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If a female sports Dr. touched my genitals just for kicks when I was 14, 12 or even 5. I don't care. It wouldn't cause me or anyone else any real harm. And I couldn't care less about this whole charade .
What if the furor and hysteria over #meToo caused these athletes to think of themselves as victims? If you tell someone that they were victimized, and prior to that, they didn't feel they had been, then doesn't that mean something is wrong? If the treatments were efficacious doesn't that mean they could not have been criminal? The government's "story" relied on getting Nassar to disclaim that his treatments were efficacious and yet, they must have been or else these girls wouldn't all have been clamoring to see him, and recommending him to their friends, and going back when they were again injured. There has to be SOME reason to explain this behavior. Are we supposed to believe these girls were all in a trance? That he hypnotized them or exerted mind control over them?
What about the story of the girl who said she asked her FEMALE physical therapist about it, and the PT said, nope, its a legitimate treatment? Is she "in on it"?
How come when you search on Google , you get 8 results on the first page alone substantiating it as a legitimate treatment?
How come osteopaths are trained in this technique?
How come physical therapists know of, and/or are trained in this technique?
How come there are government funded studies establishing the efficacy of the treatment?
How is it that in the state's narrative, that every single one of these cases were all not legitimate treatments, when no such thing was ever established in court?
Why is it that the government INSISTED, as a condition of the plea deal, that Nassar sign a document saying that none of the treatments were legitimate/done for medical purposes, and instead were done only (all of them) for his own gratification?
Why was that wording so important to them? If its a slam dunk, why offer a plea or require that stipulation?
If its axiomatic , if its REALLY true that this was not a legit medical treatment, why couldn't that simply be presented at trial?
Why did the government trot out THREE doctors, all of whom were women and none of whom had treated the patients that later complained, to testify to something that is proposed to be a universal truth or fact?
What are the odds of finding three medical expert witnesses that are all female, when females are only 1/3 of the doctors?
Lots of reasons to question the veracity of the government's claims , and frankly, its appalling that his legal team didn't appear to offer any effective resistance or adequate responses to these issues and instead advised their client to stipulate to such an extremely lopsided and damning interpretation, when they knew he didn't actually believe it or agree with it.
You haven't done a shred of research into the issue, that much is clear. Would you accept a study from the National Institutes of Health? How about articles or blog posts from osteopathic doctors trained in the technique? Physical therapists? Physios?
I'm not the one shifting the goal posts. I am not the one claiming that what he did was not medical treatment, or not medically indicated. The people here who are saying that, have done no research, have no personal qualifications to make those assessments, and didn't examine the patients. They literally have no basis for their belief, other than what the government has alleged. They are credulous people.
Reasonably skeptical people, the sort you would impanel on a jury with the expectation that they will actually attempt to deliberate, would at least make some effort to determine for themselves if what the government alleges is true or even makes sense as a theory of guilt.
God help us all if the posters here are representative of the American population. Nobody is safe from a "jury of their peers" if this is the pool.
I would accept current articles from accredited doctors who provide an explanation of when vaginal treatment is warranted to treat ankles, wrists, knees and other injuries consistent with what these girls reported.
The people here saying that the treatment was not medically indicated don't have to be qualified to examine patients. They can take the word of over 200 girls who have told us their stories. They can accept the guilty plea of Dr Nassar who, if his treatment was warranted, could certainly have offered up the expert testimony of other physicians who use this therapy and find it effective.
Reasonably skeptical people are intelligent and rational. They can understand a doctor's explanation of when such a therapy is warranted and why it works. The fact is that we have now heard the stories of hundreds of gilrs, who over the years were sexually molested by Dr Nassar. You, for some reason, don't find these girls credible. That's not reasonable, because the number of girls itself lends credibility to the claims, because Dr Nassar himself has apologized, because Dr Nassar is proven to have had child pornography on his computer and an interest in child pornography certainly dovetails with sexually molesting young girls, because these incidents span years, even decades, and because we are now learning that these girls DID tell adults about the incidents, they DID complain, they DID ask questions, but they were dismissed. Now you are trying to dismiss them as well.
