistic. It's almost fashionable to be somber there. There are a lot of jokes about Finland and it's "darkness" but I think they're doing just fine and truly have an interesting country.
Before you throw out the baby with the bathwater I would say just perhaps TRY to have an open mind and read perspectives that don't only justify your own perspective. MANY Americans who have experienced living, working and paying taxes in Europe would NOT come back to the U.S.A. to approach life and livelihood here. Yes, there has been an immigrant explosion in many parts of Europe. They are going through a major transformation as ALL Countries do at some point in time. The whole place is NOT falling apart. Your alarmist post only makes it sound like you are really only interested in focusing on the negative aspects in the whole picture. The people who know whats going on can see that its not exactly worse than anything else happening anywhere else on Earth.
I sometimes think posters need to just get the heck off the computer and go on a monthlong (or longer preferably) global trek and gain a bit of wisdom and humility.
I don't think the OP is trying to say Europe is a sh*t hole. I agree with him. People say all the time we should be more like Europe. What's so great about Europe that we should want to emulate them? No one who holds this point of view ever really articulates what they mean by this using concrete examples. It's all pie in the sky stuff. Almost to a man, people I have talked to who have lived abroad for awhile appreciate America even more when they return. It seems to be the people who have never been out of the country who think Europe is so great. I would counter that the European worshippers are only interested in focusing on the negative aspects of America and white washing the negative aspects of Europe.
Oh yeah, and on my last paycheck Uncle Sam took 35% of what I took in.
I don't know what current taxation is in some EU countries or Norway, but it's not too far off from 35% per paycheck. Yet, they have UHC, mostly free university education etc. I think for people who look to some aspects of Euro countries as a model, they are looking precisely at the return for their taxation and how things don't often add up here. If you are an American who feels fine with what you are taxed and have no complaints, obviously this does NOT apply to you. We will all never be on the same page with this issue. Just shedding some light on why people bother to compare in the first place.
I don't know what current taxation is in some EU countries or Norway, but it's not too far off from 35% per paycheck. Yet, they have UHC, mostly free university education etc. I think for people who look to some aspects of Euro countries as a model, they are looking precisely at the return for their taxation and how things don't often add up here. If you are an American who feels fine with what you are taxed and have no complaints, obviously this does NOT apply to you. We will all never be on the same page with this issue. Just shedding some light on why people bother to compare in the first place.
Yes, they have universal coverage but do they get care equal to ours?
Finnish people are tough and realistic. It's almost fashionable to be somber there. There are a lot of jokes about Finland and it's "darkness" but I think they're doing just fine and truly have an interesting country.
See you are talking about culture now. We are different and that's okay.
The other Scandinavian countries are also on the happiest countries list. Sweden, Norway, and Denmark. I am not sure how much more fun those countries are, but supposedly the Swedish city of Malmo has become the destination for immigration, and now it is becoming more and more filled full of drama and excitement. But I can't say that that kind of "excitement" would make me happy.
Looks like fun
I know Malmo very well and these youtube videos are a joke. Fox news, or whoever made them, clearly chose one of the "craziest" days in the last couple of decades on the streets of Malmo to make this footage.
On the up side, there are a lot of "real" Swedes who are working with helping immigrants get adjusted and actually love a lot of what the immigrants bring to society. Yes, there are a lot of problems with the influx of foreigners. Obviously. To point them out with alarmist fear is kind of silly though. Especially as Americans!!! We have never been a culturally homogeneous society! For Americans to be freaking out that immigrants are settling in European countries is ABSURD!
I don't think the OP is trying to say Europe is a sh*t hole. I agree with him. People say all the time we should be more like Europe. What's so great about Europe that we should want to emulate them? No one who holds this point of view ever really articulates what they mean by this using concrete examples. It's all pie in the sky stuff. Almost to a man, people I have talked to who have lived abroad for awhile appreciate America even more when they return. It seems to be the people who have never been out of the country who think Europe is so great. I would counter that the European worshippers are only interested in focusing on the negative aspects of America and white washing the negative aspects of Europe.
Sorry, but not true.
First, what people find so great about Europe? Take a couple of mintues and read through the thread. Because it is not "pie in the sky stuff" and several posters have stated quite clearly aspects of society in various Euro countries that they appreciate.
It might seem to be people who have never been out of the country who think Europe is great. I'm sure there are lots of idiots who think about all the "free stuff" in Europe and wish we had it here too. But really, I think a lot of posters on this forum have some clout in having lived, worked or travelled to these countries. I have lived, worked and studied in some of these countries and have family there and here. I do not worship Europe but I do know what I'm talking about.
Don't assume all posters are idiots and maybe take a moment to read what people are actually saying.
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