Devastating analysis shows tax cuts had 0 effect

[Oklazona Bound]

Originally Posted by desertdetroiter

All I know is that there’s ALWAYS money for losing wars and no one questions it.

You are not listening to the right people. Unfortunately the Dems and GOP have a monopoly on the dialogue and they are all that most people hear. If there ever was a reason to break up something via anti-trust it is them.

[pknopp]

Originally Posted by Oklazona Bound

You are not listening to the right people. Unfortunately the Dems and GOP have a monopoly on the dialogue and they are all that most people hear. If there ever was a reason to break up something via anti-trust it is them.

It's hard to hear the words of the few over the demands of the vast majority.

[workingclasshero]

Originally Posted by cruitr

Nice meme. I hear it all time. And what spending would you want to cut?

if our government can not run on 15% of GDP, then we have a spending problem


we have a spending problem


we spend 2.5 trillions dollars on social programs


revenue is up since the tax cuts


we have a spending problem, not a revenue problem


we could cut almost every department by half


almost every dept could be cut in half

other areas(depts.) that could afford cuts

cut the inefficiency...cut the unnecessary

for example...the federal department of education......why does it need 7000 employees?

1. schools are state run..they have state dept of ed's
...a. while we ''may'' need the feds to set a standard..... lets say 100 academics to set standards for nation wide
...b. so total needed 100

2. yes , part of the federal dept of ed is.....pell grants......
...a. ok maybe 10 people per state to process pell requests
...b. so total needed 500

3. that totals out to a ''needed'' 600 personnel, you could even double that amount and say 1200 ....not the 7000 people on the books that we currently have


no-one is saying you cant have departments...only let's be smart about how we fund and man them....especially TO THE MISSION of said department
.
.
.
.
department of transportation....
why are we continuing to fund a failing entity of AMTRAK...???
Amtrak (part of the DOT's 130 billion dollar budget)...over 50 billion is allocated to HSR and Amtrak
why not send Amtrak the way of CONRAIL??


department of energy....16000 employees plus 94000 contractors ...with a budget sitting around 35 billion....... do we really need 100k of employees/contractors to supervise the nations power grid??

DOHUD.....11,000 employees....meanwhile it was HUD with fannie/Freddie that caused the housing bubble/bust

DOHHS....67,000 employees...with a budget near 100 billion...and that doesn't count medicare/Medicaid

DoL.......17,500 employees.... with a budget of 137 billion.......17000 employees and we cant get more people employed in America??

DOA......109,000 employees....with a budget of over 150 billion

department of state (formerly known as dept of foreign affairs).......19,000 employees......55 billion dollar budget which includes some foreign aid too

Dept of treasury.....116,000 employees (86,000 GS employees and 30,000 contractors)....do we really need over 100k employees to run the treasury???... 22 billion budget....... or which IRS....92,000 employees, to process taxes...budget about 13 billion falls under the treasury dept

DOI (dept of interior)...budget 25 billion...70,000 government employees with an additional 20,000 contractors.......now this dept is not so much of a cut in its budget...but does it really need almost 90,000 employees???



everyone of these could be cut by at least half

[desertdetroiter]

Originally Posted by craigiri

I promise they don't want to cut their own health care subsidies and unless they are paying 11K per person per year in their family, they aren't paying the true cost.

They probably don't want to cut the security state as they just attended a Mem. Day Parade and pledged to support the troops. That's about $12,000 per year per family.

After those two, most else are rounding errors.....other than interest on tax cuts.

I’ve learned that when people say “cut spending,” they’re usually talking about programs that have powerless constituents.

As soon as you say something like “yeah, let’s start at the Pentagon,” the stuttering and stammering begins. Lol

[craigiri]

Originally Posted by workingclasshero

if our government can not run on 15% of GDP, then we have a spending problem


we have a spending problem


we spend 2.5 trillions dollars on social programs
everyone of these could be cut by at least half

I see what you did there........

You took SS and Medicare, which people PAY INTO FOR DECADES, as "government spending".

You can't really cut those in any meaningful way - it would be like saying we can just ask people to turn in their ten dollar bills for fives. You can't do that.

Well, YOU CAN....but only in words. Not in the real world where we live.

Why makes things hard? The money goes to two main places - the Security State and Medical Care - that is, the EXCESS money goes there. It's easy to fret about a couple tens of billions, but we are talking MANY TRILLION PER YEAR on these two items. They represent the only relevant savings.

Sure, I can save money here at home by eating Ramen Noodles. But they represent only about .1% or less of my budget.

For folks like you and I, it pays to look at the big things...because rounding errors do not matter. War and Medical care. Just keep repeating those two numbers and you will get the drift.

The Security State isn't cut because Americans cheer for War and Law and Order. You see it every day here on C-D. The Medical costs won't be cut because we have been brainwashed to think that a capitalist system will lower the costs, when in fact the complete opposite is true.

