No more "San Diego" Chargers? (crime, tax)

[1AngryTaxPayer]

Originally Posted by Encinitan

Oh please. It's not like the TV station comes in and buys 25,000 tickets. They buy a few thousand, sometimes a few hundred, in a stadium of 62,000. Your position gets shakier by the moment. First, you said the Chargers can't sell out their games. When you learned they've sold out 48 in a row, you now shift to "well, a lot of those are no shows." What's next? I can't wait to see.
And by the way, it looks like next week's home game against Jacksonville will be blacked out, so you can celebrate then.
The point of this thread to is to ask whether or not the Chargers will move out of town. The short answer is, who the hell knows? They might, but then they might not. Why some of you must resort to lies and rewriting of history in an attempt to prove your point is beyond me.

To me a sold out game means I can't buy a ticket before the game. You can stick by your Spanos version of sell out if you want. I can buy a ticket to ANY Charger game without ever worrying I might not be able to. It's been that way for about every year except the Super Bowl run.
Blackout?

Geez, a blackout, what a shocker. It's that way before EVERY game. You die hard Charger fans are a gas. Don't worry, some schlub will buy up the seats so your precious Chargers can be seen. Then you can crow about it being sold out LMFACO

It's a freaking game and I like watching it but not to the point of lining some millionare's pockets or pushing my football agenda on those that don't want to pay for it. I guess you could always start a fund.

[Encinitan]

Originally Posted by Oerdin

There are lots of continuous costs like ticket guarantees, electricity and water subsidies, parking subsidies, and lots of other subsides which keep the billionaire owners in gravy without risking much of their own money. Also the shear cost of building a new stadium means we'll never make that tax money back even if the stadium is around for 40 or 50 years yet you can be sure they'll want a new one before 40 or 50 years passes. It's a net money loser for tax payers simply because the cash outlays far exceed any increased tax revenue.

For instance Petco Park was recently trumpeted as having a much better return on investment (ROI) then expected amounting to about a 6.8% ROI. Sounds good, right? Not really. The city had to borrow hundreds of millions up front with an average APR of around 6% because our credit sucks. That means even with this spuriously large and doubtful ROI we're just barely making the interest payments on the debt and tax payers are going to be on the hook for paying just about all the principle costing several hundred million dollars. What worse is more realistic ROIs not calculated by the Padres owners only amount to 3%-4% which means the extra tax revenue from Petco Park isn't even enough to pay the interest on the bonds much less the principle.

Stadiums are simply net money losers for cities so it doesn't make sense for tax payers to dump a billion dollars it doesn't have into that money pit. It makes much more sense to use it to improve roads, schools, or other things which will get a much better ROI for the local tax payers. Sports team owners tend to be extremely well politically connected though so they're usually able to strong arm politicians into given them vast subsidies while the city gets stiffed. I'm very happy to be rid of those welfare queens who drain our city's budget and don't net contribute anything to our economy.

Well, I guess we simply disagree on the value a professional sports franchise (and an NFL one, at that) brings to a community such as San Diego. I don't agree that the Chargers contribute nothing in terms of financial gains to our economy. But the voters will decide, hopefully someday soon.

[Oerdin]

The problem isn't that sports franchises contribute nothing the problem is financially speaking they cost much more then they bring in in additional tax revenue so they're a net money drain. Sure, you can talk about prestige or national recognition for a city but the reality is those are like icing on a cake; first you have to get the basics right before you worry about toppings like icing. San Diego needs to fix the roads and schools and stop spending money it doesn't have before it throws away money on prestige items like sports teams.

Also I despise the whole budgeting by ballot box way of doing things because 90% of the population has no idea what the city or state budget looks like and doesn't care yet will always vote to lower their taxes and (paradoxically) spend more money. We elect people to make these decisions and we should let them make the decisions they were hired to make but if we don't like the priorities they set then the solution is to vote them out not to try to get 2 million Joe six packs to pretend they know anything about accounting or the budget. That's the way to financial ruin.

[1AngryTaxPayer]

Originally Posted by djxpress

I love the Chargers (when they win...just like everyone else in SD). But our city is broke, the last thing we need to do is spend hundreds of millions on a new stadium.

Like some others have mentioned, the games only sell out because of ticket guarantees and angel donors (tv stations) who buy up the last of the tickets in the final minutes.

The fact is, year after year, the Chargers disappoint. They go 15-1, 14-2, etc. only to fwuck up in the post-season. If you want facts, those are the facts my friends.

No no, he's "technically" correct if you want to go by the dictionary.

http://www.yasrsly.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/rofl-600x405.jpg (broken link)

[1AngryTaxPayer]

Originally Posted by Oerdin

The problem isn't that sports franchises contribute nothing the problem is financially speaking they cost much more then they bring in in additional tax revenue so they're a net money drain. Sure, you can talk about prestige or national recognition for a city but the reality is those are like icing on a cake; first you have to get the basics right before you worry about toppings like icing. San Diego needs to fix the roads and schools and stop spending money it doesn't have before it throws away money on prestige items like sports teams.

That is exactly the order we need to be taking. To think the Mayor is in on some side bar deal without public input is maddening. Politicians think they know what is best for us, they don't.

I sold me beemer because I got tired of replacing custom rims due these crappy streets.

[Oerdin]

I also dislike the whole issue of sports teams being private for profit companies which never the less ALWAYS try to stick their hands in the tax payer's pocket. They need to pay their own way through life without the lavish public subsidies especially since they're a protected monopoly by Federal law (score another one for lobbyists screwing over taxpayers). If we want to move towards a European style league system where every city gets a team then fine but don't artificially decrease the number of teams and then let the owners black mail cities.

I'd be all for a European style system of leagues where the best teams are in the top league but if they do worst in the league then they go down a league into the minors while the best minor league team moves up into the majors. That way there is actual competition and since every city has a team there is zero chance for blackmail ("Give me $1 billion right now or I'm moving!"). Also team owners which won't open their wallet to pay for the best players find their team sinking into the minors so there is an actual market mechanism to force owners not to be stingy. The team either wins or it becomes worthless.

[cruitr]

Will there be a 2011 season for the NFL?
Is trouble ahead for the NFL? Labor uncertainty a dark cloud - USATODAY.com

[Boompa]

I say NO, as it is several dollars of every ticket go to GOBP/FOX and various other right wing causes, more than the next four teams combined. I don't hink LA would go for that

[1AngryTaxPayer]

I might have to take it back, they may not find some schlub to buy the remaining tickets against Jacksonville after that fiasco last night.

Sproles up the gut LMAO ----- Tie ball game on the poll. That can't be good.
Yes 1950.00%Hell no! 1950.00%

Yes 1950.00%Hell no! 1950.00%

[sav858]

Originally Posted by Boompa

I say NO, as it is several dollars of every ticket go to GOBP/FOX and various other right wing causes, more than the next four teams combined. I don't hink LA would go for that

What are you even talking about? I don't think football fans or anyone really cares about crap like this except those obsessed with politics.