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So your theory if that the GOP - which was virtually 100% Northern (Yankee!) liberals, radicals and abolitionists - somehow disappeared and instantly turned into the Southern Conservatives?
You must know that is fantastic besides being untrue. The South, that is the "Republicans" of today, never accepted their loss (they wanted slaves and actually kept them in everything but name), while the North has progressed in virtually every measure from GDP to life span to other measures of happiness, productivity and freedom.
You have it backwards...unless you somehow believe that the North passed the 13th Amendment and then.....all of a sudden, the "free" South grabbed the mantle and have been leading the way ever since.
But that's not history. Read. The so-callled "Republicans" you speak of are the Northern more-Urban liberals then...as well as today. The only difference is they are called by a different name today....
Why do you think gay marriage, legal rec pot, etc. is in MA - and yet they still jail people in parts of the South for the same thing (pot)???
A very easy lesson for you would be to look at the Reps and Senators who voted for those "freedom" amendments and map them out. One and done.....
That particular poster still thinks that Republicans are the party of 'small government' so . . keep that in mind.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkeye2009
The left has had the market cornered on hate and violence, and this has been the case for decades.
If Trump wins, there will be violence among the left, as they have accepted violence as a "normal" method of dealing with issues.
LOL. Currently there are 100 investigations in the FBI involving white extremist hate groups. Wallow in your bubble.
Quote:
Originally Posted by metalmancpa
I continue to find it hard to believe that anyone will stand behind either the left or right and point a finger at the other side blaming them for the problems we face. Both sides IMHO are equally to blame for a variety of reasons. Trump is a larger than life figurehead to feed the divisiveness, but that doesn't mean it's all on him. He is a catalyst. Everyone else piles on for their own reasons - corrupt media (on both sides), extreme right & left, etc etc.
Trump is not the cause of our divided country - but he is the current end result. However, he fosters divisiveness because he think it is to his political advantage and doesn't care what it does to the country.
That's a problem.
I really don't even know where to start with this.
This whole response is a total joke, please take a reality check.
Why do you liberals cry so much about alleged income equality? Most poor people are poor because of choices they made. It's not my fault nor anyone else's. There are lots of colleges out there, and it's easy to take out loans. Just take out loans responsibly. It's not hard to better yourself in the USA, where the pursuit of happiness is guaranteed in writing.
I'll take one if you will. When you call it "alleged" income inequality, that shows me you've never read a single article of the many put out by reputable economists and such United States government offices as the the Congressional Budget Office, the IRS, White House Council of Economic Advisers, etc. Since your knowledge on this subject is so very limited, I suggest that you start with this overview from Wikipedia.
I don't recall assigning blame on you or anyone else for the problems of income inequality and poverty in the United States. Still, if the shoe fits...
Yep, plenty of colleges - especially the for profits - love to make it easy for young people to take out loans for their often subpar degrees. That was one of your president's fav grifter routines. Alas, the courts took him off that particular sugar teat and Trump was forced to turn to Putin to make up the difference with a new Trump hotel in Moscow. Stay tuned for their continued adventures.
And even people with valid degrees are saddled with a mountain of student debt to pay off these days. As a result, their lifetime earnings can be severely impacted. The "pursuit of happiness" is just another vacant phrase without action to back it up. The U.S. was ranked the 6th from the last among 173 countries (4th percentile) on income equality measured by the Gini index. I'd say that the US is all hat and no cattle when it comes to pretty mottos that in effect are meaningless.
Now, I'm sure that you'll want to go fire someone or agitate to have your company's production shipped to some overseas sweatshop/deathtrap. The US workers who once held decent paying, made in the USA jobs are now out pursuing second and third jobs that pay crap, but what do you care?
I'm in the middle, too, but the shenanigans on the right and Trump's corrupt administration have made me want to go farther left. Trump's audacity w/ the Russians was my dividing line for sure. You can get over a lot, but I feel his traitorous behavior, as well as Republicans enabling him, is something I couldn't ally with.
I turned to a 3rd party choice this past election because I wasn't thrilled about Clinton or Trump.
As for Trump's behavior, that really does disturb me. Trump has engaged in some very disturbing things. That traitorous behavior you just described is just at the tip. At first he was taunting Kim Jung Un. Now he's trying to buddy up to Kim Jung Un. Kim Jung Un is crazy. Anyone who can execute their own blood relative is crazy enough to launch a nuke on us.
I find it weird that the President would buddy up to Putin and Kim Jung Un, but wants to slam the door shut on Cuba. Cuba is not a threat to America.
And other things get to me. He has proven to be unhinged and bigoted. He has claimed that former President Obama wasn't a citizen. He also got very racial when he tweeted about the Baltimore riots, going as far as to blame former President Obama. His "look at my African-American over there" comment at a rally in Redding, California. And then he retweeted a racist tweet from a Neo-Nazi twitter account, which had some very false statistics about Black crime, which also listed a source that doesn't exist. Basically, President Trump has shown over and over to be crass and brutish, as well as bigoted. He doesn't know when to just shut up. And what's sadder, many people love this about him.
