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View Poll Results: Do you support Quebec's independence?
I'm Québécois and I support independence 4 8.89%
I'm Québécois and I'm against independence 1 2.22%
I'm Québécois and I'm neutral 1 2.22%
I'm Canadian and I support independence 0 0%
I'm Canadian and I'm against independence 3 6.67%
I'm Canadian and I'm neutral 1 2.22%
I'm neither and I support independence 12 26.67%
I'm neither and I'm against independence 12 26.67%
I'm neither and I'm neutral 11 24.44%
Voters: 45. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 05-31-2011, 09:20 PM
 
19 posts, read 22,255 times
Reputation: 22

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Most of you have probably heard about Quebec nationalism at some point in your life, even if you aren't Canadian. This is the first thread of a collection of threads I will post at some point in the future regarding separatist movements around the world. So, I have spent quite some time researching the Quebec independence movement, as well as other movements. Canada has had several referendums asking the people if they think Quebec should become independent, and every time the majority of the people have said no. Personally I am against the independence movement, since the facts simply don't support Quebec's movement, and they wouldn't be self-sufficient. I do however recognize that the culture of Quebec is different from that of the rest of Canada.


Arguments for Independence
* In Quebec the official language is French, whereas the rest of Canada speaks English
* The goals and policies of the rest of Canada do not necessarily always align with those of Quebec
* Quebec's French culture is dying and arguably without independence or autonomy, it will eventually become like the rest of Canada
* Many separatists in Quebec feel as though the Canadian government didn't live up to it's promise for a new constitution in 1970
* Some websites recognize Quebec's distinct cultural differences from Canada, such as how Yahoo! has both Canadian and Quebecker Yahoo! Answers websites

Arguments Against Independence
* Quebec already maintains a degree of autonomy as a province of Canada
* The French language is dying out in Quebec and being replaced with English
* The withdrawal of Quebec from Canada could significantly hinder Canada's political, economic, and military strength
* The majority of the population of Quebec don't support independence or autonomy
* Terrorism committed by pro-independence guerrilla factions drives people away from supporting Quebec sovereignty
* If Quebec became independent, it would create a barrier in the middle of Canada, separating Eastern Canada and Western Canada
* It is questionable whether or not Quebec could be economically self-sufficient without the aid of Canada
* Quebec has no pre-existing constitution or framework for government
* Quebec is made up of many different ethnic groups, and an independent French-speaking Quebec could easily abuse minorities
* Historically speaking, the former French government of Quebec often ignored, suppressed, and mistreated the aboriginal population
* Many of the leaders of the separatist movement are discriminatory against the aboriginal population, including the former leader of Quebec, Robert Bourassa
* Many aboriginal tribes in Canada have expressed concerns regarding Quebec sovereignty, and some have even threatened to leave the confederacy
* The ideas on how an independent Quebec should be governed are very different, with many different parties and organizations, each with different ideological idea on what the future of Quebec should be. Many of the groups are far-left communist groups, while others are center-right and far right..


General Information
Proposed State: Quebec
Proposed Capital: Quebec City
Today Part of: Canada (Quebec)
Government: various
Population: 7,970,672 (5.63 /km2 density)
Land: 1,365,128 km2 land + 176,928 km2 water
GDP: C$303,747 billion (C$37,278 per capita)
Language: French
Culture: Canadian, French
Religion: Catholic
Denonym: Québécois, Quebecers/Quebeckers

Political Parties
Parti Québécois
Bloc Québécois
Action démocratique du Québec
Québec solidaire
Parti république du Québec (defunct)
Parti républicain du Québec (defunct)
Parti nationaliste du Québec (defunct)
Ralliement national (defunct)
Mouvement Souveraineté-Association (defunct)
Parti indépendantiste (defunct)
Parti indépendantiste of 1985 (defunct)
Parti canadien (defunct)
Parti canadien of 1942 (defunct)

Paramilitary Organizations
Mouvement de libération nationale du Québec
Société des Fils de la Liberté (defunct)
Front de libération du Québec (defunct)
Frères chasseurs (defunct)

Other Organizations
Les Intellectuels pour la souveraineté
Réseau de Résistance du Québécois
Mouvement national des Québécoises et des Québécois
Saint-Jean-Baptiste Society
Alliance laurentienne (defunct)


Links
Quebec - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Quebec sovereignty movement - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
History of the Quebec sovereignty movement - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Quebec nationalism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Quebec autonomism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Flag


Coat of Arms


Map
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Old 05-31-2011, 10:02 PM
 
2,095 posts, read 2,469,453 times
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Quebec should secede from Canada and then petition to become a state in the United States.

