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Once a woman has made the decision to have a baby yes she is responsible for supporting the child. Morally and legally. If she can't do so LIKE THE MAN WHO FATHERS THE CHILD (tatoo this point on your forehead if you have to) she can get access to government programs designed to make sure the baby is fed and sheltered.
If I were to leave my husband tomorrow I would not be allowed to refuse to pay child support for our children to my husband just because I am female. You do understand this fact, right?
That's called a civil society. Your idiotic notion that a man should be able to legally declare himself not responsible for his own children financially is just that: an idiotic notion.
No one is forcing her to have the baby. She has the choice to get an abortion. If she has the baby and ends up financially responsible, she can't complain, because it's her choice.
Besides, even if she has the baby, she can opt out of responsibility through adoption or baby safe haven.
You keep beating around the bush and you don't admit that the woman has plenty of chances to opt out of responsibility.
If a man does not want to pay child support he can make sure his sperm stays put. A woman's ability to have an abortion does not make the man any less responsible for that fact.
You're repeating yourself in this thread because you make no sense and you refuse to admit this. Deposit your sperm in a woman's uterus and it is not yours to control anymore. You can yell all you want otherwise but you still can't overcome that basic biological fact.
How about if a woman doesn't want to pay for a baby, she makes sure her hymen stays intact?
But no, you would never agree with that logic. You think the female should have all the sex she wants while the male stays celibate if he doesn't want kids.
Allowing women the right to abortion is allowing her to control her own body. It is not just about freeing a woman from a financial obligation. Men don't have that right because men don't get pregnant. Unless you've been pregnant you cannot possibly understand how difficult pregnancy is. Men don't get an abortion because they don't get pregnant. Having actually been pregnant twice I say they ought to be very grateful for that fact.
If you don't want to risk supporting offspring don't have babies with a woman who does not agree with you. I am amazed that some people feel comfortable yelping that a poor woman should think about fifty two times before considering a baby but a poor man should get to father offspring, sign a piece of paper and just walk away.
Talk about unfairness!
If pregnancy is so difficult, then the woman should get an abortion.
A woman can get an abortion, put the baby up for adoption, or bring the baby to a safe haven. And under the proposed law, none of that will change. But you have the nerve to complain it's unfair that the proposed law would give options to men too.
And you have said in other threads that your family is wealthy.
You honestly think that is the norm in this country?
Really?
No, it's not the norm to be wealthy.
But my dad didn't start out wealthy. He wasn't wealthy when I was born. But he's wealthy now.
If my dad can get where he's at today through hard work, a female can too.
It's all about what you want and what your work ethic is like. I'm too lazy to make as much money as my dad and I don't need as much money as him since I'm never having kids. But if a woman has a strong work ethic and she's determined to give her kids a good life, she can be successful. Maybe she'll never get rich, but she can at least work her way up to the point where she can afford kids without help from a male.
Why is it ok for a woman to sit around collecting welfare, but it's not okay for a male to opt out of paying child support?
Why should the dad work just so he can surrender half his salary, while a female can sit around doing nothing and collect money from the taxpayers and the dad?
You like to argue that women are equal, if not superior, to men. But now you're assuming a woman won't make much money. As another poster said, it's being sexist against your own gender to make an assumption like that.
Men will pay CS because we have deemed it correct and fair. It won't change. Biology won't change. Human sexuality won't change (never has). Theories and debate are fun, and sometimes the only thing people have going on, but it will never ever change what is.
I support keeping CS up to date and workable, not to break anyone financially (unless they act irresponsibly and there is no choice) or drive them to murder (omg I know! Right Choc??) But beyond that guys....your dick is your downfall. Get a grip on that, understand what pregnancy means to you, and adjust your behavior accordingly. It's really simple. There are no laws we can pass to make things equal when it comes to birthing children. Men who think so are pussys.
So you don't want to break anyone financially?
Do you realize child support breaks men financially?
Saying you're for child support but also saying you don't want to break anyone financially is contradictory.
So you admit that rights are not equal for both genders? But you think men are ******* if they want equal rights? What's wrong with men wanting equal rights? Why is a man a ***** if he doesn't want to pay 18 years of child support for a baby he never wanted?
You do realize that in the not so distant past, men had more rights than women. If you think rights are not supposed to be equal, do you think we should go back to those days? Oh wait, you only support unequal rights when the women gets the bigger slice of the pie.
2. Do away with welfare and child support for single mothers. This goes along with the point another poster made that not all single mothers are poor. If women knew there would be no safety net, they would be more careful when it comes to sex/having babies. And they would be more careful if they knew they don't have the male to fall back on. And people can't complain that it costs the taxpayers money, because it doesn't. In fact, the taxpayers would save money if we did away with child support and welfare for single mothers.
So, what about the women who aren't more careful and have babies they cannot support anyway?
Are you suggesting that the government simply allow these children to literally starve, beg on the streets for food?
Are you suggesting that the government be allowed to forcibly take these children and adopt them out because the mother doesn't have the money to feed them?
What do we do with the children if the safety nets are removed? Because, believe me.....there will still be children.
So, what about the women who aren't more careful and have babies they cannot support anyway?
Are you suggesting that the government simply allow these children to literally starve, beg on the streets for food?
Are you suggesting that the government be allowed to forcibly take these children and adopt them out because the mother doesn't have the money to feed them?
What do we do with the children if the safety nets are removed? Because, believe me.....there will still be children.
In any other aspect of life, people say if you can't afford something then you can't have it. Why are you making an exception for babies?
There are too many variable for the opt out to work.First abortion would have to be legal on the federal level with no restrictions or requirements or opposition from the states. Is it Oklahoma that is now requiring women to have and view an ultrasound before abortion? And some states require a counseling session and waiting period. These things the man would also have to do as well I would require to be present at the abortion.Often nearly a month can go by before pregnancy is detected giving roughly 2 months to notify the father, get an appointment to confirm the pregnancy, a DNA test and an appt. for an abortion and file court documents. There will be cases claiming there was not sufficient time to opt out.A determination will have to be made regarding relationship. Is this opt out available for married couples. What if the 2 were living together, in a LTR. Was there an expectation of pregnancy within the relationship. It will be he said she said. What if the father opts out and later wants parental rights. If a father can opt out of responsibility of the actual child, then can the mother decide she dosent want support and disallow parental rights of the father if she dosent want him in the child’s life. How will that affect fathers rights in situations where the father does want a role in the childs life. Conflicts.It is much easier on the court to leave it as is and make exceptions for special cases. And that is why men have no say.
You know whats really tiring?
Women that behave as if because they had no major problems during pregnancy, no one else should have any either, and cast aspersions at women that have reproductive difficulties, accusing them of "making too much of it".
Thats really grating on the nerves.
Hmmmm...so if I say pregnancy is not a miserable state of being, I'm wrong and passing judgment.
But women can say "pregnancy is a nightmare" "Hell", etc and that's okay?
All I'm pointing out is that the picture painted of pregnancy as hell is NOT accurate. Yes, it is for some women...but it's also NOT for many more. Why not have both sides of the coin?
I've known women who've had tough pregnancies, premature births, etc.....and guess what? They had more children.
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