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There can be freedom and liberty in a socialist society just as there can be freedom and liberty in one that is not, i.e., socialism is not the embodiment of freedom or liberty.
I agree. There have been some pretty non-free socialist societies and plenty of free capitalist ones.
However, I was using freedom and liberty in an economic sense. Yes, I stand by the statement that socialism = economic liberty and capitalism = economic bondage (for all but the elite few).
Of course it's made up. People only support capitalism because that's what they've been programmed to believe in since they were little kids. Society, media, schools (from kindergarten all the way through college), places of employment, all push free-market capitalism as the only option. If individuals would examine the evidence for themselves, they will see that socialism makes far more sense.
Socialism and state economic planning is the only system that will create stable living-wage jobs and reduce income inequality.
Because it works so well in Cuba, worked so well in the USSR and East Germany. You don't know what socialism is. Hell, socialism is so great that several of my relatives risked their lives escaping into West Berlin . Castro is so great and loves the people so much that my aunt's neighbor in Puerto Rico risked her and her children's lives to get on a raft to Miami and fly to Puerto Rico.
Ask China how socialism worked out for them. Worked out so great, that they abandoned Mao's socialism in favor for capitalism and now look. China went from a 3rd world backwater into the 2nd largest economy in the world and soon to eclipse the U.S. in the not too distant future.
Socialism is living wage? Ha! Best laugh I've had all day. Funny, everyone that wants socialism has never lived in a socialist country in their lives, nor are they related to anyone that lived under socialism. Socialism does reduce income inequality though. When you're just as poor as your neighbor and your neighbor is just as poor as the entire city, I suppose that's income equality
Because it works so well in Cuba, worked so well in the USSR and East Germany. You don't know what socialism is. Hell, socialism is so great that several of my relatives risked their lives escaping into West Berlin . Castro is so great and loves the people so much that my aunt's neighbor in Puerto Rico risked her and her children's lives to get on a raft to Miami and fly to Puerto Rico.
Ask China how socialism worked out for them. Worked out so great, that they abandoned Mao's socialism in favor for capitalism and now look. China went from a 3rd world backwater into the 2nd largest economy in the world and soon to eclipse the U.S. in the not too distant future.
Socialism is living wage? Ha! Best laugh I've had all day. Funny, everyone that wants socialism has never lived in a socialist country in their lives, nor are they related to anyone that lived under socialism. Socialism does reduce income inequality though. When you're just as poor as your neighbor and your neighbor is just as poor as the entire city, I suppose that's income equality
You are talking about one-party undemocratic communism (and more specifically Leninism/Stalinism/Maoism), which is a failed system. There is a HUGE difference between democratic socialism (the type I support) and Soviet-style communism.
Here are a few countries that have democratic socialist (or social-democratic) leanings:
France
Sweden
Norway
The Netherlands
Finland
The U.K. (to some extent)
All of these countries are doing better than the US economically and socially. While not explicitly socialist states, socialism has played a major role in the politics of these countries for years. France even has a large and active communist party. In France, democratic socialism is considered to be centrist or center-left. American "liberalism" would be considered far right.
Also, yes, I know what socialism is. I'm a graduate student in political science, and the study of political economy, including socialist and neoliberal (capitalist) economics, is a major part of my program of study.
I can already feel this thread sinking into that black hole where threads that challenge conventional wisdom go to die. Too bad.
No kidding. Nobody really wants to talk about the article. Govt. Regulation does not mean that you have a socialistic form of govt. only that parts of the govt. are socialized. You can still have a capitalistic society with regulations.
The original post, before we wonder further off topic is about the Conservative Paradigm that deregulation and tax cuts for the rich lead to economic prosperity. A conservative economists has just let the cat out of the bag that belief is just huey. IT was just "made up".
Nobody seems to be argueing that is not true. Maybe someone needs to tell that to the Republican candidates who seem to be preaching these lies on a daily basis.
Govt. Regulation does not mean that you have a socialistic form of govt. only that parts of the govt. are socialized. You can still have a capitalistic society with regulations.
True. Canada does this, and it has worked out beautifully for them. The USA had such a system prior to Reagan's dismantling of business and trade regulations. It's called Keynesian economics, and it is, in my opinion, one of the most fair capitalistic systems that society can construct.
Quote:
The original post, before we wonder further off topic is about the Conservative Paradigm that deregulation and tax cuts for the rich lead to economic prosperity. A conservative economists has just let the cat out of the bag that belief is just huey. IT was just "made up".
Nobody seems to be argueing that is not true. Maybe someone needs to tell that to the Republican candidates who seem to be preaching these lies on a daily basis.
Politicians, especially Republican politicians, lie. That's no surprise. What is surprising is that so many voters haven't called them on it yet.
You are talking about one-party undemocratic communism (and more specifically Leninism/Stalinism/Maoism), which is a failed system. There is a HUGE difference between democratic socialism (the type I support) and Soviet-style communism.
Here are a few countries that have democratic socialist (or social-democratic) leanings:
France
Sweden
Norway
The Netherlands
Finland
The U.K. (to some extent)
All of these countries are doing better than the US economically and socially. While not explicitly socialist states, socialism has played a major role in the politics of these countries for years. France even has a large and active communist party. In France, democratic socialism is considered to be centrist or center-left. American "liberalism" would be considered far right.
Also, yes, I know what socialism is. I'm a graduate student in political science, and the study of political economy, including socialist and neoliberal (capitalist) economics, is a major part of my program of study.
I think you're confusing democratic socialism with social democrats. None of the countries listed above are democratic socialist countries. They are social democracies.
I think you're confusing democratic socialism with social democrats. None of the countries listed above are democratic socialist countries. They are social democracies.
This discussion is off-topic (my fault, sorry), so I won't discuss it further on this thread. However, to answer your question, there really is no distinction between social democrat and democratic socialism.
Politicians, especially Republican politicians, lie. That's no surprise. What is surprising is that so many voters haven't called them on it yet.
How would they know that it is not true. Do you expect that you are going to hear this from Conservative Commentators like Limbaugh, Beck etc. If you only have you ear fixed to one souce, you might as well live in an echo chamber.
How would they know that it is not true. Do you expect that you are going to hear this from Conservative Commentators like Limbaugh, Beck etc. If you only have you ear fixed to one souce, you might as well live in an echo chamber.
So true. Sadly, most conservatives only listen to far-right commentary sources and never bother to hear the other side.
You won't hear the truth on FOX, that's for sure.
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. Castro is so great and loves the people so much that my aunt's neighbor in Puerto Rico risked her and her children's lives to get on a raft to Miami and fly to Puerto Rico.
