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Squallionheart:
We only hate those who support the occupation state of Israel .
Then you hate me because I support the state of Israel. I also support a 2 state solution.
Its like saying I never done anything to Americans while you give your encourage and support to any Organization that fights them !!
You're doing the same thing when a lot of you but all Muslims and a few terrorist organizations in the same box !!
You do that to all Jews. Hating Jews if they support Israel.....
So what are you doing now in America ?
I was born here... So you can blame my parents... I didn't have much choice did I...
Ist it the land of Indians ?
Yes native Americans lived here first.. The world is made up of the history of peoples migrations. The Palestinians only are of of a whole list of people to have migrated and lived in the middle East. The Jews were there before the Palestinians. They fought against Roman occupation and lost. But they have a long history of being in the land of Israel.
My dear .. if you look at the issue out of this logic then more than 40-50 % of the world map need to be changed !!
True and that would mean that the Muslims need to all go back to Arabia from where they came. They took many lands by force...
This is what people called the defense of "land and freedom"
It is terror pure and simple.... And those who support it are no better then the terrorists who commit the murder. I would die for the state of Israel..
When you are defending your land against the occupier you are a terrorist !!
Palestinians who kill civilians are terrorists....
Strange logic No it actually is not.... The most recent was the fogel family.... Imagine they went back to look for guns and found a 4 month old baby who had woken up and was crying and they stabbed the baby.....
Thank G-d they caught the palestinian terrorists. I hope they lock them away with all the other terrorists and NEVER let them out...
Sad .. Islam has nothing to do with those punch of terrorist .. they are killing us too .. but Could you say the same thing about those who killed tens of thousands of innocent Muslims victims in Palestine, Iraq and Afghanistan by military aircraft and missiles ?
When Muslims attacked the United States on 9/11 they declared war on my country. Al Queda was in Afghanistan and we had every right to go in there and fight the Taliban. We did not have a right to go into Iraq although maybe the Iraqis are happier without Saddam? I don't know only time will tell. And they will judge that.
When Palestinian terrorists put down their weapons and Israelis can live without fear then there will be peace until then no there won't.
The Palestinians would have had a state in 1948 but they chose war and Israel won yet time after time Muslims attacked Israel and lost. So now Israel is strong and has more land because they kept getting attacked by Muslims.
[color=indigo]Please be specific ..what do you mean by "I don't deny it and try to whitewash it " ??[/COLOR
Deny whitewash? No lots of really bad things have happened in history. And Muslims, Christians, Europeans have had a hand in it. But as you know we don't always get a choice in what those in power do... We do get a chance to learn from history.
All countries are filled with folks who came from other places. The world is full of migrations of peoples... Everyone is an occupier when they go somewhere and someone is already there.. If you want the Israelis to go home then you need to understand a great many of them were already from the Middle East. Even in the Middle East the Jews have a longer history then the Palestinians or for that matter Muslims. The Jewish communities predate Christianity and Islam in the Middle East. The Palestinians were not there first so they need to go home and in fact all the Arabs need to go back to Saudia Arabia because SA is where Islam came from. Islam was spread by the sword.
Sorry, but I'm going to have to say I don't really buy that because something is an ancestral homeland one "deserves" it. Also it can be argued that according to the Tanakh the original inhabitants of the land were the Canaanites. Of modern group the Canaanites, I believe, are said to be closest in relation to the Lebanese.
to the extent the lebanese claim descent from any ancient people, its the phoenicians - who arguably WERE very close to the canaanites - but the Lebanese HAVE the homeland of the phoenicians - phoenicia. They have no history of a claim to Israel.
Indeed, I know of no instance of a people maintaining a tie and a claim to an ancestral homeland from which they were exiled the way the Jews have. So there really wasnt any precedent to the Zionist claim, either for or against - it was sui generis, unique.
Anyway, the Zionist claim was recognized in international law with the Leave of Nations mandate in 1920. WHich itself derived from the Balfour declaration, issued when Turkey was still sovereign over the land. So the Jews did not "destroy" a country. And most Israelis STILL want to make peace with a country of Palestine.
