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Education does not create a citizen. Education creates innovation.
Mass government education was created in the 1800's, and its primary purpose was to train workers for the factories. As the video I linked in my previous post explains, the government education system was invented in Prussia, who created it to train workers and soldiers. It regiments our behavior, tells us our duties and obligations as citizens, teaches us the social rules, and conditions us to accept authority. In the early years here in America, its primary impetus was to assimilate children, many of whom were born in foreign countries and didn't speak English. It attempted to instill in them some sense of civic duty/loyalty. Why do you think preschoolers pledge their allegiance to the flag? Do you think that is normal behavior?
The purpose of the government education system is to produce workers for the capitalists, and soldiers to fight in their wars. Prior to the government education system, education was primarily carried out by the church. And the goal of the church was to train clergy, and future leaders. You're not going to be here forever, someone will eventually have to do your job. The same is true for Kings, Princes, Emperors, Dukes, Presidents, Prime Ministers, and everyone else.
You claim that the purpose of education is innovation, but in what way does government education encourage creativity? In what way does it encourage independent thinking? No, it trains you that there is only one right answer. Only one way to do things. Its job is not to make you a free-thinker, but to program you to do what you're told.
That is why it exists here, that is why it exists in China, and Russia, and North Korea, and everywhere else.
"The plain fact is that education is itself a form of propaganda - a deliberate scheme to outfit the pupil, not with the capacity to weigh ideas, but with a simple appetite for gulping ideas ready-made. The aim is to make 'good' citizens, which is to say, docile and uninquisitive citizens." - H.L. Mencken
"The most erroneous assumption is to the effect that the aim of public education is to fill the young of the species with knowledge and awaken their intelligence, and so make them fit to discharge the duties of citizenship in an enlightened and independent manner. Nothing could be further from the truth. The aim of public education is not to spread enlightenment at all; it is simply to reduce as many individuals as possible to the same safe level, to breed and train a standardized citizenry, to put down dissent and originality. That is its aim in the United States, whatever the pretensions of politicians, pedagogues and other such mountebanks, and that is its aim everywhere else." - H.L. Mencken
"The most urgent necessity is, not that the State should teach, but that it should allow education. All monopolies are detestable, but the worst of all is the monopoly of education." - Frederick Bastiat
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ellis Bell
Find me a red-blooded American, a family, or a tribe, that predates the founding of this country.
Thomas Jefferson and George Washington predated the founding of the country. The Cherokees predated the founding of the country. What do you even mean by this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ellis Bell
None of which were forced to be here, the u.s. did not seek them out to import them. They are immigrants that chose to move here of their own free will. However, if some people get their way, we will never let another great mind enter our country again. Tesla who only had 4 cents to his name, would be hard pressed to find the u.s. citizen accommodating to say the least, if his arrival were today.
What makes a life worth living? Is it Cell Phones? Internet? Amazon Prime? Television? Youtube? What is it that you want? Will it make you happy? Will it be the utopia you think it will be?
The premise you put forth is obviously true. The more humans in a country, the more brains, the more people solving problems, inventing technologies, etc. In fact, your logic is effectively an argument in favor of a one-world government. Which can pool all of the intelligence, ability, knowledge, ambition, and resources of the world together.
But is that what you really want?
Last edited by Redshadowz; 05-27-2021 at 01:45 AM..
Find me a red-blooded American, a family, or a tribe, that predates the founding of this country.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redshadowz
Thomas Jefferson and George Washington predated the founding of the country. The Cherokees predated the founding of the country. What do you even mean by this?
Thomas Jefferson, was born on April 13, 1743 (April 2, 1743, Old Style, Julian calendar), at the family home in Shadwell Plantation in the Colony of Virginia, the third of ten children. He was of English, and possibly Welsh, descent and was born a British subject.
George Washington, Washington's great-grandfather John Washington immigrated in 1656 from Sulgrave, Northamptonshire, England ...
Jefferson was English, maybe Welsh, not descended from someone of America. George Washington's ancestors were from Sulgrave, Northamptonshire, England, not a decedent from someone of America.
America was founded on an ideal, not an ancestral bloodline, like every other country around the globe. People believe by allowing immigrants into this country, it will change --- it has been changing from the day of its birth.
The first American born goes to a woman by the name of Virginia Dare, born in 1587. Her ancestors were English.
Now as for as our views on education we will have to agree to disagree, or find an uneducated productive yet innovative person in our midst. PS: I may watch your videos when and if I find the time to do so. What do I want? I want to live forever. America is a great story; I want to see how it ends.
