U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > California > San Francisco - Oakland
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 05-02-2013, 08:25 PM
 
186 posts, read 459,621 times
Reputation: 147

Advertisements

I don't understand why other areas are not divided, but the bay area has been divided into two metros...I personally believe it should be the San francisco-Oakland-San Jose metro...

Just a thought that popped into my head after reading another thread, so can anyone answer the question??
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 05-03-2013, 12:28 AM
 
30,342 posts, read 33,994,737 times
Reputation: 33133
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nella925 View Post
I don't understand why other areas are not divided, but the bay area has been divided into two metros...I personally believe it should be the San francisco-Oakland-San Jose metro...

Just a thought that popped into my head after reading another thread, so can anyone answer the question??
The Census breaks metropolitan areas up a few different ways. There are MSAs (Metropolitan Statistical Areas) and then there are CMSAs (Combined Metropolitan Statistical Areas). CMSAs are several metro areas that adjoin each other.

So San Francisco-Oakland-San Jose is the CMSA for all the MSAs that comprise the Bay Area. The MSAs of the Bay Area are:

Santa Rosa-Petaluma
San Francisco-Oakland-Fremont
San Jose-Sunnyvale-Santa Clara
Santa Cruz-Watsonville
Vallejo-Fairfield
Napa
Stockton-Lodi


//www.city-data.com/forum/newre...ply&p=29398346
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-03-2013, 07:57 AM
 
Location: Piedmont, CA
35,474 posts, read 62,533,293 times
Reputation: 19473
Quote:
Originally Posted by mysticaltyger View Post
The Census breaks metropolitan areas up a few different ways. There are MSAs (Metropolitan Statistical Areas) and then there are CMSAs (Combined Metropolitan Statistical Areas). CMSAs are several metro areas that adjoin each other.

So San Francisco-Oakland-San Jose is the CMSA for all the MSAs that comprise the Bay Area. The MSAs of the Bay Area are:

Santa Rosa-Petaluma
San Francisco-Oakland-Fremont
San Jose-Sunnyvale-Santa Clara
Santa Cruz-Watsonville
Vallejo-Fairfield
Napa
Stockton-Lodi


//www.city-data.com/forum/newre...ply&p=29398346
You already said it, but a month ago, Stockton was also added to the Bay Area due to their high percentage of residents working in the Bay.

That takes the Bay Area's population to 8.370 million per latest census bureau data.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-03-2013, 02:33 PM
 
30,342 posts, read 33,994,737 times
Reputation: 33133
Quote:
Originally Posted by 18Montclair View Post
You already said it, but a month ago, Stockton was also added to the Bay Area due to their high percentage of residents working in the Bay.

That takes the Bay Area's population to 8.370 million per latest census bureau data.
Yeah, I'm not sure I'd consider Stockton to be a part of the Bay Area, but the Census Bureau does.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-03-2013, 02:55 PM
 
7,280 posts, read 10,249,252 times
Reputation: 11485
Don't worry, sooner or later New York will be added to the Bay Area and then the news anchors can always include the local angle for anything that happens within the continental US.

And San Jose? They can't even use a decent name for their airport, calling it Min... something or other instead of San Jose International Airport that would bring the city into some bearing of status. Small thinking keeps San Jose little more than an add-on to the Bay Area.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-03-2013, 02:56 PM
 
10,925 posts, read 6,354,795 times
Reputation: 4935
Quote:
Originally Posted by mysticaltyger View Post
The Census breaks metropolitan areas up a few different ways. There are MSAs (Metropolitan Statistical Areas) and then there are CMSAs (Combined Metropolitan Statistical Areas). CMSAs are several metro areas that adjoin each other.

So San Francisco-Oakland-San Jose is the CMSA for all the MSAs that comprise the Bay Area. The MSAs of the Bay Area are:

Santa Rosa-Petaluma
San Francisco-Oakland-Fremont
San Jose-Sunnyvale-Santa Clara
Santa Cruz-Watsonville
Vallejo-Fairfield
Napa
Stockton-Lodi


//www.city-data.com/forum/newre...ply&p=29398346
This is all true and is good information, but it doesn't get at specifically why SF and SJ are split. The reason has to do with the county lines and because the commuting patterns between the counties don't meet their (arbitrarily-defined) commuting pattern cutoff. It doesn't pass the threshold needed to be joined into one MSA (I think you need 25% commuting sharing?), but it does pass the threshold for CSA (I think 15%?).

