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You say "so what" but the problem is that so many times throughout religion's history (not just Christianity), people turn their holy books into excuses for ignorance, bigotry, and even flat out murder. Of course, the defenders of each book claim that those who commit these acts aren't following the true word. The conundrum that isn't often considered is that those who commit those acts also feel that the other party isn't following the true word. This leaves people to bicker back and forth (as can be wholly proven on another forum) as to what the true word of god actually is. However, because everyone thinks it is the word of god, everyone believes that they have a good, solid interpretation of it.
Why is that a problem? Because although the word of this god may be believed by both parties, it is the very interpretation of it that seems to pervade all of the religious animosity in the world. Some Muslim clerics will say God doesn't want you to kill innocents with C4. Other Muslim clerics say this is the only way to heaven. Some Christian ministers advocate protesting at soldier's funerals, while some preach utter forgiveness. Either way, both sides feel the word of god is on their side, and therefore, the very interpretation and LITERAL proofs people use, are not subject to questioning, rationale, or logic. It is something deemed "untouchable" - especially here in America and the Middle East. We are told that you cannot question someone's faith nor the zany ideas backing that faith that people sometimes come up with.
Does this mean that all people who follow the Bible or Koran or Talmud are hellbent on destroying others? No, by no means, and I can't stress that enough. However, it is only when we follow LITERAL interpretations of things do we run into trouble. You see it all the time on this forum. The Noah's Ark threads, the evolution threads, etc... (no, I'm not trying to bring that into this forum... please let's not make that discussion). Quite honestly, you should see some of the ridiculous arguments that come up in there to try and make myth fact. It blocks the mind of any sort of conducive thought process and only teaches one to stick with one train of thought.
Let me put it this way, and I'll go back to my Gulliver's Travels metaphor. If Paul, Jesus, or another disciple wrote Gulliver's Travels and put a little preface in there that Lilliputians were real and this was a work of God, I can guarantee you that people would be putting forth all sorts of "scientific" evidence that men only six inches tall actually existed. Do you see where I'm going with this? You can take any fable, any story, any great work of literature or even any idea, and as long as you put "God" behind it and that it is literal, someone will follow it, and someone will go to great lengths to prove that it is true. What ends up happening? It just ruins a perfectly good story that had a perfectly good purpose behind it but only because it is the alleged word of god can people get away with being so enamored with these ideas.
I am an orthodox anti-fundamentalist.
I don't believe ANY group or religion has a monopoly on the truth.
Fundamentalism within ANY religion scares the bijeebee's out of me. It's like mob rule.
Even in its own time, the parables in the Bible were understood to be allegories. Anyone in this day and age who takes these ancient myths as strictly literal is probably incapable of grasping the content.
Do you have a reference or is this just your own idea.
Normally I wouldn't grace such a response with a reply. But I believe it needs one in case anyone reading the post you responded to might misinterpret.
Yes I do have a problem with killing! And more especially when it's done on the orders of a so-called god.
Which god are you refering. There are many gods that have ordered killings. In fact there are many humans that have done the same.
That's what I've been talking about. Humans who have killed on the orders of so-called gods.
Yes looking at the thread title we should be talking about the God of the Bible, but you are refering to (g)od which is not the Jewish-Christian God.
When God orders something he has every right because he is creator. Fortunately he doen't call individuals to kill people, He calls nations to stand for right and oppose wrong. Sometimes killing must happen and we see in the wars around the world.
I do not know how many (g)ods there are. It does not matter to me since I serve only one.
i almost feel ill equipped to comment in this forum, but i like to speak my mind.
Yes i believe in god, i believe that christ existed and died on the cross.
What i don't believe in is modern day christianity. Every church that i have ever gone to has warped the bible and the words in it to fit their own means to an end. they preach charity and giving, but encourage families with little money to give up their money, and then turn their backs when they have no place to sleep.
the pastors preach forgiveness and faithfulness, but on the other hand sleep with their secretaries and encourage families not to go to the police when a child is being abused.
i consider myself a student and tentative follower of jesus. The message he had was relevant and applies to both that day and time, and now.
