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Old 03-25-2018, 10:48 AM
 
2,643 posts, read 2,444,815 times
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Now right wingers are claiming Fox News is biased and the swamp!

GOP is on the wrong side of history as always
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Old 03-25-2018, 03:03 PM
 
Location: Kansas City, MISSOURI
20,872 posts, read 9,550,882 times
Reputation: 15598
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
How many guns are there in the US now, as opposed to the early 1990s?

Gun ownership has indeed increased by 50%, meanwhile the rate of gun homicides has DECREASED by 50% and the rate of nonfatal violent gun crimes has DECREASED by 76%.

It is quite clear that more guns DOES NOT equal higher gun crime rates, and actually corresponds to LOWER gun crime rates.

Even Pew Research concurs:

http://www.alloutdoor.com/wp-content...n-chart-01.jpg

https://i.pinimg.com/236x/41/65/32/4...oting-guns.jpg
And how many more times does it have to be repeated that that's only because a very small percentage of homeowners are stockpiling increasing numbers of guns. The RATE at which households own guns is the most important thing to your own claim, because it tells you what percentage of households own the guns which (purportedly) will help to defend themselves. And that number is FALLING. If some particular person owns 10 guns now vs only 5 back in 1990, those additional 5 guns have no bearing on the safety of their neighbor down the street. That's basically what you're claiming.
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Old 03-25-2018, 03:08 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,060 posts, read 44,877,895 times
Reputation: 13718
Quote:
Originally Posted by James Bond 007 View Post
Actually, 42% of all households have at least one gun owner. (Pew Research)

And the gun crime rates have DECREASED, SIGNIFICANTLY since the number of guns owned by Americans has increased, significantly. That should be telling you something. When those who wish to do so arm themselves, gun crimes rates go DOWN.

Others, of course, are free to not own guns as they wish.

Bottom line: Guns AREN'T the problem.
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Old 03-25-2018, 03:12 PM
 
Location: Kansas City, MISSOURI
20,872 posts, read 9,550,882 times
Reputation: 15598
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Asked of those of whom 85% are registered voters:
http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/i/TODAY/z_...0(3-22-18).pdf

And the gun crime statistics mirror those poll results. As gun ownership in the US has increased by 50%, gun homicides have been reduced by 50% and nonfatal violent gun crimes have been reduced by 76%.
BTW, your own poll refutes your statement that gun ownership has increased by 50%. From the last page of the survey:

QF10 Do you, or does anyone in your household, own a gun of any kind?

___________________10/1999___3/2018
Yes, gun in household:_____44%______47%
No, no gun in household:___54%______50%

3% does not equal 50%.
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Old 03-25-2018, 03:15 PM
 
Location: Kansas City, MISSOURI
20,872 posts, read 9,550,882 times
Reputation: 15598
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
And the gun crime rates have DECREASED, SIGNIFICANTLY since the number of guns owned by Americans has increased, significantly. That should be telling you something.
Stating a "fact" which is not even true does not tell anybody anything. Why? Because the fact is not true!
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Old 03-25-2018, 03:16 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,060 posts, read 44,877,895 times
Reputation: 13718
Quote:
Originally Posted by James Bond 007 View Post
BTW, your own poll refutes your statement that gun ownership has increased by 50%. From the last page of the survey:

QF10 Do you, or does anyone in your household, own a gun of any kind?

___________________10/1999___3/2018
Yes, gun in household:_____44%______47%
No, no gun in household:___54%______50%

3% does not equal 50%.
You're talking about ownership rate. I'm talking about the number of guns owned. Note how a 50% increase in the number of guns owned by Americans has resulted in a 50% REDUCTION in the gun homicide rate and a 76% REDUCTION in the rate of nonfatal violent gun crime rate.

More guns owned by Americans DO NOT equal higher gun crime rates. PERIOD.

Guns AREN'T the problem.
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Old 03-25-2018, 03:19 PM
 
Location: Kansas City, MISSOURI
20,872 posts, read 9,550,882 times
Reputation: 15598
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
You're talking about ownership rate. I'm talking about the number of guns owned. Note how a 50% increase in the number of guns owned by Americans has resulted in a 50% REDUCTION in the gun homicide rate and a 76% REDUCTION in the rate of nonfatal violent gun crime rate.

More guns owned by Americans DO NOT equal higher gun crime rates. PERIOD.

Guns AREN'T the problem.
Repeating the same misleading and incorrect statement over and over again is doing you no favor. In fact, it's making you look pretty stupid.

If 1 person in the US owned all 100 million guns in 1990, and then 28 years later that same person owned all 150 million guns in the US, you would claim that "There's a 50% increase in guns!" Sorry, Einstein, that does not equate to an increase in gun ownership. All it tells you is that one person is stockpiling more guns.
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Old 03-25-2018, 03:22 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,060 posts, read 44,877,895 times
Reputation: 13718
Quote:
Originally Posted by James Bond 007 View Post
Repeating the same misleading and incorrect statement over and over again is doing you no favor. In fact, it's making you look pretty stupid.
I'm not incorrect. You just lack comprehension ability. Not my fault.

Quote:
If 1 person in the US owned all 100 million guns in 1990, and then 28 years later that same person owned all 150 million guns in the US, you would claim that "There's a 50% increase in guns!" Sorry, Einstein, that does not equate to an increase in gun ownership.
Actually, it does exactly so unless that extra 50% of guns aren't owned by anyone.

COMPREHENSION.
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Old 03-25-2018, 03:29 PM
 
Location: Kansas City, MISSOURI
20,872 posts, read 9,550,882 times
Reputation: 15598
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
I'm not incorrect. You just lack comprehension ability. Not my fault.

Actually, it does exactly so unless that extra 50% of guns aren't owned by anyone.

COMPREHENSION.
Your original claim is that all these additional guns are the cause of a decline in crime. If that was true, gun ownership would have had to become more democratic or widespread - that is, spread out over a wider segment of the population. That way, a larger portion of the population would have to have had a gun, with which they could defend themselves.

But that's NOT TRUE. A smaller proportion of the population is owning guns. IOW, a smaller portion of the population owns a gun with which to defend themselves.

Your whole argument amounts to, the guy in my analogy who owns all 150 million guns in the US, somehow has the means to defend somebody who lives halfway across the country, from his own house.
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Old 03-25-2018, 03:29 PM
 
Location: Pacific NW
9,437 posts, read 7,374,928 times
Reputation: 7979
Imagine what the poll results would be without massive media bias against guns that refuses to report anything positive about firearms. If every incident where a firearm was used to stop a crime and save lives was promoted and broadcast as much as tragedies no one except the most rabid liberals would be pushing for more gun control.
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