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Old 06-29-2012, 04:19 PM
 
667 posts, read 516,244 times
Reputation: 192

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Quote:
Originally Posted by detwahDJ View Post
Yeah, infrastructure. A corporate-owned infrastructure would rob us blind.
Just think about it. It's not rocket science.
The government doesn't have to pay a multi-millionaire or billionaire CEO plus insatiable shareholders, who must profit as much as possible. Most of this profit is just scraped off and doesn't go into the product but into their pockets instead. Government doesn't need to do this, it can operate as a non-profit. Yet it still employs many private contractors which is good for the market.
BTW the idle wealthy don't create jobs, consumers do.
The flip side is, the government is spending someone else's money are not being held accountable. Companies cannot tax people to get more spending money.
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Old 06-29-2012, 04:22 PM
 
Location: Meggett, SC
11,011 posts, read 11,026,533 times
Reputation: 6192
Quote:
Originally Posted by detwahDJ View Post
Yeah, infrastructure. A corporate-owned infrastructure would rob us blind.
Just think about it. It's not rocket science.
The government doesn't have to pay a multi-millionaire or billionaire CEO plus insatiable shareholders, who must profit as much as possible. Most of this profit is just scraped off and doesn't go into the product but into their pockets instead. Government doesn't need to do this, it can operate as a non-profit. Yet it still employs many private contractors which is good for the market.
BTW the idle wealthy don't create jobs, consumers do.
Actually we'll never know if that's the case or not because that's a domain that the gov't has tightly maintained control over. Although, I wouldn't describe the government created infrastructure as 'inexpensive'. I'll have to do more research on privatized infrastructure but you still didn't prove it was less expensive, you simply claimed it so. Because you claim it is so does not make it true.
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Old 06-29-2012, 04:23 PM
 
Location: Palo Alto
12,149 posts, read 8,418,303 times
Reputation: 4190
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambo101 View Post
Any one ever think that higher prices on everything including taxes are just a normal progression of things generally getting more expensive across the board and are just the price you pay for the privilege of living in the greatest country in the world?
The real privilege is freedom, which is guaranteed in our Constitution with no price tag attached.
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Old 06-29-2012, 04:25 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,297 posts, read 120,779,853 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by southward bound View Post
Just as hilarious as the repeated, emphatic lies of Obama that if you make under $250K your taxes will NOT go up a single penny as a result of Obamacare.

And that 47% has probably gone up by now - the government is continually looking to add additional dependents on the government dole.


As for choice of insurance companies...there may not be many to choose from, especially since people can't shop for insurance across state lines (a a gift from Obama to the insurance industry).

Sure - there will be some choice: The super expensive one, or the single payer option ("affordable")? Which would you choose if you didn't have unlimited funds? The defense budget has just been cut by some $500B, and the military's insurance plan premiums are going up by the same amount. How many military families do you suppose will be able to stay on their Tri insurance? Do you suppose they might be forced to opt for single payer instead? Is it not a good plan to put other options so far out of reach that people will have no choice but to join Obamacare?
Oh, no! One could not buy ins. across state lines prior to Obamacare, either. Do you really know what that means? It means to allow ins. companies to sell stripped down policies that do not cover conditions and care that the state regulatory agencies have mandated in an individual state. In other words, the advocates of this nonsense want the ins. coms to be able to sell policies that basically cover nothing. The consumer would pay premiums, then when s/he needed coverage, it wouldn't be there.
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Old 06-29-2012, 04:26 PM
 
59,053 posts, read 27,318,346 times
Reputation: 14285
Quote:
Originally Posted by OICU812 View Post
Your inane posts are a waste of everyone's time. You can't simply articulate your thought, because then you'd have nothing to say. So you dance around, like you have something, and once we waste our time, as you slowly get to your point, it ends up being, at most, a small and unimportant ideological distinction.

Why not save us all time, and post 'neener-neener boo-boo", and be done with it?
Bravo! And very accurate.
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Old 06-29-2012, 04:26 PM
 
Location: Meggett, SC
11,011 posts, read 11,026,533 times
Reputation: 6192
Quote:
Originally Posted by pollyrobin View Post
Let me see....as a social liberal but a fiscal conservative:

I'm going to say a non profit National Single-Payer Health Insurance System

http://www.dollarsandsense.org/archi...12friedman.pdf
Vermont Passes Single-Payer Health Care, World Doesn't End | Mother Jones

"$570 billion in savings on
administration and monopoly
profits, a single-payer system would
reduce dramatically the burden of
health care costs on the United
States economy. Over time,
furthermore, a single-payer system
would allow us to slow the growth in
health-care spending."

"Dr. William Hsiao, a Harvard economist who has been involved in designing health care systems in seven countries. Last year, the legislature commissioned Hsiao to analyze the costs and benefits of various health care options, ranging from single payer to a fully privately managed system. The soft-spoken economist told a packed state House that a single payer plan would be about 25 percent cheaper for consumers, businesses, and the government than the current system of private health insurance, saving about $500 million in just the first year"

Now, I will ask you what does multiple for profit, private insurance payers bring, to lower health care costs.
Well, it's been a year since then, did they save $500 million? I'm interested in actual proof that government involvement has resulted in savings, not what people think may happen. As we've seen time and again, what people think will happen differs substantially to what actually happens.
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Old 06-29-2012, 04:30 PM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,495,743 times
Reputation: 27720
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
Oh, no! One could not buy ins. across state lines prior to Obamacare, either. Do you really know what that means? It means to allow ins. companies to sell stripped down policies that do not cover conditions and care that the state regulatory agencies have mandated in an individual state. In other words, the advocates of this nonsense want the ins. coms to be able to sell policies that basically cover nothing. The consumer would pay premiums, then when s/he needed coverage, it wouldn't be there.
But obamacare mandates min coverage so how could your scenario be possible ?
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Old 06-29-2012, 04:31 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,297 posts, read 120,779,853 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by southbel View Post
No, I'm not moving the goal posts. I am simply pointing out that you are limited in your scope. You cannot deny that student loans and tuition go hand in hand. My point is that you are happy the government made the tuition so expensive you needed a student loan only because they made that student loan less expensive? There is a correlation here with this health care nonsense.

The gov't is claiming they will make health insurance less expensive. However, they have proceeded to deem all types of new coverage, via HHS, that these policies must have. The result? More expensive policies. Now, what do you get in exchange for those more expensive policies? Well, if you're poor enough, they'll help you pay for those more expensive policies. If you're on a beer budget are you going to buy the caviar? No. But with Obamacare, that's precisely what this calls for. It's circular logic they are using and, at the end of the day, still doesn't make health insurance less expensive because you're buying an inflated policy. They are just helping you 'think' you need to buy that caviar when in reality the beer would have been just fine.

For the VA loan, they did make that home less expensive but simply 'backed' you, allowing you to circumvent the usual financial requirements to obtain that home.
He answered the question that was asked.
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Old 06-29-2012, 04:32 PM
 
Location: Meggett, SC
11,011 posts, read 11,026,533 times
Reputation: 6192
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
He answered the question that was asked.
And I responded. It's how these things work.
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Old 06-29-2012, 04:33 PM
 
Location: The Silver State (from the UK)
4,664 posts, read 8,242,815 times
Reputation: 2862
Quote:
Originally Posted by southbel View Post
Really, it's less expensive in those countries?? Demonstrate that. I'll wait.
Yes it is. It's not even debatable - are you completely unaware?? European healthcare systems spend less than half the GDP spend that the US does and yet cover everyone - they nearly all rank above the US too. Look it up.

Now answer my question from my previous post.
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