Why I want to leave San Francisco (Sacramento, Blythe: apartments, job market)

[mysticaltyger]

Originally Posted by roadwarrior101

Honestly, the appeal to Napa just isn't there for me anymore. Tastings that used to cost $10-15 a decade ago are now, $40-50. You can't even get a tasting fee waved with the purchase of a bottle. We were down in Paso Robles a couple months ago and had some excellent wines at a reasonable cost, in a more laid back setting.

I was just driving through there with a friend. I'm not big into wine, so we didn't stop to do wine tasting but I said the same thing.

[mysticaltyger]

Originally Posted by smashystyle

There just was a panel on this topic at one of the big economics conferences: https://www.aeaweb.org/conference/20...QytDVyvgEX7Clm

The studies are a mixed bag, with some showing no effects on employment and others showing a moderate effect. It probably depends to a large extent on the local economy. Regardless, I don't think the minimum wage is likely much to blame for pet stores going out of business in SF. I would look first at competition from Amazon, rent costs, etc. Any minimum wage job (even at $15) will have trouble drawing applicants in SF. Even teachers and much higher wage jobs have trouble getting applicants, given the cost of living and the option for many workers of living in suburbs with lower COL and the same pay.

I'm sure the higher minimum wage wasn't the only factor, but a lot of people are in denial that at some point, it has to destroy jobs. 'Cause if it didn't, then we could have a $100 minimum wage and no jobs would be destroyed and there would be no inflation. Pretty much everyone knows that's preposterous. But somehow, people think smaller increases have no effect. They do. It's just not as easy to pinpoint a few hours cut here and there, new automation here and there, etc. But go to a 3rd World country where labor costs are low. What do you find? You typically find more people running the stores and more personal service because labor costs are more affordable. I'm not saying I'm totally against minimum wage increases, but it gets my ire up when people talk as if the trade offs are negligible or non-existent. Beyond all that, minimum wage doesn't get at the core problem driving the high cost of living--lack of housing supply.

[mysticaltyger]

Originally Posted by vladlensky

For example, I would say that (from my own observation) while there's definitely a homeless crisis in NYC, it in no way compares to that of the Bay Area.

My sister moved out to Sacramento from NYC 2 years ago and she said the homeless situation is on a whole different level out here. She said no one wants to be homeless in NYC unless they absolutely have no other options. In CA, the milder weather makes homelessness a viable lifestyle to a larger % of people.

[silverkris]

Originally Posted by Independentthinking

Ah, but there's a difference. When I made my post, it was basically in agreement with what 18montclair was saying (without the sarcasm). I think there are a lot of topics like this, that keep getting regurgitated, that could be put in one post (and at the time of the posting of this thread, there was one very similar thread just a couple of notches down). The San Diego forum has one for the high cost of rentals and real estate (i.e GET REAL About San Diego Rental and Real Estate Prices) . I pesonally think that would be a great idea for this forum. However, I think one would take your comment as wanting censorship (which is not what I'm advocating). Nor should anyone.

"Exactly. Just tired of it. If you don't like it - just LEAVE, please. Let the rest of us enjoy it."

What does his comment have to do with your enjoyment of San Francisco? You can't enjoy it just because someone else doesn't?

One dissenting comment about these sort of threads and there's a cry of Censorship? C'mon now. Puh-leez. Nobody's stopping anyone from expressing themselves.

My comment concurs with that these are just endless loops of regurgitation, as you put it. It's just really tiresome and doesn't really solve anything. Just a bunch of Debbie Downers. And no, it doesn't keep me from enjoying the area for what it offers. Of course, I'm a native and a returnee so I may have a somewhat different perspective.

But yes, I think there should be a sticky for the SF Bay Area for real estate, just like they have for San Diego, and the Washington Metro Area.

[Independentthinking]

Originally Posted by silverkris

One dissenting comment about these sort of threads and there's a cry of Censorship? C'mon now. Puh-leez. Nobody's stopping anyone from expressing themselves.

My comment concurs with that these are just endless loops of regurgitation, as you put it. It's just really tiresome and doesn't really solve anything. Just a bunch of Debbie Downers. And no, it doesn't keep me from enjoying the area for what it offers. Of course, I'm a native and a returnee so I may have a somewhat different perspective.

But yes, I think there should be a sticky for the SF Bay Area for real estate, just like they have for San Diego, and the Washington Metro Area.

What can I say. That's how it reads whether you intended it or not (not to mention the all caps on "LEAVE"). And this is about your comment (not you personally), so there's no need to censor that (not sure why a Mod found the need too).

[BurnInTheMil]

Originally Posted by mysticaltyger

My sister moved out to Sacramento from NYC 2 years ago and she said the homeless situation is on a whole different level out here. She said no one wants to be homeless in NYC unless they absolutely have no other options. In CA, the milder weather makes homelessness a viable lifestyle to a larger % of people.

Add in the fact that the are allowed to do as they please, makes it more appealing.

[Tallysmom]

Originally Posted by roadwarrior101

Honestly, the appeal to Napa just isn't there for me anymore. Tastings that used to cost $10-15 a decade ago are now, $40-50. You can't even get a tasting fee waved with the purchase of a bottle. We were down in Paso Robles a couple months ago and had some excellent wines at a reasonable cost, in a more laid back setting.

Originally Posted by mysticaltyger

I was just driving through there with a friend. I'm not big into wine, so we didn't stop to do wine tasting but I said the same thing.

I remember when they were free.

[vladlensky]

Originally Posted by mysticaltyger

My sister moved out to Sacramento from NYC 2 years ago and she said the homeless situation is on a whole different level out here. She said no one wants to be homeless in NYC unless they absolutely have no other options. In CA, the milder weather makes homelessness a viable lifestyle to a larger % of people.

True, I'm definitely not an expert on population crisis or anything, but my best guess is the weather, followed perhaps by land space. NYC is an island where everyone is fighting for the small space (residents, commuters, tourists, etc). San Francisco, by comparison, is pretty sprawling - there's a lot of places you can loiter around and probably no one will bother you very much.

What *did* surprise me (in the city by city comparison) is that when I got screamed at outside my hotel by a homeless person (I think he was mentally ill), NO ONE (the policeman standing nearby, the hotel security guard) did anything! It definitely left me with the impression that this is probably commonplace, but it was kind of terrifying as a newcomer to the area!

[mysticaltyger]

Originally Posted by Greg10556

Add in the fact that the are allowed to do as they please, makes it more appealing.

Correct. In NYC, they don't put up with as much BS from them.

[mysticaltyger]

Originally Posted by Tallysmom

I remember when they were free.

Yeah, last time I went up there 7 or 8 years ago there were still a few free ones. It seemed like it was getting pricey back then. Not worth it to me as I'm not that into wine anyway.