The Armenians maybe come close. Although they did get Armenia back, but I'm not sure they've gotten the entire kingdom of ancient Armenia.
Still sure Jewish people have a unique history, but many peoples have a history that's unique in some way. If some other people had maintained a 3000 year claim to a land does that mean they should get it? The Kurds don't have a nation and neither do the Basques. Granted they've not been taken from that land, but I think that could make their claim better not worse.
And really "International law of 1920" was largely just what the major imperialist powers agreed it to be. If we want to go by that "racial equality" is too controversial an idea to support and Europe should be ruling the Mideast Arabs until they are "civilized enough" to govern themselves.
I accept the existence of Israel and even think it's a better nation than most in that region. I think the Palestinians should get over the whole thing already, but the idea that because a people have a long-held dream that dream must be fulfilled just sounds like sentimental unreality to me. Zionists got the land because the British Empire was powerful, Europeans felt bad about Antisemitism, and the idea of every ethnicity getting its own nation was popular after WWI. (The independence or creation of Ireland, Czechoslovakia, etc) If none of those factors had been in play it really wouldn't matter how long a claim Jewish people had had because that doesn't matter in the real world.
I dont hate muslims.
I hope the palestinians and israelis will yet reach a peace agreement.
I do sympathize with those israelis whose losses and pains leads them to hate, though I love even more those Israelis who hold on to the hope for peace, despite all.
you are symathize with israelis while the palestinians aran't !!!!!
You need to know the Jews have a long continued history in the Land of Israel. Jews were there before there were Muslims. It is the land of the Jewish people.
The Muslims have never wanted to live in peace. Israel has had to defend herself against attacks since the day of statehood. Fought to survive because the Muslims don't want Jews there.
It is the Muslims who have fought with terror and then wonder why Israel fights back. Israel wants to protect its citizens who are not just Jews but are druize, Arab, Christian.
It is sad that most of the violence today comes from Islamic terrorists. They kill Muslims and anyone they see as not worthy of life.
Muslims killed 3000 of my countrymen when they flew 2 airplanes into the twin towers.
History is full of behavior that in hindsight is awful and I am not proud of actions that my country carried out. But at least I don't deny it and try to whitewash it.
and you You need to know the arab have a long continued history in the Land of palestaine ....
Origin of name
The name "Palestine" is the cognate of an ancient word meaning "Philistines" or "Land of the Philistines".[7][8][9] In keeping with the Greek culture of the day, it has also been suggested that it may also be a play on the word Παλαιστής Palaistes (Greek for wrestler) and a reference to Jacob, later called Israel, the founder of the ancient Israeli nation.[10]
The earliest known mention is thought to be in Ancient Egyptian texts of the temple at Medinet Habu which record a people called the P-r-s-t (conventionally Peleset) among the Sea Peoples who invaded Egypt in Ramesses III's reign.[11] The Hebrew name Peleshet (פלשת Pəléshseth)- usually translated as Philistia in English, is used in the Bible to denote the southern coastal region that was inhabited by the Philistines to the west of the ancient Kingdom of Judah.[12] "
The Armenians maybe come close. Although they did get Armenia back, but I'm not sure they've gotten the entire kingdom of ancient Armenia.
and, once a peace deal is done, israel will not have control over the entire ancient kingdom of Israel. Indeed, they are likely to lose control over the core of the historic kingdom in the samarian hill country.
Still sure Jewish people have a unique history, but many peoples have a history that's unique in some way. If some other people had maintained a 3000 year claim to a land does that mean they should get it? The Kurds don't have a nation and neither do the Basques. Granted they've not been taken from that land, but I think that could make their claim better not worse.
but what the balfour declaration and the league mandate promised was that the Jews should have a national home there, with a right to immigrate, NOT an independent state. The Kurds and Basques in effect DO have national homes in Iraq and Spain respectively, with autonomy (both achieved rather recently - after 2003 for the Kurds, after the end of fascism in Spain for the Basques).