Do i believe that every single word in the bible is true?
The jury is still out on that. The bible was written thousands of yrs ago, and has been translated and re written so many times that I have to wonder if meaning has been lost in translation. Because changing one word can put an entirely different meaning into one single passage in my opinion.
and one has to take into account that the modern day bible was put together thousands of yrs after it was written, by a council of men who picked and chose what books to include.
so i guess im saying i take the bible with a grain of salt
I believe the words in the bible are somewhat true and was accepted by many nations, but...The King James Version is all we have, that was authorised by James I of England James VI of Scotland (same man), son of Mary Queen of Scots. James was the one who decided what would and would not be translated in English to be the bible we know today, isnt that right? Did he not persecute and execute the "Covenenters/Jacobites" of Scotland while he created the Plantations of Ulster? Should we believe only what was allowed to be translated into English from such a character? I am learning that there was a bible called the Genoa bible, and maybe another called the Geneva bible that was used by the Jacobites before those books were banned, what is the difference in those bibles? I would like to know. I see on history programs the scrolls found in deserts that had allegedly been hidden during times of book banishments, and so if they are authentic, and they tell of Lilith, first wife of Adam before Eve, then should we believe the re-woven tale written after abt. 1603(exact date??), and authorised by King James?
Personally, I have a problem with the facts that Mary Queen of Scots was held prisoner for abt 18 years, that she was forced to abdicate her crown to her infant son,that she was cruely beheaded with a dull blade taking 3 strikes to behead her by Elizabeth I, (the illigitamate child of Henry VIII and Anne Bolin whom Sir Thomas More refused to allow his divorce from Katherine of ARAGON (Spain) who allegedly wished not to be divorced, and that Sir Thomas More (author of Utopia) was beheaded and his head impaled on London Tower by Henry VIII, who decided that all of time and measurement should come out of his doorstep on the Rose Line, and he should break away from Roman Cannons to form his own church and force that religion on all the people of the land, which was carried out by Elizabeth I (who so hated Mary that she held her and murdered her). What then should we believe? Whom can possibly be trusted? I trust only God and Jesus, and those who walk upright,keep thier word,help others less fortunate. I do believe most of what is in the bible, but I dont think it is complete. Amen
I believe the words in the bible are somewhat true and was accepted by many nations, but...The King James Version is all we have, that was authorised by James I of England James VI of Scotland (same man), son of Mary Queen of Scots. James was the one who decided what would and would not be translated in English to be the bible we know today, isnt that right? Did he not persecute and execute the "Covenenters/Jacobites" of Scotland while he created the Plantations of Ulster? Should we believe only what was allowed to be translated into English from such a character? I am learning that there was a bible called the Genoa bible, and maybe another called the Geneva bible that was used by the Jacobites before those books were banned, what is the difference in those bibles? I would like to know. I see on history programs the scrolls found in deserts that had allegedly been hidden during times of book banishments, and so if they are authentic, and they tell of Lilith, first wife of Adam before Eve, then should we believe the re-woven tale written after abt. 1603(exact date??), and authorised by King James?
Personally, I have a problem with the facts that Mary Queen of Scots was held prisoner for abt 18 years, that she was forced to abdicate her crown to her infant son,that she was cruely beheaded with a dull blade taking 3 strikes to behead her by Elizabeth I, (the illigitamate child of Henry VIII and Anne Bolin whom Sir Thomas More refused to allow his divorce from Katherine of ARAGON (Spain) who allegedly wished not to be divorced, and that Sir Thomas More (author of Utopia) was beheaded and his head impaled on London Tower by Henry VIII, who decided that all of time and measurement should come out of his doorstep on the Rose Line, and he should break away from Roman Cannons to form his own church and force that religion on all the people of the land, which was carried out by Elizabeth I (who so hated Mary that she held her and murdered her). What then should we believe? Whom can possibly be trusted? I trust only God and Jesus, and those who walk upright,keep thier word,help others less fortunate. I do believe most of what is in the bible, but I dont think it is complete. Amen
The King James Bible is merely one of many translations of the Canon.
Albeit a very popular one.
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