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Maybe you and other conservatives should have someone patient read his essay to you, seeing as you seem incapable or unwilling to read it yourself and form an original opinion. I've read it, and while I don't subscribe to his exact stance, there is a lot of interesting food for thought in there.
He is writing only about his personal opinion, not on policy for everyone. He is simply writing that in spite of medical advancement, there is a major qualitative, non-scientific aspect to life, and that when he ruminates upon the entire concept of life from a philosophical standpoint, he personally rejects the notion that he would want to extend his life forever under any conditions of incapacitation. It's his right.
Here is the essay. From the essay, which you surely missed:
Conservatives, of course, once again demonstrate themselves as incapable of reading a fully body of reasoning, assessing the logic in context, and forming a reasoned and insightful opinion. Understanding things requires more effort, and gaining insight requires some level of intellectual honesty. Much easier for you to get two or three completely out-of-context soundbites cooked up to feed the biased agenda of some crooked AM radio hack.
The article is illogical, arrogant, and self-absorbed. If he chooses age 75 to die based on statistical analysis, good for him, may he die. If he encounters the flaws he finds make life not worth living at an earlier age, may he die then.
Thank goodness for the sane majority of people who at age 75+ rejected his sick pov that 'For many reasons, 75 is a pretty good age to aim to stop living.'
The article is illogical, arrogant, and self-absorbed. If he chooses age 75 to die based on statistical analysis, good for him, may he die. If he encounters the flaws he finds make life not worth living at an earlier age, may he die then.
Thank goodness for the sane majority of people who at age 75+ rejected his sick pov that 'For many reasons, 75 is a pretty good age to aim to stop living.'
The man was making a conscious personal decision for himself. I thought you conservatives are all about personal freedom?
Or are you bearing false witness again by trying to imply that he wanted everyone else to die at 75? What part of the following quote from Emmanuelle don't you understand?
Again, let me be clear: I am not saying that those who want to live as long as possible are unethical or wrong. I am certainly not scorning or dismissing people who want to live on despite their physical and mental limitations. I’m not even trying to convince anyone I’m right. Indeed, I often advise people in this age group on how to get the best medical care available in the United States for their ailments. That is their choice, and I want to support them.
And I am not advocating 75 as the official statistic of a complete, good life in order to save resources, ration health care, or address public-policy issues arising from the increases in life expectancy. What I am trying to do is delineate my views for a good life and make my friends and others think about how they want to live as they grow older. I want them to think of an alternative to succumbing to that slow constriction of activities and aspirations imperceptibly imposed by aging. Are we to embrace the “American immortal” or my “75 and no more” view?
The man was making a conscious personal decision for himself. I thought you conservatives are all about personal freedom?
Or are you bearing false witness again by trying to imply that he wanted everyone else to die at 75? What part of the following quote from Emmanuelle don't you understand?
Again, let me be clear: I am not saying that those who want to live as long as possible are unethical or wrong. I am certainly not scorning or dismissing people who want to live on despite their physical and mental limitations. I’m not even trying to convince anyone I’m right. Indeed, I often advise people in this age group on how to get the best medical care available in the United States for their ailments. That is their choice, and I want to support them.
And I am not advocating 75 as the official statistic of a complete, good life in order to save resources, ration health care, or address public-policy issues arising from the increases in life expectancy. What I am trying to do is delineate my views for a good life and make my friends and others think about how they want to live as they grow older. I want them to think of an alternative to succumbing to that slow constriction of activities and aspirations imperceptibly imposed by aging.
Are we to embrace the “American immortal” or my “75 and no more” view?
If he wants to die at 75, fine, as I said, I hope he does.
Same for you. If you want to die rather than rely on others to change your diapers, fine by me. Something like that could happen to you at any age. Do you have a living will or health care proxy or some other document to guarantee your death, or a plan for suicide, or someone in place to put you down.
I'm saying Ezekiel offers sick, stupid alternatives --- Are we to embrace the “American immortal” or my “75 and no more” view?
If he wants to die at 75, fine, as I said, I hope he does.
Same for you. If you want to die rather than rely on others to change your diapers, fine by me. Something like that could happen to you at any age. Do you have a living will or health care proxy or some other document to guarantee your death, or a plan for suicide, or someone in place to put you down.
