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The answers matter if there is ever any chance of folks starting to treat people as people instead of as stereotypical objects. But that, of course, will never happen because neurologically we are lazy so it's much easier to categorize. So what to do instead? Try basic manners.
I'm a woman who lived in minority areas during the height of the crime-ridden 80s and also traveled extensively solo to third-world countries where you simply had to know what you were doing. Came and went as I pleased. Never had issues, but then figuring out a set of principals goes a long way.
Women tend to act instinctively out of the realization that men have penises and they vaginas. Color didn't figure into the times where I became uncomfortable. Solo men with a bad vibe scare most. Too, from time spent in the Middle East I've learned that things go best if you work to establish who you are to obtain the most favorable stereotype. Establish that all American women are not sluts.
Back to St. Louis. Yes, her ex-husband-to-be is biracial so she certainly should have been aware that African-Americans experience distrust on a regular basis and are sick to death of it. And acted accordingly.
Me, when encountering a male unexpectedly in a small space - the enclosed walkway to the door - late at night - I open my mouth and want to hear what they say. Speak. Hear.
BUT, "do you live here" isn't the best opening gambit. It's accusatory and that even without knowing her tone. So much better to say "hi" and kind of apologize for blocking his space and easy access to the keypad. In response, you want to hear normality. Folks make judgments of others in seconds.
But no, I don't think she was ever afraid of him. Maybe she spoke first for the reason I would have. Maybe she spoke because she was a door-nazi (some folks get so pissy about buzzing in and detest visitors of all sizes, shapes, and colors who don't first contact tenants). Maybe she was ticked with her ex-husband and wanted to give the first black male she came across a hard time, using a nasty tone.
The man (Toles) cannot control who or what she is but can take responsibility for his own response. The proverbial high ground.
I don't know how he answered her before the phone went in her face. If he could not suppress his irritation at what she said then maybe, just maybe he should have simply swiped in and been done with her.
Instead, off he went to stereotype-land and stuck the phone in her face. I believe he was honestly upset, but for God's sake did the man have no understanding that maybe a pleasant, calming response to a woman in that small space would have been a plus. Maybe he didn't owe it to her but then she didn't owe him the opportunity to piggyback thru the open door.
And so off the pissing-match went.
Courtesy goes both ways. Earlier, in this thread someone said it best: she acted like a byitch and he like a jackass.
The framing here is if the blame here is symmetrical. It is clear to me that is not even close to symmetrical. The different ways the woman should have acted to prevent this situation from happening(ie not calling the cops on someone when she knew for a fact that he was not an intruder, not following a resident in the building and harassing him(and the idea that she was concerned for her fellow residents safety does not pass the smell test, because clearly if she was concerned about that she would be concerned for her own safety while she is following this man and harassing him) are much closer to within the norm, then what is asked of him.
If she did not want him to enter on her swipe, then she should have closed the door before he got there.
His recording this incident was completely justified based on the fact that the recording is needed to protect himself from a potential accusation of assault.
Will the effect on her life of this situation be disproportionate to her behavior in this situation. I'm sure if it will be. But he should not be the only way to bear the cost of the interaction with this woman(who I think pretty objectively is primarily at fault for situation), as he would if if this information remained private. If the situation were reversed and he had stopped this woman from entering her apartment or attempted to, and then followed her to her apartment, I'm sure the consequences for him would be much worse for him than the woman is now facing.
The framing here is if the blame here is symmetrical. It is clear to me that is not even close to symmetrical. The different ways the woman should have acted to prevent this situation from happening(ie not calling the cops on someone when she knew for a fact that he was not an intruder, not following a resident in the building and harassing him(and the idea that she was concerned for her fellow residents safety does not pass the smell test, because clearly if she was concerned about that she would be concerned for her own safety while she is following this man and harassing him) are much closer to within the norm, then what is asked of him.
If she did not want him to enter on her swipe, then she should have closed the door before he got there.
His recording this incident was completely justified based on the fact that the recording is needed to protect himself from a potential accusation of assault.
Will the effect on her life of this situation be disproportionate to her behavior in this situation. I'm sure if it will be. But he should not be the only way to bear the cost of the interaction with this woman(who I think pretty objectively is primarily at fault for situation), as he would if if this information remained private. If the situation were reversed and he had stopped this woman from entering her apartment or attempted to, and then followed her to her apartment, I'm sure the consequences for him would be much worse for him than the woman is now facing.
The problem is that the door was open. There also wouldn't have been the potential for conflict had she a cat not a dog.
That he started videoing instead of swiping did bother me. But then he was on the scene not I. And the later call to the police was excessive. Maybe I can't understand his instinctive fear that he be targeted. Just like he's not a woman.