Last edited by Ellis Bell; 05-27-2021 at 02:14 AM..
Reason: added ps
As for bloodline, I'm not even sure what that's supposed to mean. Britain was an Empire with subjects of all races. Same with France and Spain. This is what the map of the world looked like in 1776.
The concept of nations being bloodlines didn't develop until the rise of nationalism in the post-Napoleonic era. Especially with concepts like Woodrow Wilson's "Self-determination", which led to the partition of the Austrian and Ottoman empires into ethno-nationalist states. The United States barred citizenship to non-whites until the 14th amendment, and prevented anyone but white people from becoming naturalized as citizens until post-WWII.
This is what the Austrian Empire looked like before WWI.
The United States was founded as an empire. It is the Roman Empire. And the Roman Empire was a multiracial and multiethnic trading empire. It's goal was world domination. And to expand its borders it had to absorb its neighbors, culturally and racially, first as slaves then as citizens. They were by far the most advanced civilization of their time, with a city of a million people, with aqueducts, roads, bridges, libraries. They had the greatest scientists, the greatest inventors, the greatest mathematicians, who came from all over the empire, and beyond.
Is that the ideal you're talking about?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ellis Bell
What do I want? I want to live forever. America is a great story; I want to see how it ends.
It only sounds like a great story because you have fictionalized it. America is not the noble idealist nation of your imagination. It is a cynical, power-hungry, often genocidal nation, whose only value is money. Either it will conquer and Americanize the entire world, or it will collapse from its expansionist desire to occupy and vassalize too many countries.
I don't trust anyone who wants to live forever. By definition they are atheistic and materialistic.
Last edited by Redshadowz; 05-27-2021 at 07:33 AM..
As for bloodline, I'm not even sure what that's supposed to mean. Britain was an Empire with subjects of all races. Same with France and Spain. This is what the map of the world looked like in 1776.
The concept of nations being bloodlines didn't develop until the rise of nationalism in the post-Napoleonic era. Especially with concepts like Woodrow Wilson's "Self-determination", which led to the partition of the Austrian and Ottoman empires into ethno-nationalist states. The United States barred citizenship to non-whites until the 14th amendment, and prevented anyone but white people from becoming naturalized as citizens until post-WWII.
This is what the Austrian Empire looked like before WWI.
The United States was founded as an empire. It is the Roman Empire. And the Roman Empire was a multiracial and multiethnic trading empire. It's goal was world domination. And to expand its borders it had to absorb its neighbors, culturally and racially, first as slaves then as citizens. They were by far the most advanced civilization of their time, with a city of a million people, with aqueducts, roads, bridges, libraries. They had the greatest scientists, the greatest inventors, the greatest mathematicians, who came from all over the empire, and beyond.
Is that the ideal you're talking about?
It only sounds like a great story because you have fictionalized it. America is not the noble idealist nation of your imagination. It is a cynical, power-hungry, often genocidal nation, whose only value is money. Either it will conquer and Americanize the entire world, or it will collapse from its expansionist desire to occupy and vassalize too many countries.
I don't trust anyone who wants to live forever. By definition they are atheistic and materialistic.
One-day you may realize your mortality and its going to scare the begebees out of you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redshadowz
Is that the ideal you're talking about?
The five founding ideals of American are the ideas that our country focuses on and is built around.
Democracy : a government when the power is in the hands of the people.
“Congress have judged it necessary to dissolve the Connection between Great Britain and the American Colonies. . . .”
John Hancock to George Washington, July 6, 1776
Out of 195 countries globally we are the only country of its kind --- the people's beliefs and their cultures are all tied to the country in which they live along with their ancestral heritage. (the bloodline) It's the reason that a German is a German no matter where they are born. An Italian is an Italian no matter where they are born. A Frenchman is a Frenchman no matter where they are born. Etc.
But an American is only an American if they are born in the u.s.
People come here because they too believe in the American's founding ideas --- it isn't the cuisine.
One-day you may realize your mortality and its going to scare the begebees out of you.
Why would I be afraid of dying? What would I be afraid of? What are you afraid of?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ellis Bell
Democracy, Rights, Liberty, Opportunity, Equality
Who were the founding fathers and what did they want? Did they want democracy? Did they care about your rights? These men were slave-owners who were genociding the natives, that did everything they could to prevent democracy. Including restricting it to only rich white men, even after erecting institutional barriers reducing it to impotence.
