Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I've bought four properties (all without a realtor) and sold four (one with a realtor because it was jointly owned and he wanted one).
Yeah, but you're pretty dumb when it comes to buying and selling so maybe you aren't the best poster child for not using an agent. Every time you do something real estate related you're on here asking for help with your problems, and agents are kind enough to provide you with free advice. And honestly, I think the problems you're asking for help with are super basic issues. So maybe you didn't have an agent you hired, but you still had agents helping.
Also, the advice of calling a listing agent isn't great. Let me be blunt about it for the other readers considering your advice.
Do I make a little more w/o a buyer agent? A little bit, yes, but I sell enough homes that I'm not worried about it. I list a lot of homes, I've brokered over 3,000 transactions and I have no debt. I stated earlier on the thread what I'd make you do prior to meeting with you to show the home if I was the listing agent. You'll get better service and treatment from a good buyers agent than you will from me. Also, a dedicated buyers agent working for you is way more motivated to get you into that home than I am. I have a busy schedule, so I can't just drop everything to run to a listing to show a home to an unqualified and unrepresented buyer. If you're lucky I may have someone available on my team to open the door for you on short notice but they stay busy too, and I'm going to pay them the co-broke anyway so it's not coming to me. I know that home is going to sell and I know I'm going to get me clients top dollar with or without your offer, so I don't need you. Besides, I have enough experience to know that people with this attitude aren't the folks to pay a fair price anyway. They want a deal so they aren't usually the sort that pay top dollar or even offer a fair price, so what am I really missing out on? Nothing, probably saving me and my seller time that would have been wasted on your useless showing. That's what so many buyers that call in with the pseudo "show me the home or else I'll just buy a different home with an agent that won't qualify me" attitudes don't seem to understand. I don't need you and I don't care about you, because someone else will pay me top dollar for that home and they'll probably be much easier to deal with.
There you go, a dose reality and about as honest one as you'll ever get about how agents feel about people like you when we get that call demanding a showing.
Location: Formerly Pleasanton Ca, now in Marietta Ga
10,346 posts, read 8,561,064 times
Reputation: 16684
Quote:
Originally Posted by otterhere
I've bought four properties (all without a realtor) and sold four (one with a realtor because it was jointly owned and he wanted one).
I guess we’ll never know on those limited number of transactions if you got the best deal or not. But still I would say you are at least familiar with how the transactions work.
Could you have made more money with a realtor, I guess we will never know.
Even though I have way more transactions than you I still use realtors. I find they know little nuances and trends being in it everyday that I am not privy too.
Four transactions, in your life? I manage a team that does 4-6 a month. Every time I think I’ve seen it all, I am always amazed with what people do to derail the transaction.
Go buy a new car/furnature/appliances before closing on credit? Yup
Quit their job 2 days before closing? Yup
Payoff the heloc outside of closing? Yup
Enter a lawsuit with the HOA before closing? Yup
Create a new entity for the property owner the day before closing? Yup
Install a fence on the new property before closing and without a survey? Yup
Had a new roof installed and didn’t pay the contractor? Yup
Steal the a/c condenser? Yup
Had the buyer threaten not to close if they didn’t get a new appliance? Yup
Had the seller cut off and threw away the lockbox before closing. Yup
What about the seller who couldn’t get a payoff for a loan they had subject to the existing mortgage? Yup.
Not to mention fake cashiers checks, fake state issued identification….
All transactions get complicated at some point, some get headache inducing. Licensees try their best to resolve those issues and a thousand more for the benefit of our clients.
I had an agent that was efficient at culling homes I was interested in. He had access to those listings long before I could find them publicly. My agent found a great home for me. I would use one again.
Anyone citing a 6% commission in a national market where commissions average ~5% is too out of touch to be taken seriously.
And, what if the search takes 2 years, involves writing multiple offers, after showing a few dozen houses?
That is just as reasonable a question.
OK call it $15,000 on a $300,000 home. That fee is absurd. There is no way I have ever received $15,000 worth of service from a realtor.
Reality is, that real estate services should be fee-based. A fixed amount for a showing. A fixed amount for hours spent on search. A fixed amount for writing an offer. A fixed amount for presence at a closing. And those fees should be set by the provider, so that competition will help drive those fees down as they do in any other open market.
OK call it $15,000 on a $300,000 home. That fee is absurd. There is no way I have ever received $15,000 worth of service from a realtor.
Reality is, that real estate services should be fee-based. A fixed amount for a showing. A fixed amount for hours spent on search. A fixed amount for writing an offer. A fixed amount for presence at a closing. And those fees should be set by the provider, so that competition will help drive those fees down as they do in any other open market.
