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Im a Democrat, and there are a few topics I never get clear answers about, when i interact with Conservatives. I have been banned from certain FB groups and things of that nature whenever I mention these things. Hopefully, here I can get some real dialogue on these topics.
1. Conservatives are against tax dollars going to planned parenthood, because PP facilitates abortions. But Conservatives are willing to give Israel money and the lives of our soldiers, even though all abortions in Israel are state sponsored. In fact, all Israeli citizens are required to do time in the Army. If a female Israeli soldier becomes pregnant while serving, she has 2 choices. Be ejected from the Army and lose all benefits, or have a state sponsored abortion.
2. Obamacare. According to Conservatives, Obamacare is a train wreck. Conservatives tell us free market based ideas would work better. Fine. Section 1332 of the ACA (Waivers for State Innovation) allows states to fully opt out of Obamacare, simply by coming up with their own plans that would insure the same, or more, amount of people as the ACA. There are about 25 Red states with GOP Super majorities. Why aren't we seeing these better, free market based, ideas being put into legislation in these states. Why are Republicans fighting to repeal a law that gives them the ability to implement their own plans. With the ACA being such a train wreck, one would think it would be very easy to come up with legislation that yields better results.
3.Socialism & Fiscal Policy. Obama has halfed the deficit he inherited. Bush did a lot of spending off the books so his deficits dont tell the whole story, as he used budget supplementals to fund many things. But if you take Bush's deficits + deficit spending he did via budget supplementals, Obama's deficits are lower than Bushs. The national debt tripled under Reagan. Deficits increased under Reagan. Reagan expanded the EIC in the tax code, and is considered by many as the biggest transfer of wealth seen in this country. Reagan-Phone is the Grand daddy of the Obama-Phone. Reagan signed EMTALA, which mandates private businesses (hospitals) give goods and services (treatment) to people regardless of their ability to pay. So how is it Obama is the spender/socialist? While Reagan is the fiscal god, and Bush just "did little more spending than he should have".
Not a conservative, but not a Democrat so I'll give answers just for fun:
1) Support for Israel is still bipartisan when it comes to actual politicians. Democrats are more likely to support a two-state solution, but few Democrats would side with Palestine if they had to choose one or the other. The bipartisan support likely has little to do with our actual opinion of Israel. It's America's way to be involved with the Middle East. Some conservative do have a moral reason, which is that Israel is the most progressive nation in the Middle East; arguably more progressive than the US. A smaller group support it because they think Jesus won't come back unless the Jews has Israel or something.
2) The ACA is a mess. If we want to go free health care, let's either commit and go single payer or just stick to what we had before. This in between thing is a disaster. But you have to understand, what constitutes as 'better' is not that simple. Yes, a conservative state can opt out, but there's no way to actually guarantee how many people will be covered in a new system, just as the case was with Obamacare.
3) Socialism is largely defined as 'government spending money on things I don't agree with.' Though even most rational conservatives agree that Bush was no a fiscal conservative. He was an idiot in this regard. Obama spends just like Bush did though...
Im a Democrat, and there are a few topics I never get clear answers about, when i interact with Conservatives. I have been banned from certain FB groups and things of that nature whenever I mention these things. Hopefully, here I can get some real dialogue on these topics.
1. Conservatives are against tax dollars going to planned parenthood, because PP facilitates abortions. But Conservatives are willing to give Israel money and the lives of our soldiers, even though all abortions in Israel are state sponsored. In fact, all Israeli citizens are required to do time in the Army. If a female Israeli soldier becomes pregnant while serving, she has 2 choices. Be ejected from the Army and lose all benefits, or have a state sponsored abortion.
2. Obamacare. According to Conservatives, Obamacare is a train wreck. Conservatives tell us free market based ideas would work better. Fine. Section 1332 of the ACA (Waivers for State Innovation) allows states to fully opt out of Obamacare, simply by coming up with their own plans that would insure the same, or more, amount of people as the ACA. There are about 25 Red states with GOP Super majorities. Why aren't we seeing these better, free market based, ideas being put into legislation in these states. Why are Republicans fighting to repeal a law that gives them the ability to implement their own plans. With the ACA being such a train wreck, one would think it would be very easy to come up with legislation that yields better results.
3.Socialism & Fiscal Policy. Obama has halfed the deficit he inherited. Bush did a lot of spending off the books so his deficits dont tell the whole story, as he used budget supplementals to fund many things. But if you take Bush's deficits + deficit spending he did via budget supplementals, Obama's deficits are lower than Bushs. The national debt tripled under Reagan. Deficits increased under Reagan. Reagan expanded the EIC in the tax code, and is considered by many as the biggest transfer of wealth seen in this country. Reagan-Phone is the Grand daddy of the Obama-Phone. Reagan signed EMTALA, which mandates private businesses (hospitals) give goods and services (treatment) to people regardless of their ability to pay. So how is it Obama is the spender/socialist? While Reagan is the fiscal god, and Bush just "did little more spending than he should have".
I'm not even going to dignify 1 and 3 with a response, these are stupid attempts at gotchas with the third starting with a very tired bad faith argument to confuse the deficit and the debt, and it's no surprise people kicked you out of the discussion on somewhere like facebook which is supposed to be relatively civil (much more so than for example here) when it comes to politics because of it. I don't talk politics at all on facebook and it sounds like neither should you.
