Tactless but Honest (kids, call, feelings, interested)

[cdubs3201]

Originally Posted by cuinlalaland

What do you think of people who are somewhat tactless, maybe even abrasive, but they're 100% honest with you and you know exactly where you stand with them at all times?

I have one such "friend" and I do not use the word "friend" lightly with her because being her friend isn't easy. She rubs a lot of people the wrong way and most keep their distance as a result. But I've discovered some admirable qualities under that unrefined exterior.

And with certain recent experiences with other women I find myself drawn back to her no nonsense approach. The next time I see her I'm going to tell her just how much I appreciate her just the way she is

I used to be this exact same way. Now I admit I'm still a little rough around the edges sometimes but for the most part I don't turn the average person away like I used to.

It was pointed out to me over the years that although there were people out there who were rubbed the wrong way by me, those who did get to know me and were friends with me really appreciated and cherished my friendship, as they knew with me I didn't play drama games and I was always honest. They knew what they were getting with me, and they knew I was someone who would go out of their way to help them and I was always loyal to the friendship.

I also befriended quite a few european exchange students during college and they told me the very reason: "when you say something you mean it, it's not fake like other americans, we know exactly how you feel about this or that or us so you eliminate that uncomfortable barrier that we have with other people because we don't know what they think about us". They also claimed americans were moody in the fact that one day they'd say hi and act all happy to see them, and then the next we would act bummed out and not even look at them. They had a hard time understanding this and couldn't believe it.

[NY Annie]

Originally Posted by cuinlalaland

What do you think of people who are somewhat tactless, maybe even abrasive, but they're 100% honest with you and you know exactly where you stand with them at all times?

I have one such "friend" and I do not use the word "friend" lightly with her because being her friend isn't easy. She rubs a lot of people the wrong way and most keep their distance as a result. But I've discovered some admirable qualities under that unrefined exterior.

And with certain recent experiences with other women I find myself drawn back to her no nonsense approach. The next time I see her I'm going to tell her just how much I appreciate her just the way she is

At first I thought you were talking about me, except I don't rub MOST people the wrong way. I can be brutal but I usually try to temper it. However, if you're on my wrong side,....

Originally Posted by fallingwater

ugh...this thread made me think of my sister n law, my brother's wife. Every time she says something hurtful, she ends it with, "Well, I am just being honest." Now I would rather someone be honest with me than being a back stabber but I think there are times when things can be worded a little nicer so people are not hurt. Sometimes faking it a little keeps relationships on tact.

For example, a few years ago she called me up in a jam. Her babysitter quit without notice. She asked if I would be interested in watching the kids. I love my niece and nephew but they are horribly misbehaved. But its family and I said sure. I am not very close to my sister n law but I attended every stinkin candle, jewelry and tupperware party she ever held. While watching the kids over the longest summer of my life, my mother called and said she got an awesome deal on plane tickets and hotel rooms for Disney. She asked me to ask my sister n law if she would be interested in all of us going for a vacation. Basically we only needed spending money as everything else would be paid for. So I asked.

Brutal honest sister n law looked me dead in the eye and said, "I would never go on vacation with you. Just because you watch my kids does not mean we will ever be best buds." I was completely shocked. If she would have simply said, ya know we spend so much time together as it is or...family vacations arent thing..fine. Of course she could see how hurt I was and ended it with, "well I am just being honest." Now mind you, I was making about .50 cents an hour, watching the kids 5 days a week/10 hours a day. It was hell but I sucked it up because they were family. So since my sister n law pretty much made it clear that we had no relationship except a employer and employee situation, I told her I would be truthful as well. I told her the kids were too much to handle and since she made it clear it was simply a work situation, I no longer felt the family obligation. I was done by summer end. She has gone through countless babysitters since then. Sometimes in life you just gota fake it or be tactful.

She wasn't be honest, she was being brutally honest. Sometimes being direct and honest means shutting the pie-hole. I am direct and honest, always. There's seldom any doubt where you stand with me but that doesn't mean one has to make an enemy out of those who aren't specifically friends - as your sister-in-law did to you. She wasn't "just being honest", she was being hurtful and nasty.

Originally Posted by netwit

I've found folks who describe themselves as tactless but 'honest' use their 'honesty' as an excuse for bad manners and lack of social skills. And also that those very same tactless people tend to be quick to take offense if they are treated/talked to in the manner in which they talk to people.

So nope, tactless people don't do a thing for me. I think it is a form of bullying in the name of 'honesty.'

I do not like backstabbers either but I haven't found tactless people less prone to that affliction than well-mannered people. There are ways to speak the truth without demolishing another person.

