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I can only imagine the heartache of being estranged from a beloved child, but I am so sorry you know what it really feels like.
I have not read this thread, so I do not know your "story" as I am posting this ok?
My experience with parents who have been through and are currently going through estrangements from their adult children has taught me that these things don't just "happen".
Not trying to lay any blame at all - just saying, there are always reasons why it happens, even if the parents don't accept or understand the reasons, the kids have a viewpoint that the parents don't share and vice versa. Basically there is just a breakdown of communication in the family.
It is so very sad when kids just cut their parents off rather than sticking around to try to improve communication and gain some understanding.
I think this happens partly because of the "throw away" and "disposable" mentality that has become the norm in American culture.
While I don't know the specifics or your situation Fran, I do know SOMETHING happened in your family to get you guys off track.
My advice would be to be brutally honest with yourself about what this is, and to work hard at taking your ego and any hurt feelings you might have out of the equation.
Then and only then can you be objective enough to try to see the problem from the other side - your kids side. You may have already done this - apologies if you have
Sometimes, all a kid wants, even an adult "kid" is for mom or dad to acknowledge their pain and apologize for the hurt they endured.
And then sometimes, no matter what mom or dad do or say, the kid will dig their heels in and withhold forgiveness. At those times, you just have to not escalate the emotions and walk away hoping one day they'll get to a place where the good memories overtake the anger and soften the hardened heart.
I do hope there will be a reconciliation for your and your family in the near future!
Oh, I do wish you had read the thread before posting. I asked that we try to listen and not try to 'fix' others' problems (re family estrangement). It's hard enough to do in person and impossible to do over the Internet. I was hoping this would be a 'listening and support' group only, which it has been for the most part, and I hope we continue to just listen and support. However, I really appreciate you taking the time to write your thoughts.
My situation is slightly different but I 'get' it. Although we're not estranged from our grown children, they live 1000+ miles away and call or email maybe 8-12 times a year. This is no reflection on them or us. We were/are good parents, they were/are good people. We gave them wings to fly and they flew. Good for them. If only I had had the courage to do so, back in the day.
It took me a few years to sort this out, and I'm at perfect peace with it but yeah, I lie too sometimes when unelightened folks ask about them. It's easier to do so than to try to enlighten them.
My love for and admiration of my children has nothing to do with if they come home for Thanksgiving or how they cling to me. I'm in awe of the many other attachments they've formed and the contributions they've made to the world in general. The proof in the pudding is in how much they are loved and appreciated and cherished by other people. By that criteria, I succeeded brilliantly as a parent.
Such nice words! And I agree with you -- if our kids turned out well, that's certainly is what is most important. I raised my kids to be independent and self-sufficient people -- I just didn't want them to be SO VERY independent.
"We should be careful for what we pray for. We just might get it."
One of my sisters has a daughter in her mid-30s who is rude to her and has estranged herself, but seems to have some kind ob bipolar disorder and so my sister cannot tell if it may be that. She brought up her daughter in an affluent home but did not spoil her with materialism. The daughter had nice clothes and trips, etc. and had her college paid for by her parents. She had a 30-grand wedding paid for by her parents over 10 years ago, and help with everything including buying and furnishing a nice home. Neither she nor her new husband made a huge amount, so my sister and her husband gave them so much. This girl had a chip on her shoulder for so many years, possibly envying her older successful brother. It pains me to see such a potentially lovely young woman treating her mother with such a crappy attitude esp all my sister had done for her.
My other sister has two highly professional daughters who only call to complain about their lives. They had absolutely the best of everything. Both my sisters were good parents, always attentive and loving. My kids did not grow up affluent in any respect and could well be resentful because they grew up among wealthier kids. Fortunately they treat their parents with love and respect. I cannot claim that we were better parents than my sisters and their husbands. In fact I cannot draw any conclusions at all really, except to say that our kids' generation grew up with a lot of media influence, most not for the better. There is a distance between many boomer parents and their kids that baffles. I also hear from my kids about some of their friends' familiies in which some minor thing happened and subsequently all communications have been cut off for years. I cannot imagine not calling a meeting and saying look, life is short kids, so let's get over this. That's would I would do, but then I'm more proactive than most.
I am highly sensitive to the pain this causes in parents, as I have talked my sisters through many a tearful night even though honestly I have no answers. I do believe that adult kids need to come to grips on their own. My sisters and I were abused by our mother and still we were there for her as she aged. Anyone else in our shoes would have abandoned her.