For section 1332, that's a legitimate question before reading that part of the law, but a quick read of that section of the ACA (it's only a few pages) and 5 minutes of thinking should make it self-evident the ample reasons this won't be successfully invoked by a red state under the current administration (although it could in theory happen under a future Republican administration). Link: http://housedocs.house.gov/energycommerce/ppacacon.pdf
Sorry, but the talking points that I was issued don't go into that much detail. I'm supposed to say that Obama is a commie socialist community organizing anti-christ that was born in Kenya and is also an incompetent tyrant bent on destroying America. When pressed further I'm supposed to just keep repeating the same stuff.
I'm not even going to dignify 1 and 3 with a response, these are stupid attempts at gotchas with the third starting with a very tired bad faith argument to confuse the deficit and the debt, and it's no surprise people kicked you out of the discussion on somewhere like facebook which is supposed to be relatively civil (much more so than for example here) when it comes to politics because of it. I don't talk politics at all on facebook and it sounds like neither should you.
For section 1332, that's a legitimate question before reading that part of the law, but a quick read of that section of the ACA (it's only a few pages) and 5 minutes of thinking should make it self-evident the ample reasons this won't be successfully invoked by a red state under the current administration (although it could in theory happen under a future Republican administration). Link: http://housedocs.house.gov/energycommerce/ppacacon.pdf
Honestly, what so gotcha about 1 & 3?? IMO, there just fact based questions.
WOuldn't it be MUCH easier for red states to implement their own plans, and if Obama came after them for whatever reason, simply plead their case in court. The bar is sooo law. Insure at least the same amount of people as the ACA. Sounds pretty simple, and would be much simpler than trying to repeal the law. You mnentioned a red state would not be able to get it done under this administration. How many times did the House vote to appeal the ACA with a Dem lead Senate, and a Dem in the whitehouse. Seems to me that implementing those free market ideas they keep telling us about would be MUCH simpler and effective.
Honestly, what so gotcha about 1 & 3?? IMO, there just fact based questions.
WOuldn't it be MUCH easier for red states to implement their own plans, and if Obama came after them for whatever reason, simply plead their case in court. The bar is sooo law. Insure at least the same amount of people as the ACA. Sounds pretty simple, and would be much simpler than trying to repeal the law. You mnentioned a red state would not be able to get it done under this administration. How many times did the House vote to appeal the ACA with a Dem lead Senate, and a Dem in the whitehouse. Seems to me that implementing those free market ideas they keep telling us about would be MUCH simpler and effective.
Read the language. HHS has discretion in determining whether to allow a waiver in deciding if it meets the poorly worded and insufficiently prescriptive language in the statue; read it with a careful eye as to the use of the word may versus will. A state can't just implement their own plan, they can apply for a waiver, which HHS may elect to to accept.
Again, read the text and think about it, it will take literally under 15 minutes of your time and will answer your own questions.
Incidentally some of this is a sword that cuts both ways -- due to the 5 year limitation, in theory if say Vermont had actually instituted single payer under 1332, a future Republican administration 5 years afterward could simply refuse to renew the waiver and then they'd have to go back to a normal system. The sloppy and aggressive drafting meant specifically to stop red states from doing as you propose can and might be abused by a future Republican administration.
1. We are not Israel. Abortion is murder.
2. More people lost insurance than those that gained insurance.
3. Obama halved nothing but has increased deficit spending.
Not a conservative, but not a Democrat so I'll give answers just for fun:
1) Support for Israel is still bipartisan when it comes to actual politicians. Democrats are more likely to support a two-state solution, but few Democrats would side with Palestine if they had to choose one or the other. The bipartisan support likely has little to do with our actual opinion of Israel. It's America's way to be involved with the Middle East. Some conservative do have a moral reason, which is that Israel is the most progressive nation in the Middle East; arguably more progressive than the US. A smaller group support it because they think Jesus won't come back unless the Jews has Israel or something.
2) The ACA is a mess. If we want to go free health care, let's either commit and go single payer or just stick to what we had before. This in between thing is a disaster. But you have to understand, what constitutes as 'better' is not that simple. Yes, a conservative state can opt out, but there's no way to actually guarantee how many people will be covered in a new system, just as the case was with Obamacare.
3) Socialism is largely defined as 'government spending money on things I don't agree with.' Though even most rational conservatives agree that Bush was no a fiscal conservative. He was an idiot in this regard. Obama spends just like Bush did though...
How do you support the statement of Obama spends like Bush, when in fact, Obama has halfed Bush's defict? How do you make this logic work. Teach me please. Many people feel the same as you, so you're not alone. But can you please help me understand how someone can say Obama spends like Bush.
1. We are not Israel. Abortion is murder.
2. More people lost insurance than those that gained insurance.
3. Obama halved nothing but has increased deficit spending.
1. I know. But Israel does get our tax money. Why do they get to do abortions AND get our tax money
2. Thats my point. I want to know why Red states arent implenting their own plans that would insure more people than the ACA. This way they can completely OPT OUT of it
3. Can you please provide any proof to support your statement?
Debt and deficit are 2 different things. You can raise debt and cut a deficit at same time. A deficit is the difference between what you plan to spend and what you actually spend. Jump the amount you plan to spend to crazy levels and dont hit them and it makes you look good. A debt is money owed more than money brought in. That number under obama and this congress has gone thru the roof. Bush wasnt much better.
A example of the above for those who cant follow along.
A person goes to the store to buy groceries. They plan to spend $200 on items. Instead they only spend $100. They cut their deficit in half. But... They didnt make any money that week so they increased thier debt by $100. Understand now?
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