And there are ways to not say anything. I have never been accused of having too much tact. However, I am also not overflowing with tact. Sometimes it is best to not say anything. I am still tactless and honest.

Originally Posted by andreaspercheron

I'm notorius for being brutally honest. I do have tact though and in most cases it's warranted. There are those rare times where I completely turn off my barely-there filter and just let someone have it but usually, I do use tact but complete honesty. People will come to me just for me to be honest because they know others won't.

Originally Posted by bobman

I think I'm pretty much like that.

I won't stand on ceremony, and I won't tell people what they want to hear.

If they ask my opinion, I'll tell them what I think.
I try my very best to be tactful, but there are some cases where it's better just to say it how it is.
Also, in some cases, it's about what people hear, rather than what you say.

If they fall out with me because I'm honest, then they're not real friends.

I don't have much tact - other than shutting my mouth and saying NOTHING. I too have lots of people come to me for advice because they know I give them the real scoop - as I see it. And like bobman says, sometimes people hear defensively when offense is not intended. So when I'm asked for advice/my opinion, I realize the person is capable of hearing what I'm saying - without throwing in the flowers and crap - just straight out.

My friends DO appreciate that. It takes me 5 seconds to say, "he's a jerk, kick him out." whereas another friend will say the same thing, but take 10 days and you're not sure what she really said. Do I like that dress? No, it reminds me of my grandmother's go-to-church dresses. Those shoes? Oh heck no, I've seen straight pins with less point on the ends. But if you don't ask, I won't speak. Although I've been told my face talks all the time. Watch out when my eyes join in.

Originally Posted by Coolhand68

I think when it comes to the point where you've lost your manners and you are embarassing someone, you need to take a step back and think before you speak. There's a fine line between tactless and rudeness. There is nothing wrong with being direct and honest, but if you are offering unsolicited criticism at every turn, you're probably not going to have many friends.

Hold on, being direct and honest and lacking in tact doesn't necessarily mean criticism and most of us tactless, honest people don't run around speaking our minds unsolicited. We actually believe our honesty and directness is needed and wanted. I have 5 truly good friends and many other friends. So I guess I'm not embarrassing anyone - except with my loudness which is difficult to know - because of my deafness.

A woman yesterday was in a parking space next to the one last empty space in the small lot. She was a full tire width over the line into my space and yacking away on her phone paying no attention to the 2 kids in the back seat - OR ME as I squeezed my car into the space next to her. Yup, I did it - 2" or less. Mine is a small car so I didn't pull all the way in because our sideview mirrors would have bumped. So it was impossible for her to back out without folding her side view in. AND, she couldn't get in or out. I had just enough space to get out my door because the idiot on the other side was right ON the line of his space. Such consideration is incredible. As I got out, I had to walk around the back of the cars because my driver's door idiot was at an angle and there was more room at the back.

So, as I reach the front entrance of the store, another woman had watched the whole thing and she made a comment to me. In a LOUD voice I commented to the passenger in the On-the-line vehicle and the stupid ninny on the phone that I so appreciated the rudeness of some people's parking that they don't mind taking up extra spaces! I went shopping and came out. Both vehicles still there. I got in my car and at that time, woman with the cellphone in her head decides it's time to pull out. Her 3rd child was now in the front passenger seat. Her mouth is still going as she pulls in her mirror and glares at me. I dropped my window and said to her that if she had parked in her space, like I did, she wouldn't have a problem. But just wait because I'm a better driver, obviously, and I will back out without damaging our vehicles. She said, "but the other guy parked out of his space, so I HAD TO." I said, "Ah, I see; two wrongs make it right" ... pause... "And because EVERYone else is doing it, your kids should too."

The passenger seat child tried not to laugh. I backed out to her sputtering.

No tact. Direct. Honest. What I really wanted was to call her an idiot and give her a stupid/rude ticket but she had children in the car. I'm not rude, just direct, tactless, and honest.

[PassTheChocolate]

Originally Posted by netwit

I've found folks who describe themselves as tactless but 'honest' use their 'honesty' as an excuse for bad manners and lack of social skills.

So nope, tactless people don't do a thing for me. I think it is a form of bullying in the name of 'honesty.'

I agree with this completely. The truth may not be pretty, but some people thrive on being insolent.

I realize that honesty is hard to find, but if you are truly honest, there's no need to advertise it. These people often make it a point of bragging about how honest they are, they "tell it like it is", "If you can't hande the truth, don't ask". Brutal honesty has a purpose, and it is not meant to be used on everyone in every situation. When it is, it's only goal is to hurt and offend. I'll pass.