As Alexander Hamilton said... "All communities divide themselves into the few and the many. The first are the rich and well born, the other the mass of the people.... The people are turbulent and changing; they seldom judge or determine right. Give therefore to the first class a distinct, permanent share in the government. They will check the unsteadiness of the second, and as they cannot receive any advantage by change, they therefore will ever maintain good government."
You have to let go of your childish fantasy that George Washington was fighting for you. No, he was fighting for himself. The founding fathers were all rich men, half owned slaves. The notion that they were fighting for freedom is utterly absurd.
"People do not go to war for abstract theories of government. They fight for property and privilege." - W.E.B. Dubois
So what did Alexander Hamilton want? Was he not free under the British? I'll tell you what he wanted, he wanted to overthrow the British aristocracy because he wasn't an aristocrat, and then establish himself, and other rich and influential men like himself, as the new rulers.
"Who are the aristocrats? Philosophy may answer "The Wise and Good." But the World, Mankind, have by their practice always answered, "the rich, the beautiful, and the well-born." And philosophers themselves in marrying their children prefer the rich, the handsome, and the well-descended to the wise and good. What chance have talents and virtues in a competition with wealth, birth, and beauty? The five pillars of aristocracy are beauty, wealth, birth, genius, and virtues. Any one of the three first can at any time over bear any one or both of the two last.
You may laugh at the introduction of beauty among the pillars of aristocracy. But Madame Barry says "true royalty is beauty", and there is not a more certain truth. Beauty, grace, figure, attitude, movement, have in innumerable instances prevailed over wealth, birth, talents, virtues and every thing else. In men of the highest rank, greatest power, and sometimes, the most exalted genius, greatest fame, and highest merit."
Hamilton believed that the rich and well-born should use the institutions they control, to manipulate the people through "fear and greed". From the article.... "Hamilton accepted Hume’s conclusion that men are motivated by their passions, and the strongest passion is greed. A government that could use men’s greed to motivate them to support the government would become rich and powerful... Shays’s Rebellion in 1786 and 1787 strengthened his fear of democracy and his belief in the necessity of an effective national government to protect the property of wealthy men who would, in turn, support that government."
People come here because they too believe in the American's founding ideas --- it isn't the cuisine.
People come here for money. That is the only reason they are here. If there was more money somewhere else, they would go there. If we were poor no one would come here, except maybe to exploit us, as we do to poor countries.
Everything you believe is a lie. So why do you believe it? Or better yet, who told you it?
Who were the founding fathers and what did they want? Did they want democracy? Did they care about your rights? These men were slave-owners who were genociding the natives, that did everything they could to prevent democracy. Including restricting it to only rich white men, even after erecting institutional barriers reducing it to impotence.
As Alexander Hamilton said... "All communities divide themselves into the few and the many. The first are the rich and well born, the other the mass of the people.... The people are turbulent and changing; they seldom judge or determine right. Give therefore to the first class a distinct, permanent share in the government. They will check the unsteadiness of the second, and as they cannot receive any advantage by change, they therefore will ever maintain good government."
You have to let go of your childish fantasy that George Washington was fighting for you. No, he was fighting for himself. The founding fathers were all rich men, half owned slaves. The notion that they were fighting for freedom is utterly absurd.
"People do not go to war for abstract theories of government. They fight for property and privilege." - W.E.B. Dubois
So what did Alexander Hamilton want? Was he not free under the British? I'll tell you what he wanted, he wanted to overthrow the British aristocracy because he wasn't an aristocrat, and then establish himself, and other rich and influential men like himself, as the new rulers.
"Who are the aristocrats? Philosophy may answer "The Wise and Good." But the World, Mankind, have by their practice always answered, "the rich, the beautiful, and the well-born." And philosophers themselves in marrying their children prefer the rich, the handsome, and the well-descended to the wise and good. What chance have talents and virtues in a competition with wealth, birth, and beauty? The five pillars of aristocracy are beauty, wealth, birth, genius, and virtues. Any one of the three first can at any time over bear any one or both of the two last.
You may laugh at the introduction of beauty among the pillars of aristocracy. But Madame Barry says "true royalty is beauty", and there is not a more certain truth. Beauty, grace, figure, attitude, movement, have in innumerable instances prevailed over wealth, birth, talents, virtues and every thing else. In men of the highest rank, greatest power, and sometimes, the most exalted genius, greatest fame, and highest merit."
Then what does this country need to do? Hold a constitutional convention to reset the country to reflect the year is 2021, rather than 1790 when the Constitution got ratified?
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