May all parents in this situation find a philosophy that eases their hearts. This is not your fault.
You said that our adult children grew up with a lot of media influence -- I agree. We had a lot of sit coms where either mom or dad was getting denigrated -- and then we had "Everyone Loves Raymond" (which, by the way, I enjoyed a lot). Yes, there were "The Waltons" and "7th Heaven" but they were not the norm.
And I agree with our adult kids need to come to grips on their own.
I read recently -- and I can't remember where -- something that made me laugh out loud:
"I don't want to hear any more people talk about how they went through a painful time and how it made them a stronger and better person and that it was a 'growth experience'. I want to hear JUST ONE person say: 'I went through a really bad time, and it was horrible. I hated every minute of it, and I didn't deserve it. And I didn't learn one d-mn thing from it'! I mean, come on, could people just be real just once in a while?"
LOL, yeah I hate that "what doesn't kill you will make you stronger" phrase. I used to think maybe it gave people strength--until I went through a rough spot myself, and when people said things like that I just wanted to slap them.
A chronic cold doesn't kill you, but it doesn't make you stronger, it makes you weaker. Being laid off after 40 years with an employer because you're old and they don't want to pay the benefits they promised won't make you stronger, it makes you financially weaker. Etc.
I estranged myself from my aunt and uncle who raised me. In fact, my entire family. My mom and dad's side. There isn't one family member I keep in touch with and I want to die that way.
Yellow Jacket, I respect the decisions you've made. I didn't even read your explanation in a follow-up post because It's none of my business. We all have our reasons and we have to take steps to take care of ourselves emotionally, whatever that may be. Best wishes and peace to you.
If anyone is interested in discussing spiritual solutions, P.M. me.
That would be interesting. My approach is more pragmatic. Being Old World and leading many groups in group process of writing and listening to others, I'm very comfortable with getting people including my family to express themselves. Several times I called everyone together (one son from the West Coast) for a family meeting, said "your father and I have some concerns and we want to air them." I was serving coffee and pastries so everyone was sweetened up (always approach these things on a full stomach). I assured them that they would all have a chance to express their feelings, including those about me and their dad. There was to be no interrupting. I asked everyone what I thought they'd heard in the conversation. Their dad, always uncommunicative, said little but participated somewhat (why is it always the woman ). In both cases everyone seemed relieved after some difficult issues got raised (they were in their young and mid-twenties then) and we went our merry ways. We are not an easy family as individuals, as we are all so opinionated and "right." The son that can be belligerent wound up leading our group. Kind of fascinating. They will probably remember me as an army sergeant but what the heck. At least I tried and it seemed to work. They do have a lot of fun ribbing me when we get together about how they were brought up. I guess I was kind of tough, but it was to balance their dad who was not.
Yellow Jacket, I respect the decisions you've made. I didn't even read your explanation in a follow-up post because It's none of my business. We all have our reasons and we have to take steps to take care of ourselves emotionally, whatever that may be. Best wishes and peace to you.
I echo this. I don't think very many people estrange themselves without a reason that makes sense to them, even if the ones being rejected don't get it.
Has anyone forgiven/not forgiven their parent(s) or their children? Is that even on your agenda? When I woke up just now, I realized that I really haven't forgiven my mother or my children. I thought I had but I really haven't -- but then forgiveness is always a process -- at least that is what I understand. I also understand that forgiving doesn't mean having to associate with that person again.
Last edited by Fran66; 05-09-2013 at 06:32 AM..
Reason: Addition
Yellow Jacket, I respect the decisions you've made. I didn't even read your explanation in a follow-up post because It's none of my business. We all have our reasons and we have to take steps to take care of ourselves emotionally, whatever that may be. Best wishes and peace to you.
Thanks but it was a pragmatic decision not an emotional one. Why hang out with someone you don't have anything in common with? There is no need to force a relationship that won't happen. It's better to have no relationship than a forced one.
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). In both cases everyone seemed relieved after some difficult issues got raised (they were in their young and mid-twenties then) and we went our merry ways. We are not an easy family as individuals, as we are all so opinionated and "right." The son that can be belligerent wound up leading our group. Kind of fascinating. They will probably remember me as an army sergeant but what the heck. At least I tried and it seemed to work. They do have a lot of fun ribbing me when we get together about how they were brought up. I guess I was kind of tough, but it was to balance their dad who was not.