[cuinlalaland]

Originally Posted by cdubs3201

I also befriended quite a few european exchange students during college and they told me the very reason: "when you say something you mean it, it's not fake like other americans, we know exactly how you feel about this or that or us so you eliminate that uncomfortable barrier that we have with other people because we don't know what they think about us". They also claimed americans were moody in the fact that one day they'd say hi and act all happy to see them, and then the next we would act bummed out and not even look at them. They had a hard time understanding this and couldn't believe it.

Interesting, maybe it's partly a cultural thing then, because this friend of mine is from Europe and she says the same thing about Canadians being 'fake'. I would venture to say that Canadians are worse than Americans for that 'pretending to be nice when really I can't stand you' attitude. And she hates that...she calls people out on it too.

I haven't known her long enough to find out what kind of friend she would be during a difficult time. But I suspect that if she's your friend in good times she'll be there for you in bad times too. And I agree with her, a lot of the people I'm "friends" when everything is fine, I know for a fact they will not be there when I'm struggling.

[Gudra]

Where is your friend from ? Some cultures PRIDE themselves on ''being honest'' , they can't tell the diference between being honest AND DIPLOMATIC and talking like a caveman. Oh, and of course, they don't like it when you are ''honest'' in return.

[cuinlalaland]

France

[Coolhand68]

Originally Posted by NY Annie;13973001[COLOR=darkred

Hold on, being direct and honest and lacking in tact doesn't necessarily mean criticism and most of us tactless, honest people don't run around speaking our minds unsolicited. We actually believe our honesty and directness is needed and wanted. I have 5 truly good friends and many other friends. So I guess I'm not embarrassing anyone - except with my loudness which is difficult to know - because of my deafness.[/color]

A woman yesterday was in a parking space next to the one last empty space in the small lot. She was a full tire width over the line into my space and yacking away on her phone paying no attention to the 2 kids in the back seat - OR ME as I squeezed my car into the space next to her. Yup, I did it - 2" or less. Mine is a small car so I didn't pull all the way in because our sideview mirrors would have bumped. So it was impossible for her to back out without folding her side view in. AND, she couldn't get in or out. I had just enough space to get out my door because the idiot on the other side was right ON the line of his space. Such consideration is incredible. As I got out, I had to walk around the back of the cars because my driver's door idiot was at an angle and there was more room at the back.

So, as I reach the front entrance of the store, another woman had watched the whole thing and she made a comment to me. In a LOUD voice I commented to the passenger in the On-the-line vehicle and the stupid ninny on the phone that I so appreciated the rudeness of some people's parking that they don't mind taking up extra spaces! I went shopping and came out. Both vehicles still there. I got in my car and at that time, woman with the cellphone in her head decides it's time to pull out. Her 3rd child was now in the front passenger seat. Her mouth is still going as she pulls in her mirror and glares at me. I dropped my window and said to her that if she had parked in her space, like I did, she wouldn't have a problem. But just wait because I'm a better driver, obviously, and I will back out without damaging our vehicles. She said, "but the other guy parked out of his space, so I HAD TO." I said, "Ah, I see; two wrongs make it right" ... pause... "And because EVERYone else is doing it, your kids should too."

The passenger seat child tried not to laugh. I backed out to her sputtering.

No tact. Direct. Honest. What I really wanted was to call her an idiot and give her a stupid/rude ticket but she had children in the car. I'm not rude, just direct, tactless, and honest.

My point is, lets say you have a friend who needs to lose a few pounds. Now you wouldn't go telling her in front of all your other friends at a party that she needs to skip dessert and watch her figure right? That's where being tactless is also rude. You can correct an obvious wrong in a tactless manner, such as the inconsiderate driver who took up two parking spaces. I'm not even sure I would call that tactless, that's just speaking up for yourself and pointing out someone else's selfish behavior.

[CTR36]

I am like this to a certain degree. I try to be tactful and considerate of another's feelings but most of the time it just comes out. I have and do rub some people the wrong way but hey that's their problem. If they take the time to get to know me then they will know I am a sincere and loving and faithful friend. The few real friends I have I can count on one hand. I refuse to act like I like a person, especially coworkers. I'm sorry I just can't fake being a friend and people pretty much know that If I don't like you I just won't talk to you. It has worked well for me. In fact when my stepfather was shacked up with my mom I told him and her straight out I didn't like that and I didn't like him. Much to my mom's dismay....I was right.

[LibraGirl123]

I really liked what Redisca said on another thread in this forum about brutal honesty, and I think it applies here:

"The much-touted "brutal honesty" is more about brutality than objective truth.

[aqua0]

I'd rather have someone talk behind my back because I wouldn't know about it anyway. Ignorance is bliss.

Brutal honesty is a distraction to my la la land.