Personally, I do find it hard to believe that there isn't enough commuters going back and forth (especially when looking at the peninsula as you see A LOT of people going between cities between Milbrae - Mountain View/Cupertino daily for work) to make it an MSA... Looking at commuters on 280, 101, Caltrian, and 880, you could have fooled me that it isn't one metro. But, what do I know.

My personal opinion on the matter is that the census has a way of defining metros that works best in places that have one, or at most 2, major employment center(s). In places like the Bay Area where things are more multi-nodal, their models start to break down fairly quickly.

And this is why you're left with odd situations like the Bay Area being split into 2. There are other examples throughout the country of similarly-confusing breakdowns, such as Philly's MSA not including regions of NJ that were traditionally part of its metro (have recently been switched to NYC's metro). It's not a perfect system, but it does work well for most metros.

At the end of the day, those who live here and/or are familiar with the area obviously know region is one contiguous metro that functions as one unit.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-03-2013, 03:23 PM
 
Location: A bit further north than before
1,648 posts, read 3,505,162 times
Reputation: 1438
They're split that way because there enough volume of posts to justify a new forum. Totally arbitrary, there's no particular reason behind it. The East Bay / Oakland keeps asking for its own forum, but when the actual number of posts are looked at it probably makes more sense to sense to fold the whole area into one rather than further fragmenting the conversations
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-03-2013, 03:36 PM
 
Location: NYC
1,200 posts, read 3,453,589 times
Reputation: 1227
Uh oh, not this topic again. I'm guessing the OP isn't very familiar with Bay Area provincialism and the passionate arguments it can lead to...
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-03-2013, 07:26 PM
 
12,823 posts, read 22,775,599 times
Reputation: 10993
Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyMac18 View Post
This is all true and is good information, but it doesn't get at specifically why SF and SJ are split. The reason has to do with the county lines and because the commuting patterns between the counties don't meet their (arbitrarily-defined) commuting pattern cutoff. It doesn't pass the threshold needed to be joined into one MSA (I think you need 25% commuting sharing?), but it does pass the threshold for CSA (I think 15%?).

Personally, I do find it hard to believe that there isn't enough commuters going back and forth (especially when looking at the peninsula as you see A LOT of people going between cities between Milbrae - Mountain View/Cupertino daily for work) to make it an MSA... Looking at commuters on 280, 101, Caltrian, and 880, you could have fooled me that it isn't one metro. But, what do I know.

My personal opinion on the matter is that the census has a way of defining metros that works best in places that have one, or at most 2, major employment center(s). In places like the Bay Area where things are more multi-nodal, their models start to break down fairly quickly.

And this is why you're left with odd situations like the Bay Area being split into 2. There are other examples throughout the country of similarly-confusing breakdowns, such as Philly's MSA not including regions of NJ that were traditionally part of its metro (have recently been switched to NYC's metro). It's not a perfect system, but it does work well for most metros.

At the end of the day, those who live here and/or are familiar with the area obviously know region is one contiguous metro that functions as one unit.
The current system favors the NE US in terms of awarding political clout. The cities there are the old hub and spoke format and are all dense in a single center. Our Western cities do not follow that pattern. The game is rigged. So what's new?
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-07-2013, 06:29 PM
 
Location: Boulder Creek, CA
9,197 posts, read 15,755,465 times
Reputation: 6356
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mack Knife View Post

And San Jose? They can't even use a decent name for their airport, calling it Min... something or other instead of San Jose International Airport that would bring the city into some bearing of status. Small thinking keeps San Jose little more than an add-on to the Bay Area.
Are all the other airports that bear an historical figure's name also responsible for making those towns unworthy of "status" as well? Funny how the leading economic engine of the country, as well as a town of nearly 1,000,000 can be said to be a mere regional "add-on."
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Settings
X
Data:
Loading data...
Based on 2000-2020 data
Loading data...

123
Hide US histogram


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > California > San Francisco - Oakland
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2022, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top