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I didn't mention gays, you did.. but thanks for assuming you knew what I meant..
offering bonuses is nothing new, you can also get them for working as a nurse, car salesman or telemarketer in my city..
the military will never bend on weight standards. I personally hated the weight standard program more than pretty much anything, but it's there and never going to bend.. I have a friend right now that's trying to get back in standards so she can go back active. She had some medical problems and they won't let her back until she is within standards. Any "reporter" claiming that one is quite ignorant..
The rest of the stuff is not really breaking news. The military constantly adjusts to fluctuating recruiting needs. I was a linguist and had a big reenlistment bonus a while ago for one of my languages. That same language field is now forcing people to either change languages or get a new job because they no longer need them.. This is how the military has been since I've worked with them and I don't see it changing anytime soon.
and waivers for medical/alcohol/drugs? yeah right. I have no idea where they got that story from, but it's complete BS.
rd2007: your post appears at the top of a new page and it's hard to tell who you're responding to. Obviously not to me, and I was the last person to post before.
This question seems to have been glossed over but I think you nailed a very important issue --- modern warfare has rendered the individual soldier less "meaningful" in some ways. Soldiers are humans and humans want to do something to contribute, they want to see results.
I spoke with an Iraq war soldier who was on leave last year and he told me that the biggest problem they're having (as American soldiers) is with the rules of engagement. He literally had to sit and watch a truck full of known enemy combatants as they drove by because they were under orders not to engage in any combat that was outside their extremely narrow assignment. So, they could have taken out these terrorist combatants right there, but if they had done so they'd have been punished. I cannot imagine fighting under such conditions. Our politicians have tied the hands of our military. This type of lunacy seems to date back to the Vietnam War era and resulted in a prolonged war that saw far more deaths than were needed. Either give them the ability to win the war or don't fight it in the first place.
These words are coming from someone who is ignorant about the military so I welcome an informed critique of my comments.
That is extremely annoying and something I've never understood.
I think it is because people are afraid to be responsible for mistakes. Mistakes are currently tried in the media and guilt has been established long before an actual investigation or hearing. This should never be allowed and the leadership needs to do something about it.
I love the military to death, but there is no way I'll ever say they are perfect. You brought up a great example of something that is definitely broke and has been for a long time..
I personally think war should go back to being dirty and ugly, and hidden...
of course, I didn't actually mean the clinton years were bad enough to kill yourself over.. I personally don't think anything is worth that and anyone that does it probably didn't belong in the gene pool anyhow.. It's like the slowest/weakest emu when the lion's looking for dinner..
that may be harsh, but it's life. We all go through tough times and 99.9999% of us make it through.
I agree that the Clinton years were not strong for the military. The thread is about suicide though. I can't imagine doing that either. My point is that for someone with that possibility, being in Iraq right now is the thing most likely to have them do it in the past 26 years.
rd2007: your post appears at the top of a new page and it's hard to tell who you're responding to. Obviously not to me, and I was the last person to post before.
sorry about that and I fixed it
IRT= in reference to (for anyone that doesn't speak acronymese)
Why are our soldiers getting their hands tied? This is because our soldiers are not fighting a war, despite all the propaganda that they are. They are being asked to be police in a combat zone. So they are thrown in the middle of civilians, half of them insurgents, the other half innocent. If they kill them they are killing some innocent people and this will just recruit more bad guys, if they let them go they can be attacked later by the insurgents. They can't win. A political solution is required, not a military one. And the Iraqi politicians are not in any rush. Why should they be, our guys are out there risking and giving their lives to hold it all together. Only by giving them firm dates that we are going to move out will they maybe get off their rears and sit down together to agree on something. Bush won't do that because it would be admitting he screwed up. So here we all are, stuck and watching it live.
(And can I add, if you think our military is stronger today than it was when Bush took over, that is just wrong.)
I agree that the Clinton years were not strong for the military. The thread is about suicide though.
Without saying ANYTHING about Clinton and the military, my general feeling is that the way in which the military functions as a system has everything to do with suicide rates, and the commander-in-chief has some influence over the way the military functions, so they're not separate topics.
rd2007: Your comments are probably about as concise and accurate as you can be on this topic when you said the following: "...people are afraid to be responsible for mistakes. Mistakes are currently tried in the media and guilt has been established long before an actual investigation or hearing."
So true --- media trials are all the rage, and the fear of being responsible for mistakes is a downfall of all bureaucracies including those of private businesses, schools, labor unions, government, and any other hierarchical system comprised of human beings. Is there a way to escape this problem? You suggested one possibility: get down and dirty and stop making everything public with sugar-coating and daisies and smiley-faces. War isn't pretty.
I agree that the Clinton years were not strong for the military. The thread is about suicide though. I can't imagine doing that either. My point is that for someone with that possibility, being in Iraq right now is the thing most likely to have them do it in the past 26 years.
I'm not really qualified to comment on the suicide aspect and unfortunately more people don't follow that..
The article basically blamed the suicides on failed marriages/relationships and mentioned that 1/3 of the Army suicides were in Iraq and Afghanistan.. I don't have exact numbers, but 1/3 of USA troops being in Afghan or Iraq seems to be about right, so it would make sense that 1/3 of suicides happened where the people were located. Just like the other 2/3 happened somewhere else..
I realize relationships are tough and being deployed away from home is rough on everyone, but I've been there and done that many times and suicide never once crossed my mind. That probably means these people had other issues and probably should've seeked help or been sent to get help. Every supervisor is well aware that they are responsible for their peoples well being and are trained to notice the signs.
Now someone needs to find out how many of these could've been stopped by people doing what they should've done.. I'd be willing to bet the fault will probably fall on the supervisor as the signs are usually pretty easy to see in retrospect.
I'm also really not fond of Army leadership. I've met plenty of good ones, but I've met way too many that shouldn't be in charge of a night crew at McDonalds. Not trying to insult McDonalds managers or anything, but I was trying to find something where the chances of getting your head blown off were pretty slim..
Why are our soldiers getting their hands tied? This is because our soldiers are not fighting a war, despite all the propaganda that they are. They are being asked to be police in a combat zone...
...So here we all are, stuck and watching it live.
Genius post. Depressing, too. And probably will inspire some hate-mail, but I think the whole thing was very well-written. Problem is, Colin Powell was right. "You break it, you own it." We can't just turn our backs on a disaster we created, the political solution isn't working, the police job isn't working, so what about loosening the rules of engagement and allowing the troops to kick some butt? I know that sounds like Texas macho cowboy talk but I'm a pansy liberal who grew up in coastal California. I'm not a war hawk. But I'm definitely not a "sit on the fence and act helpless" guy either. What would YOU do? I haven't heard a single presidential candidate offer a sound proposal. None of 'em, zippo. The most "courageous" position taken is to say "pull out of Iraq 100% immediately." But that's the moral equivalent of handing Cambodia over to Pol Pot and watching idly as 2 million people are slaughtered. Oh, wait... we already did that. Maybe we will again. History has a way of repeating itself.
Without saying ANYTHING about Clinton and the military, my general feeling is that the way in which the military functions as a system has everything to do with suicide rates, and the commander-in-chief has some influence over the way the military functions, so they're not separate topics.
I didn't say they were separate topics, my statement was taken out of context.
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