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Explaining things to certain posters is a waste of my time, obviously.
Your the one that made the statement that you were responding to "news", and then when called on it, this is your best response.. Man, that was pathetic..
Since when have conservatives ever cared what other nations think?
Also, the problem with Hoover, allegedly, wasn't Johnson, who had a checkered sexual history that Hoover knew about, but with the Mafia. Hoover for years and years wouldn't recognize the existence of organized crime in America because the Mafia had compromising pics of him and, I assume, his assistant Clyde in compromising positions.
But that is the very thing openness about homosexuality would stop. Homosexuality is an inborn behavior. It isn't a choice. Therefore, tolerance of it prevents not just rank discrimination, but folks having to cover it up in order to stay employed or to maintain their hold on their political offices.
Let's just mind our own business, okay? Even the biggest conservative out there doesn't believe in the death penalty for adultery like the Bible calls for. And it won't hurt society to treat homosexuality as normal (though just as with lefthanders, a minority).
Homosexuality is not normal, so why treat it that way? I do not think that anyone sane advocates harrassing gays or mistreating them in any fashion, but I think it is a reach to say being gay is "normal".
Caring what other countries think is not the issue. I don't care what other countries think. I do care about the ability of a president to be taken seriously and in a fashion that would not compromise thier ability to lead. This requires interraction on some level with leaders of different countries- some of which have the death penalty for homosexuality. How do you think that would go over?
Homosexuality is not normal, so why treat it that way? I do not think that anyone sane advocates harrassing gays or mistreating them in any fashion, but I think it is a reach to say being gay is "normal".
Well, people who study these things for a living disagree with you. The consensus among doctors and scientists is that it is normal.
Is homosexuality a mental disorder?
No, lesbian, gay, and bisexual orientations are not disorders. Research has found no inherent association between any of these sexual orientations and psychopathology. Both heterosexual behavior and homosexual behavior are normal aspects of human sexuality. Both have been documented in many different cultures and historical eras. Despite the persistence of stereotypes that portray lesbian, gay, and bisexual people as disturbed, several decades of research and clinical experience have led all mainstream medical and mental health organizations in this country to conclude that these orientations represent normal forms of human experience. Lesbian, gay, and bisexual relationships are normal forms of human bonding.
Well, people who study these things for a living disagree with you. The consensus among doctors and scientists is that it is normal.
Is homosexuality a mental disorder?
No, lesbian, gay, and bisexual orientations are not disorders. Research has found no inherent association between any of these sexual orientations and psychopathology. Both heterosexual behavior and homosexual behavior are normal aspects of human sexuality. Both have been documented in many different cultures and historical eras. Despite the persistence of stereotypes that portray lesbian, gay, and bisexual people as disturbed, several decades of research and clinical experience have led all mainstream medical and mental health organizations in this country to conclude that these orientations represent normal forms of human experience. Lesbian, gay, and bisexual relationships are normal forms of human bonding.
The diagnostic status of homosexuality in DSM-III: a reformulation of the issues
RL Spitzer
[SIZE=-1][/SIZE]In 1973 homosexuality per se was removed from the DSM-II classification of mental disorders and replaced by the category Sexual Orientation Disturbance. This represented a compromise between the view that preferential homosexuality is invariably a mental disorder and the view that it is merely a normal sexual variant. While the 1973 DSM-II controversy was highly public, more recently a related but less public controversy involved what became the DSM-III category of Ego-dystonic Homosexuality. The author presents the DSM-III controversy and a reformulation of the issues involved in the diagnostic status of homosexuality. He argues that what is at issue is a value judgment about heterosexuality, rather than a factual dispute about homosexuality.
Homosexuality was removed from the DSM classification as a political, not a medical process. Gays have been shown repeatedly to have a higher incidence of affective disorders (principally depression). While I do not have anything against gays, I have never met one who had thier head screwed on straight.
Homosexuality was removed from the DSM classification as a political, not a medical process.
Do you have any proof of this?
Quote:
Gays have been shown repeatedly to have a higher incidence of affective disorders (principally depression). While I do not have anything against gays, I have never met one who had thier head screwed on straight.
My understanding is that gay men have affective disorders at rates that are similar to heterosexual women, but that certainly doesn't mean that all homosexuals are mentally ill any more than it means all heterosexual women are mentally ill.
And aside from affective disorders that occur naturally, with the stigma associated with homosexuality, it's not surprising that homosexuals experience higher rates of depression.