So, tell us how you are going to convince warmongers, those who see boogeymen under their beds and those who feel that Capitalism works in medicine...otherwise?

You cannot. And so we have to accept the reality.

Heck, if was King I'd fix it. But it won't be fixed by a little here and a little there. I can promise you that.
Everyone wants their free stuff....mostly the people that complain about others free stuff...they want even more of it.

[craigiri]

Originally Posted by desertdetroiter

I’ve learned that when people say “cut spending,” they’re usually talking about programs that have powerless constituents.

As soon as you say something like “yeah, let’s start at the Pentagon,” the stuttering and stammering begins. Lol

I voted for Nader and, if I remember right, his idea was to cut it in 1/2...and maybe eventually in 1/4.

That is where it should be.

Health care costs should be reduced by 1/3rd immediately with higher goals in the future. I'd support Trump if he said he was gonna close down the Congress, Government and all trade (other than needed to feed people) until the Health Care Industry agreed to do this without one penny taken out of doctors or nurses salaries.

It can easily be done. It's already done everywhere else. And, done right both of these things would actually improve - that is, our national security would be better (it's hard to claim the trillions spent in Iraq and elsewhere have been a benefit) and our health care would be better.

We'd have to get back to that General Welfare and For the People ideal. You know, our Constitution.

As of now those ideals are clouded by money.

[workingclasshero]

Originally Posted by craigiri

I see what you did there........

You took SS and Medicare, which people PAY INTO FOR DECADES, as "government spending".

You can't really cut those in any meaningful way - it would be like saying we can just ask people to turn in their ten dollar bills for fives. You can't do that.

Well, YOU CAN....but only in words. Not in the real world where we live.

Why makes things hard? The money goes to two main places - the Security State and Medical Care - that is, the EXCESS money goes there. It's easy to fret about a couple tens of billions, but we are talking MANY TRILLION PER YEAR on these two items. They represent the only relevant savings.

Sure, I can save money here at home by eating Ramen Noodles. But they represent only about .1% or less of my budget.

For folks like you and I, it pays to look at the big things...because rounding errors do not matter. War and Medical care. Just keep repeating those two numbers and you will get the drift.

The Security State isn't cut because Americans cheer for War and Law and Order. You see it every day here on C-D. The Medical costs won't be cut because we have been brainwashed to think that a capitalist system will lower the costs, when in fact the complete opposite is true.

So, tell us how you are going to convince warmongers, those who see boogeymen under their beds and those who feel that Capitalism works in medicine...otherwise?

You cannot. And so we have to accept the reality.

Heck, if was King I'd fix it. But it won't be fixed by a little here and a little there. I can promise you that.
Everyone wants their free stuff....mostly the people that complain about others free stuff...they want even more of it.

no you don't see what I did... I did not mention SS at all (although since 2007 it has PAID OUT more than it has taken in)


I did NOT say anything about cutting SS, although I do think we should raise the qualifying age since life span have increased


apparently you cant read what is in black and grey-blue, you went right between lines and came up with I want SS cut... meanwhile what I am talking about is executive overlapping departments... you realy should work on your reading comprehension








cut the inefficiency...cut the unnecessary

for example...the federal department of education......why does it need 7000 employees?

1. schools are state run..they have state dept of ed's
...a. while we ''may'' need the feds to set a standard..... lets say 100 academics to set standards for nation wide
...b. so total needed 100

2. yes , part of the federal dept of ed is.....pell grants......
...a. ok maybe 10 people per state to process pell requests
...b. so total needed 500

3. that totals out to a ''needed'' 600 personnel, you could even double that amount and say 1200 ....not the 7000 people on the books that we currently have




and that doesn't mean hand out 6000 pink slips.... those EXCESS personnel might be NEEDED in other departments that are understaffed






no-one is saying you cant have departments...only let's be smart about how we fund and man them....especially TO THE MISSION of said department

[armourereric]

I just got an unscheduled and unexpected 7% raise because of........Tariffs, seems my retail company sees how many new, well paying entry jobs are sprouting up in my are in the furniture manufacturing industry and they felt they needed to keep up.

All these economists that show evidence of the middle class being hit hard because of tariffs and the extra $25 we now have to pay for a crappy China made table set, did they factor in how I can possibly afford that on the extra $45 a week in net pay I will now get? Oops.

[ditchoc]

Trump never does anything based on facts or data. When he wakes up he thinks 'who am I mad at today and how can I screw them' then he starts giving orders and signing EO's.

[redwood66]

Cut the entire federal budget by 10%. I am tired of the scramble at the end of the fiscal year to spend what the agencies were given so they don't get less next time. If you didn't need it all year then you don't need it.

But for me I am totally glad for the tax reform.