Oh, so since you're so sure. I will bet you $100K that it does. If you're wrong, and there are google results, you pay me $100K.
If there are any reports of medical professionals or physical therapists confirming it is a legitimate treatment, including quotes from articles published in print or online, you also lose.
Deal? Put your money where your big ignorant mouth-hole is.
Wait, do you even have 100K?
Go for it. Put up your links showing that when Nassar was diddling these teenage girls with his fingers he was providing a legitimate medical treatment.
The government's "story" relied on getting Nassar to disclaim that his treatments were efficacious and yet, they must have been or else these girls wouldn't all have been clamoring to see him, and recommending him to their friends, and going back when they were again injured. There has to be SOME reason to explain this behavior. Are we supposed to believe these girls were all in a trance? That he hypnotized them or exerted mind control over them?.
Seriously? They didn't have a choice but to see him! He was the doctor hired to treat them by the gymnastics team. They weren't allowed to choose their own doctor. Anyone who has followed this story is aware of that, at least.
He has been tried for different crimes in different jurisdictions- I believe at least 2 separate counties in Michigan and then a federal level case. There are different sentencing hearings for each. He may also get charged with additional crimes in Texas as well as anywhere else the abuse occurred. It might be possible he faces a variety of charges related to how these crimes were hidden or perjury during previous testimony. When your victims literally cross the century mark it is not the judiciary or public's fault that trying an sentencing you drags on for eons. If you can't take the trial and impacts statements (as he claimed in a letter) then don't molest 100 or 200 underage girls.
What I think will change is the increased attention is moving beyond Nasser to those who enabled him, those who hid his behavior and those who created an atmosphere where he could thrive. The victim impact statements have already lead to 3 big changes- the gymnastics body for the US had its program director 'resign,' US the Olympic Committee gave the same group 3 days for their entire board to resign and they have moved the national training facility away from the isolated ranch where this all occurred. As unpleasant as it may be this is really shining a spotlight on gymnastics and making people take a much harder look at other organizations. The lady who made the 'what is a little girl worth' victim speech swung for the fences. If we audit and investigate the crap out of football recruits for possibly taking $500 or a free suit there is no acceptable answer for why we don't look into allegations of abuse more carefully.
There efforts would be better spent on those that ignored the girls and were complicit in allowing his behavior. I dislike the US Olympic committee intensely, they are a elitists that benefit from the labors of the athletes and treat themselves quite well. The President of Michigan State resigned, Nassar was the sports medicine doctor on staff and at least 14 people were aware of the complaints. I'm sure there are other employees with the OC that were aware and I'm betting he isn't the only one.
Some good will come out of this like you say, people will take complaints about these predators seriously.
Excellent reference and supports my previous statement that consent is required to do procedures like this and the girls in most cases were under the age of consent.
That isn't the case for ALL of the complainants - only for some of them. Sometimes the treatments were delivered off site because the team was on travel for meets. In at least a couple of complaints, the treatments were conducted at a private residence - I recall reading one complaint that said it was at Nassar's home, and another that said it was at the home of the complainant. But the vast majority appear to have been at the gymnastics centers which were the main training locations or regular place of work for Nassar.
Which is enough. Dahmer didn't kill every person he went out with either.
Exactly. If I had a sports injury, I'd be highly skeptical of a doctor saying "I need to look at your privates" Um...really? Unless it's actually my privates that were injured then the doctor needs to stay away from those parts.
Also, Nassar isn't the only healthcare professional out there abusing trust in patients. Sadly this goes on quite frequently.
Well it depends though. Surely you could see how if your injury arose in your pelvic girdle/region, your doctor might want to perform an exam or even apply therapy internally to the structures inside the pelvis? How do you propose to treat that area?
In the case of leg injuries, the ligaments run all the way up to and connecting to others through the pelvis or on/near the pelvic girdle. So when you have an injury in the pelvis, it can cause problems elsewhere, not just in the pelvis itself.
That's the reason these treatments exist.
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