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One of the real problems in both the U.S. and Canada is the fact that many people, perhaps even our President, have little or no knowledge of the history of the nation, adjoining nations or the world. In temple there is worry that children will not carry the magnitude of the Shoah, or Holocaust with them.
Nationally, the schools have been de-emphasizing or, to coin a word "de-heroing" the Revolutionary War, because of the understandable concern that no account in "traditional" teachings was taken of the abuse of black slaves or Native Americans. Thus, George Washington, Thomas Jefferson (whom I have other problems with), James Madison and James Monroe have been cut down to "size" because of their slave ownership. Andrew Jackson because of this mistreatment of Native Americans. So the simple expedient is to either eliminate teaching of history or make it stilted and boring.
Similarly, I have met Canadian schoolteachers who do not know of the Battle of the Plains of Abraham or its British general Wolfe or French general Montcalm. How can they teach it if they don't know it. Perhaps the concern is mistreatment of the French or the later mistreatment of First Nations (their equivalent of Native Americans). Same result as in the U.S.
If people don't know history, how can they make informed judgments about the present. Thoughts?
"The only thing to be learnt from history is that nobody learns from history."
- William Golding, Close Quarters (1987)
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I cannot help but laugh whenever someone resurrects the "founding fathers" for some improbable thesis in a vain effort to rewrite our history. (The "Tea Party" activists come to mind.) Our so-called founding fathers, when viewed candidly, were colorful enough characters without our adding varnish to them. Franklin, who is considered to be the "First American" came close to forsaking hearth and home for England. Even Jefferson, with all his slaves (he owned over 600 during his lifetime), was hardly the egalitarian we would have him be; and despite the efforts of modern-day Christians to convert him, in truth he was a deist, who had no qualms about revising the Bible to suit himself. See The Jefferson Bible: The Life and Morals of Jesus of Nazareth (1820). The "times that try men’s souls" bring out firebrands like Paine; who, if he was not a founding father, was certainly the midwife of American independence, and abetter to the overthrow of the French monarchy as well. Like Jesus, we would not be able to stand him. (Indeed, Paine was such a pain in the arse that he managed to make himself persona non grata in England, America and France!) Our perception of these characters is clouded by the dark glass of history, and distorted by attributions that represent so much wishful (rather than critical) thinking. It is like crediting Rembrandt’s paintings with depth of hue when their darkness is due to his having used cheap paint.
"The only thing to be learnt from history is that nobody learns from history."
- William Golding, Close Quarters (1987)
________________________________
I cannot help but laugh whenever someone resurrects the "founding fathers" for some improbable thesis in a vain effort to rewrite our history. (The "Tea Party" activists come to mind.) Our so-called founding fathers, when viewed candidly, were colorful enough characters without our adding varnish to them. Franklin, who is considered to be the "First American" came close to forsaking hearth and home for England. Even Jefferson, with all his slaves (he owned over 600 during his lifetime), was hardly the egalitarian we would have him be; and despite the efforts of modern-day Christians to convert him, in truth he was a deist, who had no qualms about revising the Bible to suit himself. See The Jefferson Bible: The Life and Morals of Jesus of Nazareth (1820). The "times that try men’s souls" bring out firebrands like Paine; who, if he was not a founding father, was certainly the midwife of American independence, and abetter to the overthrow of the French monarchy as well. Like Jesus, we would not be able to stand him. (Indeed, Paine was such a pain in the arse that he managed to make himself persona non grata in England, America and France!) Our perception of these characters is clouded by the dark glass of history, and distorted by attributions that represent so much wishful (rather than critical) thinking. It is like crediting Rembrandt’s paintings with depth of hue when their darkness is due to his having used cheap paint.
Well said indeed! With no country being exempt from wishful gilding of the lily.
"The only thing to be learnt from history is that nobody learns from history."