So your theory if that the GOP - which was virtually 100% Northern (Yankee!) liberals, radicals and abolitionists - somehow disappeared and instantly turned into the Southern Conservatives?
You must know that is fantastic besides being untrue. The South, that is the "Republicans" of today, never accepted their loss (they wanted slaves and actually kept them in everything but name), while the North has progressed in virtually every measure from GDP to life span to other measures of happiness, productivity and freedom.
You have it backwards...unless you somehow believe that the North passed the 13th Amendment and then.....all of a sudden, the "free" South grabbed the mantle and have been leading the way ever since.
But that's not history. Read. The so-callled "Republicans" you speak of are the Northern more-Urban liberals then...as well as today. The only difference is they are called by a different name today....
Why do you think gay marriage, legal rec pot, etc. is in MA - and yet they still jail people in parts of the South for the same thing (pot)???
A very easy lesson for you would be to look at the Reps and Senators who voted for those "freedom" amendments and map them out. One and done.....
Nope, apparently, that's your theory though. My argument is that the GOP has not moved very much from it's earliest founding ideas. The party has always been conservative in the sense that conservatism is centered on the idea that the individual should hold supreme and in order to protect the individual, we must uphold the founding values of the rule of law, private property, an emphasis on trade and business and economic development. These values have been the foundation of the GOP since the 1850s.
I'll take one if you will. When you call it "alleged" income inequality, that shows me you've never read a single article of the many put out by reputable economists and such United States government offices as the the Congressional Budget Office, the IRS, White House Council of Economic Advisers, etc. Since your knowledge on this subject is so very limited, I suggest that you start with this overview from Wikipedia.
I don't recall assigning blame on you or anyone else for the problems of income inequality and poverty in the United States. Still, if the shoe fits...
Yep, plenty of colleges - especially the for profits - love to make it easy for young people to take out loans for their often subpar degrees. That was one of your president's fav grifter routines. Alas, the courts took him off that particular sugar teat and Trump was forced to turn to Putin to make up the difference with a new Trump hotel in Moscow. Stay tuned for their continued adventures.
And even people with valid degrees are saddled with a mountain of student debt to pay off these days. As a result, their lifetime earnings can be severely impacted. The "pursuit of happiness" is just another vacant phrase without action to back it up. The U.S. was ranked the 6th from the last among 173 countries (4th percentile) on income equality measured by the Gini index. I'd say that the US is all hat and no cattle when it comes to pretty mottos that in effect are meaningless.
Now, I'm sure that you'll want to go fire someone or agitate to have your company's production shipped to some overseas sweatshop/deathtrap. The US workers who once held decent paying, made in the USA jobs are now out pursuing second and third jobs that pay crap, but what do you care?
Thanks for the Wikipedia link, great source.
Go give poor people your money, I'm not stopping you.
Sounds like you want a lot of government control in your life, that's your business.
And what are you meandering on about the economy about-- have you checked it lately? The Dow has never been this high in history... The GDP is up. Unemployment is low. I would take liberals' Trump bashing a little more seriously if he hadn't accomplished diddly squat, but he has. He's done more good for us than any President in my lifetime. He can't be bought and he's not a milquetoast.
In the mid-19th century, this kind of polarization resulted in the Civil War, but as there are now a great many extreme liberals and extreme conservatives in almost every area of the U.S. (with some notable exceptions, I think), how do you think this will eventually resolve?
1. That the liberals or extreme liberals will prevail
2. That the conservatives or extreme conservatives will prevail
3. That people will eventually learn to live mostly in harmony with each other after some kind of "give" on both sides
4. That things will continue as they are indefinitely, with extremists on both sides continuing to strongly dislike (or even hate) those who disagree with them on some issues
5. Other?
Also, do you think that there will be an increase in both the frequency and intensity of violent confrontations between extremists (of either or both parties), or not?
(Just looking for immediate "off the cuff" opinions here, which is why I did not post this in Great Debates.)
I don't know. Neither side will prevail. The extreme left will have some gains, but not the gains that they want such as immigration, and homosexuality. The right will keep traditional norms, but new norms will be placed into this nations culture by the left via academia and media apparatus. We as a society will learn to live with one another and move one. Every so often this type of hiccups will happen, those that be will try to move the Overton Window to see what is acceptable norms to speak of.
As for violence. We have seen a lot of violence on both sides of the story. But the left controls the media apparatus, and if someone from the left does something wrong, such incidents wont get as much traction. What makes this period horrible is Social Media. Social Media allows echo-chambers to broadcast their views to other people to share and to like. As for violence in this period. We have seen white nationalist like Dillon Woof, and Alex Fields commit acts of hate killing or injuring people, we have seen Incel/Mgtow Eliot Roger shoot people for not getting laid, We have seen a pro black/conscious person kill nearly dozen cops in Dallas, we have social justice activist hitting people with bike locks, and beating up gay people like Andy Ngo on the street. So far we have yet to see radical militant feminist from doing acts of violence compared to other echo chambers. I'm not sure of Vegas shooter Paddock is part of the left. He opened gunfire on a crowd of country music attendees at a concert. All I have to say is that violence is never the answer, and dialogue is key in order to remove hate.
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