Annexation.ca
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Old 05-31-2011, 11:51 PM
 
Location: Ohio
23,458 posts, read 17,439,054 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Transhumanist View Post
Most of you have probably heard about Quebec nationalism at some point in your life, even if you aren't Canadian.
Yeah, they're terrorists, gag me with a fork. The US didn't blink an eye when the Czechs and Slovaks parted ways, or when the Pakistanis and Indians parted ways, or when the Slovenes, Croats, Macedonians and Serbs split up.

There is no possible argument that could be constructed to deny independence to Quebec.

The US should get on board, but there's no oil or oil pipelines involved, so I guess they won't.
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Old 06-01-2011, 12:19 AM
 
13,183 posts, read 14,372,231 times
Reputation: 4547
I did hear the separatist party in Quebec was wiped put in the last election. First time in it's existence.

The Bloc Québécois, which had always won at least a majority of seats in Quebec in every election of their existence, lost nearly all their seats, and thus also their official party status, including the seat of their leader Gilles Duceppe.
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Old 06-01-2011, 12:23 AM
 
Location: Near Manito
20,170 posts, read 23,268,256 times
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They're le toast.
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Old 06-01-2011, 12:29 AM
 
Location: Earth
17,443 posts, read 27,073,398 times
Reputation: 7439
Quote:
Originally Posted by padcrasher View Post
I did hear the separatist party in Quebec was wiped put in the last election. First time in it's existence.

The Bloc Québécois, which had always won at least a majority of seats in Quebec in every election of their existence, lost nearly all their seats, and thus also their official party status, including the seat of their leader Gilles Duceppe.
In the parliamentary elections.
The provincial elections are in 2012. We will then see whether Quebecois nationalism is a spent force.
Another argument against Quebecois separatism/nationalism: it has nothing to offer for the large Anglophone population of Montreal, and is exclusionary. The New Democratic Party, which made most of its gains in Quebec at the expense of the Bloc and the Liberals, is inclusive and seeks to represent all Canadians, not just francophones.
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Old 06-01-2011, 12:30 AM
 
Location: Earth
17,443 posts, read 27,073,398 times
Reputation: 7439
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bostonian123 View Post
Quebec should secede from Canada and then petition to become a state in the United States.

Annexation.ca
IIRC Pat Buchanan supported Quebec secession so that Quebec could become a US state and thus the US would get more white Catholics.
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Old 06-01-2011, 12:33 AM
 
Location: Near Manito
20,170 posts, read 23,268,256 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by majoun View Post
IIRC Pat Buchanan supported Quebec secession so that Quebec could become a US state and thus the US would get more white Catholics.
Not to mention poutines.....

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Old 06-01-2011, 06:13 AM
 
4,454 posts, read 6,583,648 times
Reputation: 2256
Well if it aint broke then dont fix it.
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Old 06-01-2011, 07:01 AM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,546 posts, read 23,076,656 times
Reputation: 9552
Quote:
Originally Posted by Transhumanist View Post
...

This is the first thread of a collection of threads I will post at some point in the future regarding separatist movements around the world.

...
Gee, a separate thread for each separatist movement?

Since I don't like the French language anyway, I don't care about Quebec. It is the only province I would never move to if I were to move to Canada.

If someone there feels like their local culture is oh so great, they can maintain it. As far as I know, nobody forces anyone to speak English or pretend to live in B.C. or anything.

I only support separatist movements when there is oppression involved. Otherwise it is just a very costly expression of nationalism.

Canada is becoming more and more like the US, not just in terms of language. That is a trend that no separatist movement will stop.

Last edited by Neuling; 06-01-2011 at 07:17 AM..
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