Opinions on teacher Alternative Certification? (degree, university, teachers, school)
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It isn't so much what other teachers think but what decision-makers who hire think. There are lots of principals who are biased against teachers who did alternate certification...it makes it more tough for teachers who take this route to land jobs.
I agree. They also are an opinionated bunch regarding people who come out of industry into teaching. Half of them hate us and throw our resume in the trash immediately. When I go to job fairs, about half the time, I get a "Who in the hell does she think she is" reaction when I sit down to interview. Most of the time when I apply for a job, I don't even get the courtesy of a thanks but no thanks letter (except when I apply for math positions. Apparently, they believe you can teach math if you've been in industry.)
It's interesting to see people's reactions. It's assumed, up front, that I'm an ex stay at home mom but their attitude changes for the worse when they realize I'm an ex engineer. Why stay at home mom turned teacher is acceptable but engineer turned teacher is not is beyond me. If anyone has any insight into this, I'm really curious as to why I get the resactions I do.
The only schools that are glad to us are charter schools and private schools. I had a private school try to hire me my first semester into my MAT program. The charter and private schools love telling parents they have teachers who came from industry. I think the public schools wish we'd go away.
I agree. They also are an opinionated bunch regarding people who come out of industry into teaching. Half of them hate us and throw our resume in the trash immediately. When I go to job fairs, about half the time, I get a "Who in the hell does she think she is" reaction when I sit down to interview. Most of the time when I apply for a job, I don't even get the courtesy of a thanks but no thanks letter (except when I apply for math positions. Apparently, they believe you can teach math if you've been in industry.)
It's interesting to see people's reactions. It's assumed, up front, that I'm an ex stay at home mom but their attitude changes for the worse when they realize I'm an ex engineer. Why stay at home mom turned teacher is acceptable but engineer turned teacher is not is beyond me. If anyone has any insight into this, I'm really curious as to why I get the resactions I do.
The only schools that are glad to us are charter schools and private schools. I had a private school try to hire me my first semester into my MAT program. The charter and private schools love telling parents they have teachers who came from industry. I think the public schools wish we'd go away.
It is my understand from your posts that you have not yet achieved certification. As you well know public schools are measured under NCLB by their percentage of certified teachers. A non certified teacher is a strike AGAINST. However as you note the current shortage of math teachers makes those not certified but able to teach math more attractive to school districts. If you can hire good certified English teachers why take the statistical hit if you don't need to?
NCLB standards for highly qualified (http://www.atpe.org/Protection/Certification/certNCLB.asp - broken link)
General Rule
To be highly qualified under NCLB, a teacher must have:
1. At least a bachelor’s degree; and
2. Full state certification; and
3. Demonstrated subject-matter competency in the core academic subjects assigned.
NCLB standards for highly qualified (http://www.atpe.org/Protection/Certification/certNCLB.asp - broken link)
Timeline
All teachers in core academic subjects must have been highly qualified by the end of the 2006-07 school year (regardless of whether they are teaching in a Title I program). Teachers hired after the first day of instruction of the 2002-03 school year who teach a core academic subject in a Title I program must be highly qualified immediately.
A temporary or provisional certificate is not full certification.
Perhaps the folks you refer to as being opinionated are really just guilty of knowing the rules of the profession.
And yes private schools don't have to comply with NCLB.
Charter schools are independent public schools, each governed by a public board of trustees that has the authority to hire teachers according to their own established standards. In some states, charter schools can hire teachers regardless of state certification and licensure requirements. In other states, charter schools are like district schools held to the same state requirements to hire only certified teachers. Contact your state's Department of Education if you are interested in teaching at a charter school there.
On the other hand, private schools are not regulated by state government and can set their own requirements. While some private schools choose to require teachers to be certified, many do not. Contact individual schools directly to learn what is required to become a teacher there. For more information about teaching in a private school, see our interview with a private school teacher.
I would hope this helps people to understand and discuss with understanding.
I did the alternative certification program in Texas. I think the program is pretty effective in that we take a ton of classes; have to do classroom fieldwork and personally, I was lucky enough to have some pretty awesome instructors who really cared about their profession. I thought it was an invaluable experience. I went into the program thinking it was gonna be "easy" but it's anythng but! You have to put in a significant number of hours and effort. Unfortunately, I left the industry but only because I realized that teaching really isn't for me. I finished the whole program and even got my certification. If anything, I have the utmost respect for teachers - at least the good ones. They truly are hard to come by. I knew I would never be one of the "good ones" so that was one of the reasons I didn't pursue the profession.
I did the alternative certification program in Texas. I think the program is pretty effective in that we take a ton of classes; have to do classroom fieldwork and personally, I was lucky enough to have some pretty awesome instructors who really cared about their profession. I thought it was an invaluable experience. I went into the program thinking it was gonna be "easy" but it's anythng but! You have to put in a significant number of hours and effort. Unfortunately, I left the industry but only because I realized that teaching really isn't for me. I finished the whole program and even got my certification. If anything, I have the utmost respect for teachers - at least the good ones. They truly are hard to come by. I knew I would never be one of the "good ones" so that was one of the reasons I didn't pursue the profession.
LIke many other fields there are quality programs and match book programs. Glad you experienced a good one.
It is my understand from your posts that you have not yet achieved certification. As you well know public schools are measured under NCLB by their percentage of certified teachers. A non certified teacher is a strike AGAINST. However as you note the current shortage of math teachers makes those not certified but able to teach math more attractive to school districts. If you can hire good certified English teachers why take the statistical hit if you don't need to?