Some Zionists (such as Martin Buber) would have accepted national autonomy within a binational palestine, as late as 1946. But at no time from 1920 to 1948 was the arab leadership willing to concede that - in particular the essential Jewish need, which was free immigration. Indeed, under Arab pressure the british closed Palestine to almost ANY jewish immigration in the late 1930s, precisely when Jews most had need of refuge. That is why the Zionists could NOT accept only autonomy (such as the Kurds or Basques now have) but had to insist on sovereignty - it was the only way to guarantee free immigration.
If none of those factors had been in play it really wouldn't matter how long a claim Jewish people had had because that doesn't matter in the real world
Are we arguing what drives real politik, or the justice of the zionist claim? If the former, its all largely irrelevant, as the state of Israel is well established and not going anywhere. If its the justice of the claim, than the basis is quite relevant.
NO claim is effective in the world without the confluence of force to back it up. Including the rights of existing independent states, claims of colonized peoples to self determination etc. Does that mean that the basis of those claims is irrelevant? The speed limit is enforced because the police are paid, and some legislators like the speed limit - but the REASON they like it is that it saves lives. The REASON that europe finally accepted the Zionist claim, was that it DID recognize the justice of the historic claim.
the idea that because a people have a long-held dream that dream must be fulfilled just sounds like sentimental unreality to me.
The only case of such a long held dream to return after exile, is the Jewish one, and that one worked out. 1 for 1. 100%. Pretty good record for sentimental unreality.
Indeed Herzl and the other early Zionists were WIDELY accused of sentimental unreality, if not actual madness. That is perhaps why Zionism developed an almost obsessive pragmatism, focusing on concrete achievements. Accused of sentimentality, they took up spades and settled the land, one acre at a time.
I hope Israel can return to this tradition of pragmatism - to me that means a two state solution - as something pragmatic, it would be the fulfillment of real Zionism.
As to the origins of each nationality and it's insistent land claims (see: the comments above about the 1800's violent displacement of American aboriginal natives):
!) The Jews have a legitimate claim to Israel as the approximate physical location of their ancient homelands, certainly as valid as the Palestinian one. They are, in fact, genetically the same peoples, since...
2) both originated from our hominid "Lucy" ancestors in the lower African highlands... (Google" mitochondrial DNA tracing)
3) who are also, by the way, also the undeniable and now-proven functional ancestors of all men on this planet, as they slowly advancd across the Asian plains, down into India and up into China, and eventually...
4) into N. America, via the Bering Sea land bridge.
So, sorry; you can't pull that separationist crap on us. Whatever's your land is also mine. And my brother's. So... why not give real peace a chance, you nasty Muslim thugs?
and you You need to know the arab have a long continued history in the Land of palestaine ....
Origin of name
The name "Palestine" is the cognate of an ancient word meaning "Philistines" or "Land of the Philistine*s".[7][8][*9] In keeping with the Greek culture of the day, it has also been suggested that it may also be a play on the word Παλαιστής Palaistes (Greek for wrestler) and a reference to Jacob, later called Israel, the founder of the ancient Israeli nation.[10]
The earliest known mention is thought to be in Ancient Egyptian texts of the temple at Medinet Habu which record a people called the P-r-s-t (conventionally Peleset) among the Sea Peoples who invaded Egypt in Ramesses III's reign.[11] The Hebrew name Peleshet (פלשת Pəléshseth)- usually translated as Philistia in English, is used in the Bible to denote the southern coastal region that was inhabited by the Philistines to the west of the ancient Kingdom of Judah.[12] "
The land was Judea not Palestine and the majority population were Jews, not Palestinians or Arabs. After the revolt of Bar Kochba and the last defeat the Romans exiled the Jews from Jerusalem after killing and enslaving many of them and renamed it Palestine.
# I was thinking why Jewish hate Muslims ??
very common question ...
Actually (if we may refer back to the OP and try to get back on topic), it's not a common question at all. I've never heard it in my life. Quite the contrary, the questions I've heard all have to do with why Muslims--or, to remove religion from the equation and be a little more accurate--Arabs, hate Jews.
Have you got an answer to that one, nawary?
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No it actually is not.... The most recent was the fogel family.... Imagine they went back to look for guns and found a 4 month old baby who had woken up and was crying and they stabbed the baby.....