- William Golding, Close Quarters (1987)
________________________________
I cannot help but laugh whenever someone resurrects the "founding fathers" for some improbable thesis in a vain effort to rewrite our history. (The "Tea Party" activists come to mind.) Our so-called founding fathers, when viewed candidly, were colorful enough characters without our adding varnish to them. Franklin, who is considered to be the "First American" came close to forsaking hearth and home for England. Even Jefferson, with all his slaves (he owned over 600 during his lifetime), was hardly the egalitarian we would have him be; and despite the efforts of modern-day Christians to convert him, in truth he was a deist, who had no qualms about revising the Bible to suit himself. See The Jefferson Bible: The Life and Morals of Jesus of Nazareth (1820). The "times that try men’s souls" bring out firebrands like Paine; who, if he was not a founding father, was certainly the midwife of American independence, and abetter to the overthrow of the French monarchy as well. Like Jesus, we would not be able to stand him. (Indeed, Paine was such a pain in the arse that he managed to make himself persona non grata in England, America and France!) Our perception of these characters is clouded by the dark glass of history, and distorted by attributions that represent so much wishful (rather than critical) thinking. It is like crediting Rembrandt’s paintings with depth of hue when their darkness is due to his having used cheap paint.
"HISTORY, n. An account mostly false, of events mostly unimportant, which are brought about by rulers mostly knaves, and soldiers mostly fools."
- Ambrose Bierce, The Cynic’s Word Book (1906); retitled The Devil’s Dictonary (1911)
. . .
History is the story of man. It's also a pack of lies.
The way I look at it, just tell the students what happened. Don't put a PC spin on it, let them figure that out for themselves when they get to the age where they start to think of such things.
Why warp their minds in a negative way towards their country's history? How about we spend more time on math and science for the smart kids and more time on industrial arts for the more hands on kids who aren't as interested in higher classes?
To be honest, I'm thankful to be an American and I'm thankful that those guys did what they had to do way back then so we could have a pretty good life today. It's a tough old world.
I agree. No Monday morning quarterbacking based on present day values. Just teach what happened. Just like in your own life, you learn from your mistakes, you don't put a spin on it or pretend it didn't happen and if you've accomplished something, you should know how it was done so you can repeat your successes.
Again, tell the truth about the men who founded this country. They weren't saints, they didn't have halos, they were human beings. It doesn't diminish what they accomplished. It doesn't make the Declaration of Independence or the Constitution any less valid. I don't understand why humanizing these men is in any way disrespectful.
The problem is that your view, while supposedly balanced, is lost on people of "child" age, and results either in the history not being taught or the founders demonized.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rggr
I don't have a problem with telling the truth about them. What's silly about it, IMO, is that their views on slavery or native Americans is not what makes them relevant in history. As someone pointed out, there is a lot to cover in history, them having slaves or not doesn't differentiate them as historical figures, but them establishing the foundation for the country is. To cover that stuff as a focus in a high school type of course is just to add something to make sure we let everyone know we and our founders are not really that special. Most with an understanding of history and man in general can figure that out. If you get to a more focused course later, then by all means cover it all. As a foundation, people need to understand the founding of the country and the rationale for decisions made, not the personal lives of those that did it.
Excellent points. People want to emphasize what's wrong with our past, not what's great. We don't have to wear a hairshirt when teaching or discussing history. We are greater than most other countries in history and should be proud of it.
At the same time I have no problem with teaching that slavery is now morally wrong. As long as we present that the modern practitioners are primarily Islamic countries and Communist China.
My problem is not so much what they teach in history class in the schools, but what they leave out.
For example I think it is important for students to learn about the lives of ordinary working families in the 18th, 19th, and early 20th Centuries. Do students know who the Molly Maguires were? The Know Nothing Party? The Triangle Shirt Waist Fire? The Teapot Dome Scandal?
"HISTORY, n. An account mostly false, of events mostly unimportant, which are brought about by rulers mostly knaves, and soldiers mostly fools."
- Ambrose Bierce, The Cynic’s Word Book (1906); retitled The Devil’s Dictonary (1911)
. . .
History is the story of man. It's also a pack of lies.
I can be convenient to ignore/dismiss facts and information. That way you don't have to defend your positions against them.
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With no country being exempt from wishful gilding of the lily.
