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I seem to recall Americans both right and left in 2006 uniting and electing a bunch of democrats to congress in a desperate act to thwart the wars. And here we are.......
It's pretty clear that we the people are no longer in the driver's seat.
I don't personally have an issue with either war but more on how the war is being fought. While some people tend to think the US military was defeated in Vietnam and is presently being defeated in Iraq and Afghanistan, they couldn't be farther from the truth. In each case our military has suffered humiliating defeat at the hands of our own government. It's time to either fight a war for real or come home. While I strongly support a civilian command of the armed forces, I oppose inept micromanagement. Leave war to warriors and let them do their job.
Since no one seems to have the stomach for a real war, I say quit.
We've seen two ways of finishing wars.
Reagan did it in the 1980s proxy war (despite Charlie Wilson's recommendations)
Bush propped up the "Mission Accomplished" banner
Which of the two would work for America going forward? Or, are there additional solutions you might have?
I thought the one good thing about this president would be he'd finally get us the hell out of Iraq and Afghanistan. But so far all we hear every other day is how soldiers are getting killed and we're signing more and more defense spending bills. Getting sick of paying for the war machine. Come on Obama do at least one thing you campaigned on...
Did you believe the sales pitch too? "Change you can believe in" really only meant a superficial skin color change of the salesman, nothing more. The Man is still playing the same strategy as before.
We've seen two ways of finishing wars.
Reagan did it in the 1980s proxy war (despite Charlie Wilson's recommendations)
Bush propped up the "Mission Accomplished" banner
Which of the two would work for America going forward? Or, are there additional solutions you might have?
Simply quit. Sometimes the only way to win is to not play.
It's clear that we are not going to bomb them into the stone age though that would be a clear and decisive victory. It's also clear that we cannot win a guerrilla war against those who play by a different set of rules in their own backyard. We can occupy with overwhelming force for another 100 years and watch the body count rise and still we won't make any headway unless total social and economic collapse is our goal.
Politically I vary depending on the subject from pure Fascism to Anarchy and am moderate on nothing. Standing in the middle of the road is the worst place to be. If you're going to have a war, do it right. If you're not going to do it right, don't do it at all. A lot of people think that the Iraq mess is one of our own creation and I at some level agree. Some seem to think that just pulling out will cause collapse. That's true but whether we wither away like the Roman Empire or just walk away today, we will eventually leave and the collapse is inevitable so we might as well cut our losses sooner than later. The Middle East is and has been broken for centuries and we can't fix it.
Simply quit. Sometimes the only way to win is to not play.
You picked the first of the two (the Reagan solution that Charlie Wilson advised against, following the Soviet-Afghan war). I see that as being irresponsible and inviting trouble.
I don't support "simply quit" rhetoric. Never have. When you start something, it is only responsible to ensure you create an environment that is at least better than you found when you went in. Wars are not meant to be games. Real people die. Soldiers give their life, fighting. To say... just quit with change of administration is not only irresponsible, it also undermines the sacrifices that were made leading to that point.
Everyone from the Founders to George Orwell thought (and hoped) that the massive societal costs which wars impose would be a deterrent to their being fought, but, given the types of wars the U.S. chooses to wage, most Americans who express their "support" for them bear absolutely no perceived cost whatsoever. Worse, many who cheer for our wars enjoy that most intoxicating and distorting reward: cost-free benefits, in the form of vicarious feelings of strength, purpose, nobility and the like, all from a safe distance. It's very difficult to generate attention for political issues that Americans fail to perceive so directly and tangibly affect them -- that's why the failing economy receives so much attention and our various wars (and civil liberties erosions) do not.
You picked the first of the two (the Reagan solution that Charlie Wilson advised against, following the Soviet-Afghan war). I see that as being irresponsible and inviting trouble.
I don't support "simply quit" rhetoric. Never have. When you start something, it is only responsible to ensure you create an environment that is at least better than you found when you went in. Wars are not meant to be games. Real people die. Soldiers give their life, fighting. To say... just quit with change of administration is not only irresponsible, it also undermines the sacrifices that were made leading to that point.
To a certain extent I agree but the reality is that two administrations have been treating the war as if it were a game. While quitting is irresponsible, I feel it's the lesser of two evils. What price are we willing to pay to win?
Conspiracy? No conspiracy at all. George W. Bush and the Iraqi people agreed to a draw down. Why does Barack Obama have to come in and put his political fingerprints on an agreement that pre-dates him, yet achieves the same goal? Because he wants to be looked at as The Man Who Got Us Out of Iraq.
Why is that hard to see? It's plain as day.
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