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I'm almost certain that most (if not all) of the black posters on here can relate to this in some form or fashion:
You're watching the evening news. Story comes on about a horrendous crime that has put the community on edge. Much to your chagrin, you discover that the perp is, yep, black. You sigh, shake your head. "It just had to be another brother". A strike against your race - a strike against you.
You see a rowdy group of black kids on the street - thugs, if you will - causing quite a disturbance. You notice the reactions of the white folks that pass by. Fright, indignation, disdain. Another strike. You sigh, shake your head again. "Why can't they just act right?"
Black guilt.
So you accommodate. You go about town, trying your best not to appear in any way "threatening". You make it a point to speak clearly and politely. If you see a woman with a worried look coming toward you on the sidewalk, you already know what's coming - you cross the street first just to avoid the tension and inevitable indignity. Your heart beats a little faster every time you walk into a bank, a convenience store, a high-end retailer. You want to project innocence, trying your hardest not to make any sudden or "suspicious" moves. But you're already enveloped in a sea of guilt once you set foot in that door.
Black guilt.
We've already heard a good deal about so-called "white guilt", which has more or less been described as an attitude characterized by some moral inclination on the part of white people to redress the historical (and present) wrongs caused by whites against people of color. The chief contention from many whites critical of this attitude is that they have nothing to feel "guilty" about, as neither they nor their ancestors had any direct role in the oppression of minorities.
Fair enough. But I fail to see the same principle being applied to hard-working, upstanding black people, almost as if it is assumed that white guilt's corollary, "black guilt", is just something that blacks who are playing by the rules have to deal with. That is to say, it is up to us "good" blacks to compensate for the shortcomings of our "not-so-good" counterparts, to bear the burden of everything wrong in the black community, as if we had a direct say in it.
So my question is this: Should blacks who are doing the right thing feel any more "guilty" about the social ills perpetrated by other blacks than non-racist, fair-minded whites should about the racism and oppression perpetrated by other whites?
Location: The Land Mass Between NOLA and Mobile, AL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSykes
I'm almost certain that most (if not all) of the black posters on here can relate to this in some form or fashion:
You're watching the evening news. Story comes on about a horrendous crime that has put the community on edge. Much to your chagrin, you discover that the perp is, yep, black. You sigh, shake your head. "It just had to be another brother". A strike against your race - a strike against you.
You see a rowdy group of black kids on the street - thugs, if you will - causing quite a disturbance. You notice the reactions of the white folks that pass by. Fright, indignation, disdain. Another strike. You sigh, shake your head again. "Why can't they just act right?"
Black guilt.
So you accommodate. You go about town, trying your best not to appear in any way "threatening". You make it a point to speak clearly and politely. If you see a woman with a worried look coming toward you on the sidewalk, you already know what's coming - you cross the street first just to avoid the tension and inevitable indignity. Your heart beats a little faster every time you walk into a bank, a convenience store, a high-end retailer. You want to project innocence, trying your hardest not to make any sudden or "suspicious" moves. But you're already enveloped in a sea of guilt once you set foot in that door.
Black guilt.
We've already heard a good deal about so-called "white guilt", which has more or less been described as an attitude characterized by some moral inclination on the part of white people to redress the historical (and present) wrongs caused by whites against people of color. The chief contention from many whites critical of this attitude is that they have nothing to feel "guilty" about, as neither they nor their ancestors had any direct role in the oppression of minorities.
Fair enough. But I fail to see the same principle being applied to hard-working, upstanding black people, almost as if it is assumed that white guilt's corollary, "black guilt", is just something that blacks who are playing by the rules have to deal with. That is to say, it is up to us "good" blacks to compensate for the shortcomings of our "not-so-good" counterparts, to bear the burden of everything wrong in the black community, as if we had a direct say in it.
So my question is this: Should blacks who are doing the right thing feel any more "guilty" about the social ills perpetrated by other blacks than non-racist, fair-minded whites should about the racism and oppression perpetrated by other whites?
No, and sorry to jump in so unequivocally, but I feel very strongly about this. As a white person, I think guilt is the wrong word. The phrase "white liberal guilt" quite literally doesn't make sense to me. I am very disappointed when white people are hypercritical of black people. I am very disappointed when white people commit hate crimes. And I am very disappointed when white people claim that their lack of participation in their ancestors' crimes means that they don't have to deal with them. None of these feelings of disappointment have anything to do with guilt. I was born in 1970, for the good Lord's sake--what could I have possibly done?
In my opinion, all of us need to look white supremacy and its legacy squarely in the eye. That stare down may be different for white people than it is for black people. That is a future conversation to have. But the stare down has to happen first. We also need to deal with how Latinos, American Indians, and Asians have been affected by this ugly elephant in the room. We need to be honest about its presence and the pain that it has caused. Maybe we need an American "Truth and Reconciliation Commission." I don't know. But what we do have now, which seems to me to be more or less white people having temper tantrums because their time in the sun is rightly ending, needs to stop. I feel that it is my responsibility to tell white hypocrites to stop lying. That is all I can do. But to describe my motivation in doing so as stemming from guilt is fundamentally dishonest. What fuels me is righteous anger more than anything, and, while I know some white people agree with me, I wish more did.
I love it that you posted this question--I couldn't have done it in the same way because I don't really have to have the feelings you describe. Let us, all of us, honestly discuss.
I'm almost certain that most (if not all) of the black posters on here can relate to this in some form or fashion:
You're watching the evening news. Story comes on about a horrendous crime that has put the community on edge. Much to your chagrin, you discover that the perp is, yep, black. You sigh, shake your head. "It just had to be another brother". A strike against your race - a strike against you.
