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When people have an ongoing saga of woe in their lives, as in work problems, money problems, relationship problems, the one thing in common is that it is NEVER THEIR FAULT. So they bounce from crisis to crisis and expect their friends and family to bail them out again and again. And they always have a ready-made excuse because, once again, IT IS NEVER THEIR FAULT.
Reminds me of this guy I was once extremely close with.
I met Jay when I was 12. We grew close in junior high and high school. Guy had a heart of gold, funny, highly talented in the arts. But he had some serious issues.
He had a lot of anger against his parents, in part because he perceived his younger brother was treated better. He also claimed he had once been gang-jumped for no reason and he became bitterly angry, to the point he hunted down each one of the teenage boys who beat him up when he was finishing high school (that’s when he lifted and I think went on the juice and turned into an intimidating moose).
But anyway. He didn’t do so well in high school and ended up at some average local college which he did finish. Jumped around from job to job and ultimately took up stockbrokerage – and he struggled literally for years.
He worked hard as hell; I remember him with neatly packed and lined-up index cards containing beautifully written stock market data, his cursive script reflecting his intact artistic skills. But I remember once that he had not “made it” because broker house after broker house ‘screwed him over.’ He never thought that perhaps he wasn’t good enough or that brokerage wasn’t for him.
Finally, he “snapped.” The 2001 terrorist attacks claimed the life of at least 2 of his friends, and on a going-away party a lot of his friends held for him (he had decided to go on a radical turn – he was leaving the country for an indefinite period of time to work abroad), he got drunk and went verbally ballistic on me, in front of people I didn’t know.
Eventually he returned to the States, sought me, and apologized. We reconciled, but we ultimately never became as close as we had been as kids. And he found a nice girl, got married 4 years ago, and settled down; last I heard he had gotten a decent-paying job in stockbrokerage. So, Jay did finally “succeed” – but on the last few times we spoke (before he got his good job) he confessed he was “still angry” and it wasn’t of course at himself, but rather, at those whom he thought had screwed him over during his life… his own parents, friends who betrayed him, and co-workers who kept him from getting high commissions.
I look back and realize a factor that killed our friendship was that he always had some kind of drama, and that I couldn’t deal with that and with how unpredictable his behavior and mood would be. I’m just glad he settled down and apparently found his place in this world.
Yep. Another huge tip off when it comes to dysfunctional people is if they still seethe with resentment at their parents in their late 20s.
Mind you, everybody has issues with their parents. But unless the parents were outright abusive or neglectful, mature adults manage to put all that aside, realize that the folks probably did the best they could, and get on with their own lives, quietly resolving to raise their own kids in a different way.
But this business of "My parents liked my brother more than me" or "They never really encouraged me to become a ballet dancer," or "They never bought me a pony" is just a sign of infantilism, a red flag that you're not dealing with a person who has fully grown up. And you'll pay the price.
Yep. Another huge tip off when it comes to dysfunctional people is if they still seethe with resentment at their parents in their late 20s.
Mind you, everybody has issues with their parents. But unless the parents were outright abusive or neglectful, mature adults manage to put all that aside, realize that the folks probably did the best they could, and get on with their own lives, quietly resolving to raise their own kids in a different way.
But this business of "My parents liked my brother more than me" or "They never really encouraged me to become a ballet dancer," or "They never bought me a pony" is just a sign of infantilism, a red flag that you're not dealing with a person who has fully grown up. And you'll pay the price.
Good point.
In one of the languages I speak, there is a slang expression for someone who is perennially bitter and rebellious. An approximate English translation is “revolted” – someone who holds a lot of anger at perceived injustice. It can be dangerous because the “revolted” person tends to be bitterly angry not only at those who actually perpetrated the injustice, but at anybody the “revolted” one wants to get prissy with.
I remember such a woman – she couldn’t drink but when she did she’d go on endless tirades about her family (parents and siblings). Brother was a loser who had a child w/ a bar girl, sister ditched her son to get a job elsewhere, dad was a tyrant who disciplined her with a belt, etc. And this woman was about 28 when I knew her and she talked like this.
