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Old 07-11-2011, 07:47 AM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
33,575 posts, read 37,209,077 times
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I think that today science is finally scratching at the surface of the god and other spiritual experiences.

I find the research very interesting.


YouTube - ‪THE GOD HELMET (Koren Helmet) Michael Persinger‬‏
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Old 07-11-2011, 08:29 AM
 
Location: Washingtonville
2,505 posts, read 2,330,721 times
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Originally Posted by catman View Post
We need to know because as long as we don't know, all sorts of fanciful myths will be believed in and will continue to affect the thinking of credulous people. I don't know whether or not we ever will know, but it is the greatest question of all and deserves every effort to be found out. It seems to me that you don't want us to know, or to attempt to find out, as it would put paid to cherished beliefs.
Yes, I am trying to stop you from discovering the truth. muhahahahaha... me and my evil spiritual minions do not want you to discover the true nature of how things came to be.

I actually do not think science will ever give us the answers we seek. Spirituality either wont either. We don't need to know what caused the universe to be, or why we are here. All we need to know is that it did, and we are. It seems that the more we discover, or claim to know either with science or spirituality it only creates more tension, more conflict.

The world we live in, is full of people who fear the unknown. Why do we fear it? Because we have been convinced that if we do not know, then it is to be feared, until we know. This manner of thinking is disastrous to our health. So, if the only way to banish the fear is to discover, then I guess we must.
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Old 07-11-2011, 08:40 AM
 
Location: Washingtonville
2,505 posts, read 2,330,721 times
Reputation: 441
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanspeur View Post
I think that today science is finally scratching at the surface of the god and other spiritual experiences.

I find the research very interesting.


YouTube - ‪THE GOD HELMET (Koren Helmet) Michael Persinger‬‏
Interesting video and study. But, It doesn't explains anything about spirituality. It makes me laugh to think that people would believe this. He said it himself, the helmet makes them sense it. It is not the same as a person sensing it on their own.
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Old 07-11-2011, 09:26 AM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
33,575 posts, read 37,209,077 times
Reputation: 14035
Quote:
Originally Posted by raison_d'etre View Post
Interesting video and study. But, It doesn't explains anything about spirituality. It makes me laugh to think that people would believe this. He said it himself, the helmet makes them sense it. It is not the same as a person sensing it on their own.
Of course I don't expect you to believe it...That would ruin what you already believe...If fact I doubt if you would would believe anything that contradicts your view of reality....You mind is snapped shut regardless of any evidence I or anyone else presents......

All the helmet does is simulate the temporal lobes of the brain with weak magnetic fields, something that happens to many people either naturally or because they have a dysfunction of this area of the brain, like temporal lobe epilepsy.
The results of these studies so far indicates that spirituality, god, out of body experiences and many other hard to explain things like alien abductions are hallucinations caused by misfiring neurons in that area of the brain.


YouTube - ‪"The God Helmet" & Alien Encounters‬‏
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Old 07-11-2011, 09:53 AM
 
Location: Washingtonville
2,505 posts, read 2,330,721 times
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Originally Posted by sanspeur View Post
Of course I don't expect you to believe it...That would ruin what you already believe...If fact I doubt if you would would believe anything that contradicts your view of reality....You mind is snapped shut regardless of any evidence I or anyone else presents......

All the helmet does is simulate the temporal lobes of the brain with weak magnetic fields, something that happens to many people either naturally or because they have a dysfunction of this area of the brain, like temporal lobe epilepsy.
The results of these studies so far indicates that spirituality, god, out of body experiences and many other hard to explain things like alien abductions are hallucinations caused by misfiring neurons in that area of the brain.


YouTube - ‪"The God Helmet" & Alien Encounters‬‏
This is another issue I have. You assume that my mind is closed because I question the validity of the experiment. Yet, you claim that atheists do this. So, it is ok if you do this as an atheist, just not a spiritual person.

And I can say the same for you. Your mind is closed and snapped shut regardless of any evidence I or anyone spiritual put before you. The evidence I have is my health. You ask for proof of a greater source or being. We say look around you, everything you see is this source of being, it is the reason science works the ways it does. It is the reason for everything. You ask for proof, yet it lays before you. You have chooses not to see it. Go outside right now, look around at nature, this is the proof you have asked for. It just hasn't been given to you in the way you want it. This is the way spirituality works, it might not be how you want it, it just is. Everything is perfect when it is created, always just the way it is supposed to be. What matters after that is what we do with/to it.
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Old 07-11-2011, 11:41 AM
 
455 posts, read 633,944 times
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Originally Posted by raison_d'etre View Post
Really? How did everything come to be?
IOW, Life began at the cellular level and progressed from there.I haven't read much astronomy but would be willing to accept the fact that a we are the result of a singularity.