Frankly, I'm not sure what I would have done in that situation, other than greet him pleasantly (for my reassurance IF the neighborhood was dangerous etc). But if he was non-responsive and just wanted to breeze thru the security door with no offer himself to swipe in? Or introduce himself as a new neighbor (remember, I would have spoken) ... I'd not make an issue of it.
It's all about probability, and the odds of a problem would be too low for it to be worth possible pushback (that he be offended). After all, the guy was walking away from me. Still, I probably would have watched to see if he reappeared when heading back to my unit. And thought him a jerk. If that's wrong, then, well, the world is not a good place sometimes.
Too, with the condo uptight enough about the doors that they sent out three memos, I'd feel guilty as heck about having had it open to where someone could breeze through.
As for who bore the most blame ... for that each needs to self-examine their motivations at each stage of the conflict. How it played out was not good.
What's important here is that folks be able to have rationale discussions about their various takes without it disintegrating into polemics. To talk. Otherwise, there's no hope ...
I made two different posts. The one to which you're referring was a response to a poster who was writing about race and crime. Young black men commit a wildly disproportionate percentage of crimes, specifically, violent crimes.
I don't think the woman in the video was scared. That's why I give her much credit. Many shrinking violets would not do anything, men and women alike.
It's possible this woman who married a black man is prejudiced against black people. Possible. More likely that she would have done the same to a white man, given that she had been instructed to do just what she did. Had the man not lived there and had he not been up to any good, she would've been blamed, justifiably, for allowing him in, perhaps by some of the same folks who now denigrate her.
Which isn't relevant to this post. The poster who keeps bringing that up in every post about black people has an obvious agenda.
This dingbat was completely in the wrong. I don't know if she was racially motivated or not but that doesn't matter.
She weakened security measures by standing in the doorway of an open door instead of letting it close behind her, and then nominated herself the security guard. If she was so concerned about security, she should have used some common sense and stepped two feet out letting the door close.
A big black male stands in the way of a small white female at door, suspecting she is not a resident of the building, even wanting to follow her into her room ...
A big black male stands in the way of a small white female at door, suspecting she is not a resident of the building, even wanting to follow her into her room ...
Do you see any problem?
Well, we all know which poster would come back with, 'Typical racist thug. Who does he think he is?'
A big black male stands in the way of a small white female at door, suspecting she is not a resident of the building, even wanting to follow her into her room ...
Do you see any problem?
And implausible scenario. The female would just cooperate at the door from the get go and use her key, and wouldn't be much of a safety concern to begin with.
I don't understand the difficulty with this... She doesn't need to interact with anybody but she choose to... Almost seem to me that she was trying to flirt with the guy and getting his apartment number... She just did it in a retarded way... If she feared he was an intruder than close the door.... Seems to me she wanted to play games and flirt in a weird way... She is hiding behind a fake safety issue because she got called out on it...
She saw the man actually lived in the apartment and STILL chose to harass him and call the cops. “Shes married to a black man” lmao so? Hell there are people who are black who still treat other black folks like crap. There are people who are homosexual who have no problem treating other homosexuals like crap. So being married to black man or having a distant step aunt who’s black, don’t mean a damn to me. But going to my original post...the man entered his building and his apartment and the lady still chose to screw with him. Something tells me she wouldn’t acted this way if white skinned/blue eyed/blond haired Brenda would’ve walked in the complex. And yeah there’s been plenty of cases of white people calling the cops or harasssing black people. Yes, it actually does happen. Hell I’m black and I’ve walked into a store before and I’ve been followed and questioned. But according to some of y’all, who don’t have to deal with this kinda stuff b/c you’re lucky enough to be a white skinned blue eyed person in America, it’s my fault. Hell I’ll been called the N word as well. Yes, this stuff actually does happen. It’s not fake. It’s real life. And it pisses me off when people who never have to deal with this kinda stuff are quick to label it as “fake” b/c “this stuff doesn’t happen” and “everybody is treated equally”
Hell and again the double standard here is amazing. B/c imagine if it was a black male who was questioning and demanding to know where the innocent white woman lived. Nobody would be saying “well all she had to do was tell him”
This is just my perspective on this. Some of the things you mentioned have happened to me. I've been called the "N" word to my face. The police have been called on me for incredibility stupid reasons (riding bicycle at night, looking upset, etc). I've been followed in a store and even asked to show my pockets. This kind of crap has been happening for a long time. Social media has caught up and is showing what has always been taking place.
Some people will see such things and still look for ways to justify such things happening. In my opinion, some people try to justify things like this to cover up for other issues. Deep down, there are some individuals who side with the woman in that video because some think along the lines of "Black people can't be trusted and should be viewed as an imminent threat" or "we don't want Blacks around".
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