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Old 01-21-2013, 04:45 PM
 
5,705 posts, read 3,684,585 times
Reputation: 3907

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Quote:
Originally Posted by wutitiz View Post
About 170 million, according to economist Gerald W. Scully.
Murder by the State - Gerald W. Scully - Google Books

Approx 7.3 pct of world population, or about 1 in 13 deaths during the 20th century came at the hands of goverment.
Yah cuz places with lots of guns like Afghanistan or Yemen or Pakistan are bastions of safety and tolerance. Aint no government issues thar.
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Old 01-21-2013, 04:55 PM
 
Location: Prepperland
19,040 posts, read 14,280,863 times
Reputation: 16805
“Extravagant as the supposition is, let it however be made. Let a regular army... and let it be entirely at the devotion of the federal government ... the State governments, with the people on their side, would be able to repel the danger [of attack].
Besides the advantage of being armed, which the Americans possess over the people of almost every other nation,... forms a barrier against the enterprises of ambition, more insurmountable than any which a simple government of any form can admit of. Notwithstanding the military establishments in the several kingdoms of Europe, which are carried as far as the public resources will bear, the governments are afraid to trust the people with arms...”
- - - James Madison, Federalist Paper #46.
In Federalist Paper #46, 1788, James Madison argued that Americans should not fear the “federal” government to be established under the new compact constitution. He argued that since the American people are armed, unlike other nations whose governments fear an armed populace, no federal army could defeat the States and their stalwart militiamen, who would outnumber and outgun any standing army.

OOOPS.

James Madison certainly was arguing that an Armed American People was the means to thwart ambition in the Federal government.
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Old 01-22-2013, 03:25 AM
bUU
 
Location: Florida
12,074 posts, read 10,737,078 times
Reputation: 8803
Quote:
Originally Posted by arctichomesteader View Post
And governments have become more violent than ever before, making this right all the more important. How many millions were killed in the last century by their own governments?
So your solution is abrogation of the "well-regulated" aspect - allowing each person to decide for themselves what to shoot and when and how severely to "protect" themselves - whatever assuages their fear, or feeds their arrogance, or pads their own personal avarice.

Sorry, but no sale. Why should anyone who doesn't know a gun owner trust that gun owner with the firepower to kill dozens of people in a short period of time? The government that a gun owner points to as their point of fear, as you have, is actually that which has the power to legitimize a gun owner having the weapons that would not be banned under the regulations. A gun owner projecting the idea that they need their more and more powerful guns to allow them to commit aggression against the only thing that serves as a rational basis for trusting them with any guns in the first place labels that gun owner as a danger to society.
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Old 01-22-2013, 03:29 AM
bUU
 
Location: Florida
12,074 posts, read 10,737,078 times
Reputation: 8803
Quote:
Originally Posted by jetgraphics View Post
James Madison certainly was arguing that an Armed American People was the means to thwart ambition in the Federal government.
So here's an idea: Let's have each state create a state militia, and staff it with volunteers and officers who report to the governor, not the President, to serve as that bulwark?

What?

We already have that?

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Old 01-22-2013, 04:19 AM
 
16,431 posts, read 22,247,759 times
Reputation: 9628
Quote:
Originally Posted by bUU View Post
So here's an idea: Let's have each state create a state militia, and staff it with volunteers and officers who report to the governor, not the President, to serve as that bulwark?

What?

We already have that?

Here's a better idea: let's follow the Constitution just the way it's written. Shall not be infringed.
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Old 01-22-2013, 04:23 AM
bUU
 
Location: Florida
12,074 posts, read 10,737,078 times
Reputation: 8803
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bideshi View Post
let's follow the Constitution just the way it's written.
"Well-regulated militia"
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Old 05-29-2013, 11:33 PM
 
Location: Las Vegas,Nevada
9,282 posts, read 6,759,220 times
Reputation: 1531
Quote:
Originally Posted by bUU View Post
George Washington is dead.

George Washington lived in a different age.

George Washington never saw a semi-automatic weapon.

George Washington never saw a 30 round magazine clip.

If gun owners all just carried around the weapons that George Washington carried, there would be no problem to address.
and if we allowed the methods of free speech George Washington had..well we would not be having this chat...

our rights and freedoms never contract, or stagnate, they expend...deal with..you will not get what you want.
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Old 05-29-2013, 11:51 PM
 
92 posts, read 56,655 times
Reputation: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by bUU View Post
George Washington is dead.

George Washington lived in a different age.

George Washington never saw a semi-automatic weapon.

George Washington never saw a 30 round magazine clip.

If gun owners all just carried around the weapons that George Washington carried, there would be no problem to address.
You missed the point.

The point is to have the means to defend one's self from threats including the government.

The government has 30 round clips and semi-automatics, therefore it is necessary for citizens to have those weapons as well.

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Old 05-29-2013, 11:53 PM
 
6,331 posts, read 5,222,820 times
Reputation: 1640
Quote:
Originally Posted by thanatos331 View Post
You missed the point.

The point is to have the means to defend one's self from threats including the government.

The government has 30 round clips and semi-automatics, therefore it is necessary for citizens to have those weapons as well.

Your guns are don't stand a chance against the government, sorry.
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Old 05-29-2013, 11:54 PM
 
92 posts, read 56,655 times
Reputation: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Draper View Post
Your guns are don't stand a chance against the government, sorry.
That's not a valid argument.

In fact, that just reinforces my point. The government is getting too big and too dangerous. Thanks.
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