If someone wants to theorize that homosexuality is a birth defect, I can accept that argument as a point of debate, but to say that homosexual attractions are a result of a mental disorder strains credulity. It assumes that homosexuals were really meant to be heterosexual, but because of a mental or emotional disorder, they turned out homosexual. That doesn't add up, especially since we now know there are differences in the brain structures between gay men and straight men.
It's not 1973 anymore. A lot has been learned about sexual orientation since then.
Last edited by AnUnidentifiedMale; 07-08-2009 at 05:53 PM..
My understanding is that gay men have affective disorders at rates that are similar to heterosexual women, but that certainly doesn't mean that all homosexuals are mentally ill any more than it means all heterosexual women are mentally ill.
And aside from affective disorders that occur naturally, with the stigma associated with homosexuality, it's not surprising that homosexuals experience higher rates of depression.
If someone wants to theorize that homosexuality is a birth defect, I can accept that argument as a point of debate, but to say that homosexual attractions are a result of a mental disorder strains credulity. It assumes that homosexuals were really mean to be heterosexual, but because of a mental or emotional disorder, they turned out homosexual. That doesn't add up, especially since we now know there are differences in the brain structures between gay men and straight men.
It's not 1973 anymore. A lot has been learned about sexual orientation since then.
I think it is genetic, and not learned. However, there are mental disorders that have a genetic componant. Given cultural taboos against homosexuality, I would expect gays to have a higher incidence of depression as well. I do not think this is a lifestyle that any would choose (if they actually had a choice). It would create more difficulties socially than being straight. That being said, I don't think that anyone could deny that being female with a buzz cut, big belt buckle, and boots is normal. Nor is it normal for a guy to be interested in decorating, fashion, and to have an effeminate voice. There are exceptions to the stereotypes, but the exception proves the rule.
In medical school , we were told by staff psychiatrists who participated in the formulation of the DSM 1 and beyond that the elimination of homosexuality from the DSM classification was a political move that corresponded to the rise of the gay agenda in the 1970s. Many thought it should have never been removed. I would tend to agree,as I think that it may provide a better avenue for increased tolerance if the general public simply accepted it as a disorder which cannot be helped.
I personally do not have anything against gays at all. Whatever they want to do in thier own house is okay. However, if they enter the political arena as a public servant, thier personal life open to examination. The president needs to be squeeky clean and I do not think that someone living the gay lifestyle would be able to hold up under public scrutiny.
My understanding is that gay men have affective disorders at rates that are similar to heterosexual women, but that certainly doesn't mean that all homosexuals are mentally ill any more than it means all heterosexual women are mentally ill.
And aside from affective disorders that occur naturally, with the stigma associated with homosexuality, it's not surprising that homosexuals experience higher rates of depression.
If someone wants to theorize that homosexuality is a birth defect, I can accept that argument as a point of debate, but to say that homosexual attractions are a result of a mental disorder strains credulity. It assumes that homosexuals were really mean to be heterosexual, but because of a mental or emotional disorder, they turned out homosexual. That doesn't add up, especially since we now know there are differences in the brain structures between gay men and straight men.
It's not 1973 anymore. A lot has been learned about sexual orientation since then.
I agree. I don't believe homosexuality is a mental disorder. I'm still convinced that it's some sort of genetic variant that causes a relatively small percentage of the population to be sexually orientated toward the same gender. I think the incidence of this genetic variant is low because probably, historically, homosexuals didn't reproduce that much. But I believe the incidence of homosexuality is going to steadily increase due to homosexuals being able to reproduce using their own eggs/sperm via all kinds of fertility methods (in-vitro artificial insemination, surrogates, etc.). I'm not saying that homosexuals necessarily have homosexual children, but the possibility is there if my theory of homosexuality being a genetic issue is true.
But then again, I'm not a scientist, so I'm just speculating.
Also don't forget that gay men also have sex with women and have children that way too.
The most current research shows gayness to be a brain formation issue.
Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerCaliforniaGirl
I agree. I don't believe homosexuality is a mental disorder. I'm still convinced that it's some sort of genetic variant that causes a relatively small percentage of the population to be sexually orientated toward the same gender. I think the incidence of this genetic variant is low because probably, historically, homosexuals didn't reproduce that much. But I believe the incidence of homosexuality is going to steadily increase due to homosexuals being able to reproduce using their own eggs/sperm via all kinds of fertility methods (in-vitro artificial insemination, surrogates, etc.)
I had just come out of a heated and nasty debate regarding homosexuality with a couple of other posters, and I had my knickers in a twist, so I was being insolent.
I wouldn't NOT vote for a presidential candidate just because he/she was homosexual. I doubt that would factor in at all for me.
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