She eventually married (a man nearly 3 years younger) and she settled down. And it’s been nearly 9 years that I haven’t seen her, but the few individuals who speak to her on occasion, whether due to work or to social activities tell me that she’s still the same bitchy, “revolted” person – if she wants to be.
I have a nightmare friend story that I mentioned in another post. I was relaxing and having a drink at a hotel bar one afternoon, this girl sat a couple seats down from me. After a few minutes, she says to me: "I can't believe men nowadays, they are such jerks!"
I said "yeah, you're right they can be." I didn't say anything else, but I got the sense she wanted to talk more, she then went into a whole schpiel about her bf and how he was treating her badly, yada yada yada, I'm just agreeing and whatever.
I started to tell her a brief exp. with a past bf just to make conversation, well she kept steering the convo back to herself. I'm like whatever.
Time started to get away from us, and she invited me to a bar where they have bands playing, I didn't have plans so I said ok.
Well, when we got there, she told me she invited the bf, and then told me he was married (his wife lives about 2 hrs away), I said oh, ok whatever. I met the guy, nothing to write home about.
Her and I hung out a few more times after that, and when I left for a couple years and then came back, her and I went out a few more times, the entire time talking about her married bf, and how she has a crush on her psychiatrist and how her father was abusive to her and her sisters, etc. I just empathized and listened.
What took me over the edge with her, is that one weekend, I had 2 friends in from out of town, I invited this girl to join us for dinner, she showed up very distraught, i asked: "Are you ok? these are my friends I'd like you to meet,etc" she could barely acknowledge them, she was so out of it, she told us she had a fight with her bf and didn't know what to do, she was on the verge of tears, started to talk loudly about it, and even did this weird slump in her chair with a glazed look on her face. At this point, people in the tiny Italian restaurant were looking at us/her. I was mortified! and embarassed. She wasn't making any sense, my friends were just staring at this chick in disbelief, so I said, let's get you home, she was starting to make a scene in the rest., so I took her outside, hailed her a cab, and off she went.
I checked on her the next day, she said she was ok and talking to the bf (married guy) so I told her fine, good luck. (I had already tried many times to give her my advice about trying to date a married man, but she would NEVER listen!)
sorry this was long, but it was a definate nightmare "friendship" brief, thank God!!
I have a nightmare friend story that I mentioned in another post. I was relaxing and having a drink at a hotel bar one afternoon, this girl sat a couple seats down from me. After a few minutes, she says to me: "I can't believe men nowadays, they are such jerks!"
I said "yeah, you're right they can be." I didn't say anything else, but I got the sense she wanted to talk more, she then went into a whole schpiel about her bf and how he was treating her badly, yada yada yada, I'm just agreeing and whatever.
I started to tell her a brief exp. with a past bf just to make conversation, well she kept steering the convo back to herself. I'm like whatever.
Time started to get away from us, and she invited me to a bar where they have bands playing, I didn't have plans so I said ok.
Well, when we got there, she told me she invited the bf, and then told me he was married (his wife lives about 2 hrs away), I said oh, ok whatever. I met the guy, nothing to write home about.
Her and I hung out a few more times after that, and when I left for a couple years and then came back, her and I went out a few more times, the entire time talking about her married bf, and how she has a crush on her psychiatrist and how her father was abusive to her and her sisters, etc. I just empathized and listened.
What took me over the edge with her, is that one weekend, I had 2 friends in from out of town, I invited this girl to join us for dinner, she showed up very distraught, i asked: "Are you ok? these are my friends I'd like you to meet,etc" she could barely acknowledge them, she was so out of it, she told us she had a fight with her bf and didn't know what to do, she was on the verge of tears, started to talk loudly about it, and even did this weird slump in her chair with a glazed look on her face. At this point, people in the tiny Italian restaurant were looking at us/her. I was mortified! and embarassed. She wasn't making any sense, my friends were just staring at this chick in disbelief, so I said, let's get you home, she was starting to make a scene in the rest., so I took her outside, hailed her a cab, and off she went.
