Supreme Court case on Asian discrimination (stats, Hispanic, Massachusetts, support)
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It is not as if Ivy Leagues do not have any asian. As long as they have a handful, they are not discriminating. Most probably do have more than a handful.
How is this plaintiff suppose to prove he is being discriminated against when all the schools have plenty of asians? They feel some other minorities with less credentials add more to the culture of the school than this lone asian. That is all they need to state.
Since when does the prevalence of one demographic constitute non-discrimination against an individual? So as long as I hire a token Black guy, I can automatically reject all other Black candidates for jobs. Is that your logic?
It's truly funny to see the whole *well the tests are unfair* crap dying out.
Or that you can just test prep yourself up several levels with money.
BS. I tutored Div 1 football players at a major university that was hard to get into. They didn't know poop. They didn't score low because the tests were unfair, they scored low because their grasp of math was below algebra and they read like a 6th grader at best.
Here's my take on this as someone who has gone through this process with two mixed race Asian/Caucasian kids. I also go a unique insight as to how Asians, particularly Chinese, students/parents approach the college admissions process through my wife's network.
First of all, a GPA of 4.6 and 1590 SATs does not guarantee you admission to elite schools. They have ~5% acceptance rates and likely reject a good number of students with these scores. The main difference between students that get accepted to elite schools and those that don't is in the extracurricular activities. A lot of students, particularly Asians, have perfect SATs and take a lot of AP courses.
These elite schools are looking to develop the next generation of leaders (presidents, top executives, Supreme Court justices, etc.), not necessarily middle-managers or executives. And hence look at what students do beyond grades and standardized tests. Many Asians treat the grades as primary and extracurriculars as box checking. Case in point, at my daughters high-performing and heavily Asian high school, the principal had to limit the number of clubs formed by students. It was common for four, usually Asian, students to start a club based on some interesting topic, and assign themselves the president, VP, secretary and treasurer positions so they could put an extracurricular 'leadership' role on their applications. Admissions counselors put very little value on these extracurriculars. For better or worse, participation in team sports is seen as a proxy for leadership in the US. Yet there's almost never Asian students on the football or basketball teams.
Another extracurricular scam is voluntourism, where a family would take a vacation that had some volunteering component and use this as the community service 'box check'. Admissions counselors put very little value on these versus sustained community service of some sort.
Thus, a lower acceptance rate at elite private schools for Asians is not necessarily evidence of 'discrimination'. Things are different at state schools that have to focus on objective, quantifiable metrics. UC Berkeley is 40% Asian versus 15% or the overall California population.
And the kneel-down funny thing about all this............according to Krueger and Dale between a cadre of kids graduating Harvard vs. a like cadre graduating Middle Tennessee vs. another like cadre graduating say Texas A&M years on there will be no identifiable difference between the three. It's all about IQ + drive and zero about where kids earn their UG degree nothing else matters much at all.
it's truly funny to see the whole *well the tests are unfair* crap dying out.
Or that you can just test prep yourself up several levels with money.
Bs. I tutored div 1 football players at a major university that was hard to get into. They didn't know poop. they didn't score low because the tests were unfair, they scored low because their grasp of math was below algebra and they read like a 6th grader at best.
I still want to know " Who" told him that. What administration talks like that,lol.
A non-affiliated advisor told him that.
Let's be frank.......a black kid with 1580ish SAT and way over 4.00 honors/AP adjusted SAT and nothing else would be limo'd into any ivy, Stanford, Harvey Mudd and probably MIT without much thought.
And the kneel-down funny thing about all this............according to Krueger and Dale between a cadre of kids graduating Harvard vs. a like cadre graduating Middle Tennessee vs. another like cadre graduating say Texas A&M years on there will be no identifiable difference between the three. It's all about IQ + drive and zero about where kids earn their UG degree nothing else matters much at all.
It is true that once you get hired, your performance matters more than where you went to school. However, graduates of prestigious schools have more opportunities to join prestigious firms.
It is true that once you get hired, your performance matters more than where you went to school. However, graduates of prestigious schools have more opportunities to join prestigious firms.
I say good for the kid. In this country you have to fight for what you want. And that's what he is doing.
According to the only study I've seen, there are actually two closely related studies by Krueger and Dale, at the undergraduate level given roughly the same inbound metrics where one goes to school does not matter.
1. Graduate and professional schooling is a different matter but again I'd bet that ultra high achiever A going to Harvard Law and ultra high achiever B going to Texas and ultra high achiever C going to Miami end up similarly years on.
2. A niece works at a Vault 5-ish law firm in NYC. She graduated from a second rate college and a second rate law school (well outside USN's top 50) mostly because she was awarded a sweet scholarship. Going to Harvard Law, or any other top brand name school, wouldn't have helped her in any way that I can see.
Because Harvard has already said it's based on race? They've argued in court that Asians don't have the right 'personality' for their school. Imagine if that were applied to any other minority...
If anyone wants to see real institutional racism, this is it. Either they believe Asians have one monolithic personality, or they want to limit the number of Asian students. Which choice is NOT racist?
Are you arguing that if the top 80% of applicants to Harvard are Asian, then the incoming class should be 80% Asian? Harvard gets to mix up the incoming class. All of this arguing over "merit only" is ridiculous, because there is no hard seriatim of applicants. Like any other process, it's nature is a bell curve of abilities and skills. Picking at random from the right side of the curve isn't racist or anything else, those applicants are statistically indistinguishable.
And I gotta wonder why folks think the Ivys are all that. Face it, their football teams suck. If you want to go to a top of the top school, here's your list:
Alabama
Ohio State
Georgia
Clemson
Michigan
Note that their order is dynamic, and one bad snap can reshuffle the standings.
And yes Asian students attend these schools - Ohio State has approx 5% Asian student population..
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They didn't score low because the tests were unfair, they scored low because their grasp of math was below algebra and they read like a 6th grader at best.
