Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
The media has largely backed off of any suggestion otherwise but there is growing suspicion of the performance of Chinese swimmers in the Olympics thus far, especially given their prior performances and sudden dominance. They had already won more Swimming medals in the first couple of days as they had in the Olympics they hosted 4 years ago. Ye Shiwen's performance especially has to raise doubts if one knows anything about swimming times and how difficult it is to improve a second or two, let alone several seconds...not to mention performance times by a 16 year-old girl that rival a 25 year-old man's. Another "make you go hmm" moment was the Lithuanian 15 year-old girl who came out of nowhere to win the 100m Breaststroke in world record time that bested her personal best by a whopping 7 seconds, which is again never heard of in the sport over a short time span. No one in the swimming community had heard of her as she apparently hadn't even swum in meets in Europe or elsewhere prior to the Olympics. Then suddenly she's supergirl? Anyone else find all of this to be kind of sketchy?
China has taken the place of the ol' Soviet Union, I suppose. I wouldn't be shocked in the slightest if China was guilty of doping their athletes. Do I really care, though. Not really. If they care about a medal that no one will remember about 2 months from now...
I feel ashamed for speech like this. Ask yourself, if Ye were an American girl, will you slander her like this too? When Phelps won 8 medals in Beijing, the Chinese never hinted "it is almost impossible someone can do that, something must be going on".
NYTimes etc. simply couldn't wait until the test results to come out to vilify the 16 year old girl for doping, Because of what? that she beat the Americans? that she outperformed herself, that she was faster than Lochte in the LAST 50 meters? I thought Americans presume innocence until proven guilty, or does it only apply to American citizen?
The Ye vs Lochte comparison is meaningless. Was Lochte doing his best at the last 50m? The American team had a lead and he lost it. Isn't it possible that Lochte just wasn't doing well in the last 50M? Plus, isn't it possible that Ye's strategy was different, in that she saved more energy for the last 50m?
Now Ye was tested again and is clean. But I am sure Americans will not stop whining and slandering, apparently you guys think "China must be doing something the current test can't detect". Well, guess what, if that's the case, it applies to everyone.
Since when America becomes this sour country which can't afford losing? She won, suck it up and get over it. Americans don't necessarily HAVE to win. The American male gymnastics team, leader in the qualifies, didn't get a medal, while no6 Chinese snatched the gold. Maybe they are on drugs too, since how is it possible they could perform flawlessly when only a few days ago mistakes were everywhere?
China doesn't have any black or white athletes yet can perform so well on the games. Learn to respect it. It is pathetic to question others just because they did better than the US.
History of doping in the 1990s? Guess what, it was 20 years ago, in 1990, China was the 11th economy in the world, smaller than Spain and Canada, a fraction of the US. in 2011, it is 5 times of those countries and half of the American economy. Learn to grow with time already.
................not to mention performance times by a 16 year-old girl that rival a 25 year-old man's. ..........
The 25 year old man had a big lead and was cruising home and had a slower time than many of his competitors. The 16 year old girl was coming from behind.
Anyway, this was only for the last 50m. For the whole race, Ye Shiwen was 23 seconds slower than Lochte.
"Teenage Chinese swimmer Ye Shiwen is not a drug cheat, the British Olympic Association's chairman has said, after a US coach cast doubt on her world record-breaking swim. ."
The whole story HERE.
I feel ashamed for speech like this. Ask yourself, if Ye were an American girl, will you slander her like this too? When Phelps won 8 medals in Beijing, the Chinese never hinted "it is almost impossible someone can do that, something must be going on".
NYTimes etc. simply couldn't wait until the test results to come out to vilify the 16 year old girl for doping, Because of what? that she beat the Americans? that she outperformed herself, that she was faster than Lochte in the LAST 50 meters? I thought Americans presume innocence until proven guilty, or does it only apply to American citizen?
The Ye vs Lochte comparison is meaningless. Was Lochte doing his best at the last 50m? The American team had a lead and he lost it. Isn't it possible that Lochte just wasn't doing well in the last 50M? Plus, isn't it possible that Ye's strategy was different, in that she saved more energy for the last 50m?
Now Ye was tested again and is clean. But I am sure Americans will not stop whining and slandering, apparently you guys think "China must be doing something the current test can't detect". Well, guess what, if that's the case, it applies to everyone.
Since when America becomes this sour country which can't afford losing? She won, suck it up and get over it. Americans don't necessarily HAVE to win. The American male gymnastics team, leader in the qualifies, didn't get a medal, while no6 Chinese snatched the gold. Maybe they are on drugs too, since how is it possible they could perform flawlessly when only a few days ago mistakes were everywhere?
China doesn't have any black or white athletes yet can perform so well on the games. Learn to respect it. It is pathetic to question others just because they did better than the US.
History of doping in the 1990s? Guess what, it was 20 years ago, in 1990, China was the 11th economy in the world, smaller than Spain and Canada, a fraction of the US. in 2011, it is 5 times of those countries and half of the American economy. Learn to grow with time already.
I feel ashamed for your mixture of political correctness and ignorance. I suppose you were one of the few who couldn't see through the East German medals machine of the 70s and 80s. I don't (and sure others do not as well) raise such questions with athletes who win fair and square. I'm thrilled when non-Americans win typically and do not feel as if the U.S. has some unalienable right to the largest pile of medals. In terms of the rest of your argument you can't seem to grasp the apparent issues at hand. First you maintain that all swimmers who win must be doing the same thing in terms of doping. I can't name one American girl who has come out of no where and lowered personal times by several seconds or run away from everyone else in the field like either girl has. Hmmm, in fact I cannot seem to think of any current instance involving such situation other than with the Chinese 16 year old and the Lithuanian 15 year old. Doesn't that seem to stick out, at all to you? Furthermore any adolescent girl beating a world class twentysomething year old male swimmer in the pool over that distance has to be juicing. Lochte's "off time" wasn't but a second or so different from the other top male swimmers in the heat. It's clearly not training as in Shiwen's case her overall form is terrible with very poor turns, bad underwater technique and her breathing/stroke ratio is completely out of whack. When one is able to achieve such results with poor technique there is little else to suggest, so get over it.