I checked on her the next day, she said she was ok and talking to the bf (married guy) so I told her fine, good luck. (I had already tried many times to give her my advice about trying to date a married man, but she would NEVER listen!)
sorry this was long, but it was a definate nightmare "friendship" brief, thank God!!
Yep. You know, friendships are not transactional. There shouldn't be a "you give me this and I'll give you that" element to them. You're friends with someone for no other reason than you're friends.
At the same time, a friend should care as much about you as he does himself. And if someone simply takes all the time, and requires huge amounts of your mental energy to discuss their problems, etc. etc., then what kind of friend do you really have in the first place?
A perfect early warning sign of one of these people? When they talk about themselves constantly. And anything you say about yourself is nothing more than a vehicle for them to steer the conversation back to them. If you find yourself talking to a person like this, you have a narcissist on your hands. Run!
you're exactly right, I sensed these behavior early on from her. Sadly, I think she's just emotionally unstable.
This happened 2 years ago. After the restaurant episode, I decided, you know, enough is enough! and I never contacted her again. I didn't feel a real connection with her, we weren't close friends, but I thought that when we went out as two girls on the town, we could have a good time, she wasn't ugly, and guys came up and talked to us, etc. But the whole time she's only talking about how much she loved the married bf.
I gave up on trying to say anything that really mattered just to get through the night!
It was good riddance to her, trust me!!! Perhaps I should introduce her to the sportsbar guy!?
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpg35223
Yep. You know, friendships are not transactional. There shouldn't be a "you give me this and I'll give you that" element to them. You're friends with someone for no other reason than you're friends.
At the same time, a friend should care as much about you as he does himself. And if someone simply takes all the time, and requires huge amounts of your mental energy to discuss their problems, etc. etc., then what kind of friend do you really have in the first place?
A perfect early warning sign of one of these people? When they talk about themselves constantly. And anything you say about yourself is nothing more than a vehicle for them to steer the conversation back to them. If you find yourself talking to a person like this, you have a narcissist on your hands. Run!
you're exactly right, I sensed these behavior early on from her. Sadly, I think she's just emotionally unstable.
This happened 2 years ago. After the restaurant episode, I decided, you know, enough is enough! and I never contacted her again. I didn't feel a real connection with her, we weren't close friends, but I thought that when we went out as two girls on the town, we could have a good time, she wasn't ugly, and guys came up and talked to us, etc. But the whole time she's only talking about how much she loved the married bf.
I gave up on trying to say anything that really mattered just to get through the night!
It was good riddance to her, trust me!!! Perhaps I should introduce her to the sportsbar guy!?
Maybe. I'm guessing that she never really made an attempt to re-establish the friendship either. If not, you see how much she valued you as anything besides a convenient sounding board.
exactly!!! I was the closest sympathetic ear around. What's funny is I told her the whole time I knew her and kept in touch (4 yrs), was to dump the jerk, move on, he's not leaving his wife, etc. (she even kept some of his things at her apt for when he came (pun intended) over for his "trysts" with her!) Oh, and she would go on and on about his huge "member".
I said, "pack up his s**t and mail it back to his house!", go meet some other single guys, (there was one in particular that liked her, the 3 of us went out one night) but she was so weak and had such low self-esteem that there was no getting through to her.
My sis is dealing with some "friends" of hers that only call her or talk to her is when they need a ride somewhere. So sad that there's people like that around.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpg35223
Maybe. I'm guessing that she never really made an attempt to re-establish the friendship either. If not, you see how much she valued you as anything besides a convenient sounding board.
Something I'd like to add about nightmare friendships. The ones where the whole time is spent building their ego. Constant reassurance and compliments. It gets sooo old! I don't have the time, interest, or energy to have to constantly build you up or stroke your ego, etc. I give the appropriate amount of compliments, support, whatever, then I want to move on to another subject! If you are having a genuine problem and want to talk about it consider my advice (since you asked in the first place) then fine, but, if after you tell me your troubles but don't want to hear any possible solutions, then don't ask me about it and let's change the subject!
This is just a rant! sorry! not directed at anyone, just in general!!
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