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Old 09-17-2010, 09:54 AM
 
344 posts, read 199,376 times
Reputation: 46

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1) Our current taxes are lopsided.
Ezra Klein - The Bush tax plan vs. the Obama tax plan in one chart

2) We are in a recession. Tax cuts for the wealthy don't stimulate growth. They tend to not use the money in ways that stimulate the economy. Middle income earners are more likely to spend on retail goods and thus stimulate the economy.

3) It's not about failed communism plots, or whatever illogical notion has been proposed. The sheer fact of the matter is that the tax cuts will result in another $700 billion to the deficit. So we would be adding a non-stimulative measure to the deficit.

4) Most people making over $250k a year aren't small business owners. Thus the argument of helping small business is flawed. If they were, the tax cuts wouldn't influence them to hire more people. If this were the case, then why didn't that occur in 2009? Consumer confidence was slightly higher, the economy was slightly stronger (growth occurred in Q4 stronger than the latest figures). Yet, there was no hiring.

Again, it's simply a matter of balancing the budget and trying to keep our nation on track.
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Old 09-17-2010, 12:59 PM
 
Location: Long Island (chief in S Farmingdale)
22,180 posts, read 19,449,121 times
Reputation: 5297
Quote:
Originally Posted by workingclasshero View Post
yes the MEDIAN income is 70k...that means 50% of the households make MORE than 70k

the average 'class a' mechanic at a dealership makes at least 70k...and a mechanic is WORKINGCLASS, which is BELOW middleclass

even back when clinton was potus (nearly 20 years ago) they classified middleclass as 60-200k....and that was 20 years ago
And when you get into the $250,000 range is FAR FAR FAR less then that.
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Old 09-17-2010, 02:15 PM
 
Location: Bradenton, Florida
27,232 posts, read 46,639,854 times
Reputation: 11084
Quote:
Originally Posted by workingclasshero View Post
yes the MEDIAN income is 70k...that means 50% of the households make MORE than 70k

the average 'class a' mechanic at a dealership makes at least 70k...and a mechanic is WORKINGCLASS, which is BELOW middleclass

even back when clinton was potus (nearly 20 years ago) they classified middleclass as 60-200k....and that was 20 years ago
I wonder what the MEAN income is...that would actually be a more useful measure.
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Old 09-17-2010, 02:25 PM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,442,711 times
Reputation: 27720
Now that the tax cuts have been rebranded into the "Obama tax cuts" wouldn't you want all Americans to benefit from Obama's hard work ?
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Old 09-17-2010, 02:27 PM
 
5,747 posts, read 12,048,379 times
Reputation: 4511
Quote:
Originally Posted by TKramar View Post
I wonder what the MEAN income is...that would actually be a more useful measure.
The most revealing information is the relationship between the two.
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Old 09-17-2010, 02:43 PM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,442,711 times
Reputation: 27720
Quote:
Originally Posted by formercalifornian View Post
The most revealing information is the relationship between the two.
The "mean" is the "average" you're used to, where you add up all the numbers and then divide by the number of numbers.

The "median" is the "middle" value in the list of numbers


Take the numbers: 1,2,3,4,5

median: 3
mean: 7.5


Big difference in those numbers..eh ?


I found 2008 data
median income: $50K
mean income: $68K

Average Income in the United States Will Continue to Drop in 2009

I tried to look for "mean" data on the .gov sites but can't seem to find it..plenty of "median" data though.
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Old 09-17-2010, 02:51 PM
 
5,747 posts, read 12,048,379 times
Reputation: 4511
Yes, I understand how it works.

I was also looking for more recent data, but I didn't see anything from 2009 either. Probably not available yet.

The data from 2008 would make for an interesting distribution curve.
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Old 09-17-2010, 02:58 PM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,442,711 times
Reputation: 27720
Quote:
Originally Posted by formercalifornian View Post
Yes, I understand how it works.

I was also looking for more recent data, but I didn't see anything from 2009 either. Probably not available yet.

The data from 2008 would make for an interesting distribution curve.
That article I posted was actually quite interesting..says mean/median income has been dropping each year..not just during this recession.
The highest mean income was in 2000 $71.5K.

Looks like we're all moving in that downward path.
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Old 09-17-2010, 04:03 PM
 
Location: THE USA
3,257 posts, read 6,126,073 times
Reputation: 1998
Quote:
Originally Posted by miyu View Post
Yea, and watch the wealthy reduce their workload to below 250k levels, establish the rest as part of a non-profit organization, move overseas while working remotely, fire all their <250k employees, and live off their savings. Then who will be crying? HA HA HA
What Employees? THEY ARE NOT BUSINESS OWNERS. THIS IS PERSONAL INCOME WE ARE TALKING ABOUT. You make absolutely no sense.

Good God, don't you people know the difference???

If they WERE Business owners, they would be able to get OUT of the tax bracket by reinvesting the profits they would be taking home, back into their companies.

Why would a company care what taxes their EMPLOYEES have to pay? Yeah, they don't.
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Old 09-17-2010, 04:06 PM
 
2,017 posts, read 5,636,720 times
Reputation: 1680
Quote:
Originally Posted by slackjaw View Post
What does someone take home monthly who makes $250k? Their gross is about $21k/month there net must be at least $13k per month.

Sorry I can't imagine anywhere (including NYC) where taking home that much isn't doing really well. Hell you could drop $5k/month on rent and still have $8k to throw around.

Generally no.

For someone who lives in NYC and has 0 withholdings on all taxes, puts aside 10% in their 401k and pays about 100.00 a month for dental and medical insurance through their employer-- they would pull in approximately 10,192.00 a month.

Most folks with that as a salary tend to go ahead and put in additional withholdings for their state income tax and federal. Most of them also put aside more than 10% in their 401k and some even pay higher premiums for health and dental insurance based on their salaries.
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