That gets us to where we are today!
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Old 07-11-2011, 11:52 AM
 
Location: Washingtonville
2,505 posts, read 2,330,721 times
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Originally Posted by crunchman View Post
IOW, Life began at the cellular level and progressed from there.I haven't read much astronomy but would be willing to accept the fact that a we are the result of a singularity.

That gets us to where we are today!
You just explained how life grows. All life does start at the cellular level. That does not tell us where we came from or where we are going.

I know evolution. I believe it is right. But, just because we evolved from apes does not dismiss a higher intention or being, aka something hidden behind the curtains.

You would accept the fact that we came from a singularity, even if very little evidence suggested it, if that evidence could lead to any number of possible theories?

Interesting. Say that assumption is right. Where did the singularity come from? Where did it all come from? And the whole Hawking theory that gravity did it, and gravity has always existed...umm How can gravity exist without something to govern? It is after all called the law of gravity. If nothing but gravity existed, how do you prove that?
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Old 07-11-2011, 12:16 PM
 
624 posts, read 1,073,372 times
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Originally Posted by TKramar View Post
I'm perfectly willing to accept that there may be no God. In fact, it's part of the plan--if there isn't then I've "lost nothing".

Are you willing to accept that there may be? And accept consequences for not believing? Avoiding the consequences is the logical reason for my belief. If no God exists then nothing happens. If God exists, I am rewarded if I believe, and punished if I do not. Thus, I made the rational and reasoned decision to believe. But I'm okay with the idea that there is no God.
I appreciate your honesty and am probably at the same boat as you. However, on the other hand, the problem is that if Christianity is false (presuming you are a Christian) you will fare no better than an atheist if Islam is true (as an example).

So, ultimately, how does one prepare for a blissful eternity and not a torturous one?

Even within Christianity, there are differing beliefs on the path to salvation. Some say you have to believe that you are saved by grace ALONE, not by works, others teach that repentance from sin is an essential requirement and if you have not repented of even one sin, you have not met the condition(s) for justification.

So, how does one know whether they are truly saved?
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Old 07-11-2011, 12:40 PM
 
455 posts, read 633,944 times
Reputation: 216
Quote:
Originally Posted by raison_d'etre View Post
You just explained how life grows. All life does start at the cellular level. That does not tell us where we came from or where we are going.

I know evolution. I believe it is right. But, just because we evolved from apes does not dismiss a higher intention or being, aka something hidden behind the curtains.

You would accept the fact that we came from a singularity, even if very little evidence suggested it, if that evidence could lead to any number of possible theories?

Interesting. Say that assumption is right. Where did the singularity come from? Where did it all come from? And the whole Hawking theory that gravity did it, and gravity has always existed...umm How can gravity exist without something to govern? It is after all called the law of gravity. If nothing but gravity existed, how do you prove that?
Well, we have to start with the tangible, then move out into the universe i suppose.We have spent an IMMENSE amount of time and resource to know what we know, yet many, most of whom are highly religious types, DENY, what we know is TRUE, it would be helpful if we could get everyone on the same page.I do not know much about astronomy, I just started delving into evolution say 5-yrs ago (I live in America) but it seems logical that a big bang would come from a singularity.Evidently we do not know much about the universe, the laws that govern it,etc.The only reason american atheists are so strident is that religious groups continue to push for(using the gov't) creationism in schools when we are way behind the rest of the world in this regard.They also use their false morality as a political fulcrum and demonize otherwise normal behavior.I dont know many atheists who say there is no god or purpose, it just doesn't seem logical is all.
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Old 07-11-2011, 01:38 PM
 
12,595 posts, read 6,671,220 times
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Originally Posted by sanspeur View Post
I guess that depends if the one you are calling stupid actually IS stupid, but no matter how one person describes another it doesn't reflect back on the describer...For instance I don't hesitate to call Fred Phelps a dangerous bigot...Do you think that makes me the same?....It is a ludicrous idea that has no validity whatsoever.
I don't agree with you very often sans...but I endorse this ^^ 100%. Especially the part about F. Phelps!
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