You see a rowdy group of black kids on the street - thugs, if you will - causing quite a disturbance. You notice the reactions of the white folks that pass by. Fright, indignation, disdain. Another strike. You sigh, shake your head again. "Why can't they just act right?"
Black guilt.
So you accommodate. You go about town, trying your best not to appear in any way "threatening". You make it a point to speak clearly and politely. If you see a woman with a worried look coming toward you on the sidewalk, you already know what's coming - you cross the street first just to avoid the tension and inevitable indignity. Your heart beats a little faster every time you walk into a bank, a convenience store, a high-end retailer. You want to project innocence, trying your hardest not to make any sudden or "suspicious" moves. But you're already enveloped in a sea of guilt once you set foot in that door.
Black guilt.
We've already heard a good deal about so-called "white guilt", which has more or less been described as an attitude characterized by some moral inclination on the part of white people to redress the historical (and present) wrongs caused by whites against people of color. The chief contention from many whites critical of this attitude is that they have nothing to feel "guilty" about, as neither they nor their ancestors had any direct role in the oppression of minorities.
Fair enough. But I fail to see the same principle being applied to hard-working, upstanding black people, almost as if it is assumed that white guilt's corollary, "black guilt", is just something that blacks who are playing by the rules have to deal with. That is to say, it is up to us "good" blacks to compensate for the shortcomings of our "not-so-good" counterparts, to bear the burden of everything wrong in the black community, as if we had a direct say in it.
So my question is this: Should blacks who are doing the right thing feel any more "guilty" about the social ills perpetrated by other blacks than non-racist, fair-minded whites should about the racism and oppression perpetrated by other whites?
I know exactly what you mean. When I was younger I used to try to overcompensate "acting right" so that people wouldn't lump me in with those who chose to act a fool but as I got older I realized the people who judge me based on my skin color aren't people whose opinions matter to me very much so now I just do me...but yeah I had one of those moments when I saw that the dude who had been killing women and hiding them in his house was black. I’ve always said “black people may be a lot of things but we ain’t crazy†don’t know how much longer I’m going to be able to say that
You're watching the evening news. Story comes on about a horrendous crime that has put the community on edge. Much to your chagrin, you discover that the perp is, yep, black. You sigh, shake your head. "It just had to be another brother". A strike against your race - a strike against you.
You see a rowdy group of black kids on the street - thugs, if you will - causing quite a disturbance. You notice the reactions of the white folks that pass by. Fright, indignation, disdain. Another strike. You sigh, shake your head again. "Why can't they just act right?"
Black guilt.
I remember my grandmother watching the news and the first thing she would say, "Oh, god I hope it wasn't a colored man!"
But is it guilt, no, its self preservation. In a non-racist society we, black folks, wouldn't have to worry about what some folks of color do, it me or you so why should we be judged by the behavior of others, but we have to. We are the folks without the power (Obama aside) so in order to persevere in this society we are compelled to act as a moderating example counter to racist stereotypes.
Quote:
You go about town, trying your best not to appear in any way "threatening". You make it a point to speak clearly and politely. If you see a woman with a worried look coming toward you on the sidewalk, you already know what's coming - you cross the street first just to avoid the tension and inevitable indignity.
Oh, brother yeah, well at least that was my modus operandi when I lived in Florida. I had to because the reaction of white folks to any black person was palpable. Now that I am back in a major city, where white folks haven't lost their ever loving mind, I don't feel the need. Brothers who do dastardly crap don't have any bearing on how folks judge me. So I don't worry about it.
Should blacks who are doing the right thing feel any more "guilty" about the social ills perpetrated by other blacks than non-racist, fair-minded whites should about the racism and oppression perpetrated by other whites?
From a white guy.... I don't think so and if we are to get beyond many of the racial problems that would be one of the starting points.
As another white guy, that really sucks. I have gotten that reaction when I'm hungover, unshaved and slept in my clothes, but day to day I get treated pretty well. I think I could get away with a lot as a preppy white dude. Sorry to hear about this crap.
I think its a shame and well, stupid for anyone to have the bear the burden for the sins comitted by other people merely for being the same race/ethnicity/religion/sex/whatever.
I understand it and as Ovcatto said for the older generation it certainly was a matter of self preservation. But nowadays - well, I just wish this idea that we are all somehow culpable for the sins of our fathers.
Very good question that the OP stated. I don't know if I ever felt "black guilt" but I know that I have been disappointed at times in my life because of the reinforcement of stereotypes that some of my brethren play into. The funny thing is that there have been times in my life that I was not taking seriously unless I "acted" out in a way and became what some people think blacks should be.
In my opinion, all of us need to look white supremacy and its legacy squarely in the eye. That stare down may be different for white people than it is for black people. That is a future conversation to have. But the stare down has to happen first. We also need to deal with how Latinos, American Indians, and Asians have been affected by this ugly elephant in the room. We need to be honest about its presence and the pain that it has caused. Maybe we need an American "Truth and Reconciliation Commission."
You can throw white immigrants into that mix as well as they have been exploited too:
The fact is people of all races and ethnicity's have been exploited by rich white men. I know the argument is that white people in this situation had a choice but their choice was to either work or starve.
The funny thing is that there have been times in my life that I was not taking seriously unless I "acted" out in a way and became what some people think blacks should be.
LOL you too? There have been times when I've had to flip my ethnic switch to get the reaction I needed because speaking in a calm, collected manner wasn't getting it but boy when you add a little ABW into the mix people get moving.
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