The 25 year old man had a big lead and was cruising home and had a slower time than many of his competitors. The 16 year old girl was coming from behind.
Anyway, this was only for the last 50m. For the whole race, Ye Shiwen was 23 seconds slower than Lochte.
"Teenage Chinese swimmer Ye Shiwen is not a drug cheat, the British Olympic Association's chairman has said, after a US coach cast doubt on her world record-breaking swim. ."
The whole story HERE.
A couple of holes.... #1-Lochte was "slower" than his competitors but didn't start dog paddling. We're talking a mere second or two. #2-Shiwen was well ahead in the freestyle and was pulling away (quickly) from everyone else (experience, trained world class swimmers) in the pool who were trying to catch her. That's the freaky part. Lastly, is it incomprehensible that the Chinese have developed something to beat the doping tests? Lance Armstrong for example certainly had no issues until much later in his career.
Although Lochte won the event in London, his last split of 29.10 sec suck big time. In fact four swimmers in that final beat him in the last 50m:
Yuya Horihata (27.87), Thomas Fraser-Holmes (28.35), Michael Phelps (28.44), Kosuke Hagino (28.52). Guess what, all four of them were faster than Shiwen, who finished with a 28.93 split.
Shiwen's 28.93 fell between the last 50m split in the world record of women' s 200m freestyle (28.60, Federica Pellegrini) and 1500m freestyle (29.27, Kate Ziegler, a textile best, no less). It's definitely top notch for women , but not unheard-of.
So hear me out. Yes, Lochte finished the last 50m freestyle behind Ye Shiwen. But congratulations to him for finishing 0.17 second ahead of Kate Ziegler, after she swam 1.45 kilometers. He should hold his head high.
I don't know the motivation behind comparing Ye's last 50M vs Lochte's, but it means nothing except the fact that Lochte was quite slow in the last split.
Although Lochte won the event in London, his last split of 29.10 sec suck big time. In fact four swimmers in that final beat him in the last 50m:
Yuya Horihata (27.87), Thomas Fraser-Holmes (28.35), Michael Phelps (28.44), Kosuke Hagino (28.52). Guess what, all four of them were faster than Shiwen, who finished with a 28.93 split.
Shiwen's 28.93 fell between the last 50m split in the world record of women' s 200m freestyle (28.60, Federica Pellegrini) and 1500m freestyle (29.27, Kate Ziegler, a textile best, no less). It's definitely top notch for women , but not unheard-of.
So hear me out. Yes, Lochte finished the last 50m freestyle behind Ye Shiwen. But congratulations to him for finishing 0.17 second ahead of Kate Ziegler, after she swam 1.45 kilometers. He should hold his head high.
I don't know the motivation behind comparing Ye's last 50M vs Lochte's, but it means nothing except the fact that Lochte was quite slow in the last split.
So what if Lochte's last 50m split sucked and four other world-class male swimmers beat him? That's hardly astounding. He was also not running flat out 100% either as he was saving strength for his evening events. When a 16yo girl beats him that's a concern if one has any grasp of the sport and the time differentials as well as at the end of the grueling 400 IM event in which the swimmer swims the Butterfly, Backstroke and Breaststroke at full steam before switching over to the final 100m of Freestyle. It's nearly a physical impossibility to post blazing times like that after swimming 350m with varied swimming styles. So is lowering your time by 5 seconds (Shiwen) and especially 7 seconds (Meilutyte in the 100m Breaststroke) which no one seems to have noticed given the Chinese suspicions.
So what if Lochte's last 50m split sucked and four other world-class male swimmers beat him? That's hardly astounding. He was also not running flat out 100% either. When a 16yo girl beats him that's a concern if one has any grasp of the sport and the time differentials as well as at the end of the grueling 400 IM event in which the swimmer swims the Butterfly, Backstroke and Breaststroke at full steam before switching over to the final 100m of Freestyle. It's nearly a physical impossibility to post blazing times like that after swimming 350m with varied swimming styles. So is lowering your time by 5 seconds (Shiwen) and especially 7 seconds (Meilutyte in the 100m Breaststroke) which no one seems to have noticed given the Chinese suspicions.
you are entitled to be suspicious all the way you want, but before you can provide concrete evidence, it means absolutely nothing.
Physical impossibility? Who are you to define what is and is not possible for these professional swimmers?
Again, prove it or shut up.
here is the news: Asked if the Chinese swimmer had passed the mandatory drug test for medalists, the IOC spokesman replied: "We would only start to comment if we had any adverse finding. At the moment I'm not commenting. Draw your own conclusion." Seems the IOC is not happy they didn't find anything
you are entitled to be suspicious all the way you want, but before you can provide concrete evidence, it means absolutely nothing.
Physical impossibility? Who are you to define what is and is not possible for these professional swimmers?
Again, prove it or shut up.
here is the news: Asked if the Chinese swimmer had passed the mandatory drug test for medalists, the IOC spokesman replied: "We would only start to comment if we had any adverse finding. At the moment I'm not commenting. Draw your own conclusion." Seems the IOC is not happy they didn't find anything
Clearly there is doubt and clearly you're in support of those who beat the system. Fortunately for those who train cleanly/play by the rules it eventually comes out in the wash though sadly well after anyone remembers how well they would have done without the cheater winning.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