I'm saying Ezekiel offers sick, stupid alternatives --- Are we to embrace the “American immortal” or my “75 and no more” view?
The OP and his followers think Emmanuelle says people should die at 75. Why aren't you telling them they are bearing false witness?
My old employer plans of several years ago were far better than they are now.
If they got rid of all the fraud in the system, I think it would be much better, but....!
I guess I'll find out when I get there--2 years away at this point.
Medicare is quite similar to the plans we all use to have that have pretty much gone away now. That is not a big surprise as Medicare was born during a time when insurance coverage was much better. We had decent pensions back then too. Keep voting for the Republicans, though, and Medicare will go the way of the private pension. They have never liked Medicare.
God willing, you can revisit this conversation at 60 and laugh at how foolish you were to think most 70 year olds are ready for the nursing home.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ambient
Maybe you and other conservatives should have someone patient read his essay to you, seeing as you seem incapable or unwilling to read it yourself and form an original opinion. I've read it, and while I don't subscribe to his exact stance, there is a lot of interesting food for thought in there.
He is writing only about his personal opinion, not on policy for everyone. He is simply writing that in spite of medical advancement, there is a major qualitative, non-scientific aspect to life, and that when he ruminates upon the entire concept of life from a philosophical standpoint, he personally rejects the notion that he would want to extend his life forever under any conditions of incapacitation. It's his right.
Here is the essay. From the essay, which you surely missed:
Conservatives, of course, once again demonstrate themselves as incapable of reading a fully body of reasoning, assessing the logic in context, and forming a reasoned and insightful opinion. Understanding things requires more effort, and gaining insight requires some level of intellectual honesty. Much easier for you to get two or three completely out-of-context soundbites cooked up to feed the biased agenda of some crooked AM radio hack.
What does this have to do with conservatives and liberals? Liberals all want to die at 75? Heck, Hillary Clinton wants to run for president at 69! She'll be close to 74 by the time her term ends. Joe Biden is rumored to want to run for the presidency at age 74! Somebody better get the memo to them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rosie_hair
The man was making a conscious personal decision for himself. I thought you conservatives are all about personal freedom?
Or are you bearing false witness again by trying to imply that he wanted everyone else to die at 75? What part of the following quote from Emmanuelle don't you understand?
Again, let me be clear: I am not saying that those who want to live as long as possible are unethical or wrong. I am certainly not scorning or dismissing people who want to live on despite their physical and mental limitations. I’m not even trying to convince anyone I’m right. Indeed, I often advise people in this age group on how to get the best medical care available in the United States for their ailments. That is their choice, and I want to support them.
And I am not advocating 75 as the official statistic of a complete, good life in order to save resources, ration health care, or address public-policy issues arising from the increases in life expectancy. What I am trying to do is delineate my views for a good life and make my friends and others think about how they want to live as they grow older. I want them to think of an alternative to succumbing to that slow constriction of activities and aspirations imperceptibly imposed by aging. Are we to embrace the “American immortal” or my “75 and no more” view?
Emmanuel has not made any decision for himself. He's 57. We'll see what he's saying in 15 years, at 72, if he's still alive then.
Medicare is quite similar to the plans we all use to have that have pretty much gone away now. That is not a big surprise as Medicare was born during a time when insurance coverage was much better. We had decent pensions back then too. Keep voting for the Republicans, though, and Medicare will go the way of the private pension. They have never liked Medicare.
Most Republicans like it now. So much of the Republican base is on Medicare, Tricare, VA that it will be hard to get them away to a plan similar to Obummercare. It kind of cracks me up when the Republican base goes on the attack on Obummercare talking about how much stuff it covers when in fact the actuarial levels are very low. It shows how little the Republican base...aka Tea Party knows about health care.
I read that article when it was published and I agreed with most of it. I don't want to live forever, and seeing how my older relatives struggled/are struggling with the declines of old age and the crushing expenses from medication and things Medicare doesn't cover makes me realize that I don't want that for myself. 10-15 years of retirement is more than enough for me. I'd rather die a relatively quick death at 75 than a long, slow, drain-circling death in my 90s after a decade of limited mobility and chronic disease.
Unless the author is stupid he surely knows no one is going to pay the least attention to what he thinks.
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