Generally, TWO agents involved, unless you routinely go for dual agency, @7500 each. And, at that point, you likely would find the fee could be negotiated further. Remember, that is an AVERAGE, meaning there are lower fees readily available.
Commission IS a fee. "Tomato. Tomahto."
As far as your fee schedule, that would be on a retainer and pay as you go, right?
Most people don't want to do that as evidenced on this forum, in the thread linked below, where many Know-Nothings went into Full Snit Mode when they saw it mentioned.
The issue becomes... Can the client profit from accepting more risk in pay-as-they-go to save money over traditional fees, and have adequate funds for downpayment and closing costs? Many cannot. That small $5,800 could take them out of the market before they closed.
Back to square one, scrimp and save?
Breaking it down for one example. A post in another thread.
Charge for showings?
You will find that to be a common practice if the commission system is significantly disrupted by the commission lawsuits. The lawsuits may fool some consumers, but they need to be prepared for what is to come.
And, putting some skin in the game via "Pay as You Go" has the potential to save consumers a lot of money overall.
Say I get 2.4% on a $600,000 sale. $14,400.
Alternatively, say I get $100/showing, $$600 each for writing an offer, and $800 for contract to closing.
Show 14 houses.
Write 6 offers.
1 contract to close.
Comes to $5,800.
Would $5,800 come out to less than $14,400?
(I think it just might, and the bargain numbers presented don't allow for the clients who see 20-40 homes, either.)
(Despite all the lies from the NAR and members, I prefer the current system over running a tab and invoicing.)
And then, when I had a listing at 4.8%, with an agreement to reduce it to 4% if I brought the buyer, you advise that the "extra" 1.6% would be powerful motivation for me?
Not really. I budgeted my 2.4% as my expected compensation and it was enough.
Listed a house and brought the buyers. It was several years ago, right after I went independent.
$315,000 sale. The last dual agency deal I did. After that, I referred buyers to other agents instead of going into dual agency.
Anyway, I reduced commission further and also credited $1,000 each to both parties at closing because they were both very well-poised and easy to work with.
There was no "6%." I am not greedy. Didn't do 6% after my first year in business. 5% max. Then 4.8% on many, at 2.4% for both agents.
After that, I advised all buyers and sellers to decline dual agency in the listing or buyers agency agreements.
Protected them and protected me.
Then there was the guy who visited a listing and requested a 3% commission reduction because I was getting all of the commission for writing the offer for him.
I declined. 5% listing to take 2% for handling both sides, including representing neither side as a fiduciary.
He found an agent and ended up getting the property.
That was fine with me.
Last edited by MikeJaquish; 12-01-2023 at 02:04 PM..
OK call it $15,000 on a $300,000 home. That fee is absurd. There is no way I have ever received $15,000 worth of service from a realtor.
Reality is, that real estate services should be fee-based. A fixed amount for a showing. A fixed amount for hours spent on search. A fixed amount for writing an offer. A fixed amount for presence at a closing. And those fees should be set by the provider, so that competition will help drive those fees down as they do in any other open market.
You're correct. Guarantee pay for time and the cost will go down. As stated earlier though, most consumers do not want that model because they carry the risk that way. As it's structured, the risk is carried by the agent.
Generally, TWO agents involved, unless you routinely go for dual agency, @7500 each. And, at that point, you likely would find the fee could be negotiated further. Remember, that is an AVERAGE, meaning there are lower fees readily available.
Commission IS a fee. "Tomato. Tomahto."
As far as your fee schedule, that would be on a retainer and pay as you go, right?
Most people don't want to do that as evidenced on this forum where many Know-Nothings went into Full Snit Mode when they saw it discussed.
It's exactly the same reason why anyone with common sense chooses a fee-based financial advisor versus a commission based advisor. Of course with real estate in most cases we don't HAVE that option, since the deck is stacked against the buyer and the seller.
It won't last, in any case - just as automobile dealerships and "salesmen" are going the way of the dodo, thus it will be with commissioned real estate transactions. It is just a matter of time.
It's exactly the same reason why anyone with common sense chooses a fee-based financial advisor versus a commission based advisor. Of course with real estate in most cases we don't HAVE that option, since the deck is stacked against the buyer and the seller.
It won't last, in any case - just as automobile dealerships and "salesmen" are going the way of the dodo, thus it will be with commissioned real estate transactions. It is just a matter of time.
You are ignoring the topic so you can continue to grind the ax.
Or, are you saying $14,400<$5,800?
Cars are mass produced commodities, with limited offerings.
That is hardly true of real estate and houses.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