NCLB standards for highly qualified (http://www.atpe.org/Protection/Certification/certNCLB.asp - broken link)
General Rule
To be highly qualified under NCLB, a teacher must have:
1. At least a bachelor’s degree; and
2. Full state certification; and
3. Demonstrated subject-matter competency in the core academic subjects assigned.
NCLB standards for highly qualified (http://www.atpe.org/Protection/Certification/certNCLB.asp - broken link)
Timeline
All teachers in core academic subjects must have been highly qualified by the end of the 2006-07 school year (regardless of whether they are teaching in a Title I program). Teachers hired after the first day of instruction of the 2002-03 school year who teach a core academic subject in a Title I program must be highly qualified immediately.
A temporary or provisional certificate is not full certification.
Perhaps the folks you refer to as being opinionated are really just guilty of knowing the rules of the profession.
And yes private schools don't have to comply with NCLB.
It's not an issue of certification. I am considered highly qualified to teach my subjects under NCLB. I'm actually more qualified than the average science teacher. I hold single subject certs (which means I majored or minored in each subject I teach). I have the same provisional certification that any new teacher in the fisrt three to six years has (assuming they convert without an extension). Because I have more education than the average new teacher, I will convert to professional certification in three years instead of the more typical five to six. Here, all new teachers get provisional certificates out of the gate. When they have completed a minimum of 3 years teaching and a minimum of 18 credits post grad work, they can convert to a professional certificate. I am, however, considered highly qualified under NCLB for the next 12 years if I do nothing. After that, I'd have to convert to a professional certificate. I plan to convert after three years, which is the minimum. (I think what you're calling a provisional certificate is different than what my state calls one. I had to have a, minimum, of a bachelors degree in teaching, student teach and pass four state teaching exams to get my provisional certificate. It takes experience in the classroom to convert to a professional certificate. If the provisional did not meet NCLB, no teacher would ever be able to get the experience needed to get a professional certificate.)
Charter schools do comply with NCLB. Because they are schools of choice. They like having sales angles for the parents. One is the credentials of their teachers. The first charter I worked for lists the degrees of all of it's teachers next to their names on the school website as well as former work experience. Parents like science and math teachers who come from industry. I don't know why so many local school districts don't. There are some who love us but they're few. One of the best districts around here makes it a point to hire ex engineers when they need science teachers. Of course you can get in line for those jobs. There are, unfortunately, more that hate us. I really don't know why. Then there are the districts that just prefer general science certs (a group major with 12 credits in chemistry and/or physics, 12 in life science and 12 in earth scienc here, compared to my 40+ in chemistry, 30+ in physics and 30+ in math.) because they can teach all science classes. Passing me over for a general science teacher I kind of get. Why hire someone who can teach only four subjects when you can hire someone who can teach them all. Copping an attitude when they figure out I'm an engineer turned teacher not a stay at home mom turned teacher I don't get.
Last edited by Ivorytickler; 08-03-2009 at 01:33 PM..
It's not an issue of certification. I am considered highly qualified to teach my subjects under NCLB. I'm actually more qualified than the average science teacher. I hold single subject certs (which means I majored or minored in each subject I teach). I have the same provisional certification that any new teacher in the fisrt three to six years has (assuming they convert without an extension). Because I have more education than the average new teacher, I will convert to professional certification in three years instead of the more typical five to six. Here, all new teachers get provisional certificates out of the gate. When they have completed a minimum of 3 years teaching and a minimum of 18 credits post grad work, they can convert to a professional certificate. I am, however, considered highly qualified under NCLB for the next 12 years if I do nothing. After that, I'd have to convert to a professional certificate. I plan to convert after three years, which is the minimum. (I think what you're calling a provisional certificate is different than what my state calls one. I had to have a, minimum, of a bachelors degree in teaching, student teach and pass four state teaching exams to get my provisional certificate. It takes experience in the classroom to convert to a professional certificate. If the provisional did not meet NCLB, no teacher would ever be able to get the experience needed to get a professional certificate.)
Charter schools do comply with NCLB. Because they are schools of choice. They like having sales angles for the parents. One is the credentials of their teachers. The first charter I worked for lists the degrees of all of it's teachers next to their names on the school website as well as former work experience. Parents like science and math teachers who come from industry. I don't know why so many local school districts don't. There are some who love us but they're few. One of the best districts around here makes it a point to hire ex engineers when they need science teachers. Of course you can get in line for those jobs. There are, unfortunately, more that hate us. I really don't know why. Then there are the districts that just prefer general science certs (a group major with 12 credits in chemistry and/or physics, 12 in life science and 12 in earth scienc here, compared to my 40+ in chemistry, 30+ in physics and 30+ in math.) because they can teach all science classes. Passing me over for a general science teacher I kind of get. Why hire someone who can teach only four subjects when you can hire someone who can teach them all. Copping an attitude when they figure out I'm an engineer turned teacher not a stay at home mom turned teacher I don't get.
What state are you in? Remember the documentation I provided said some states require charter schools to comply with certification and others don't. I find your state certification standards to be interesting and would like to learn more from their State Department of Education web site.
What state are you in? Remember the documentation I provided said some states require charter schools to comply with certification and others don't. I find your state certification standards to be interesting and would like to learn more from their State Department of Education web site.
I'm in Michigan. Since charter schools get state and federal monies, we're held to the same standards.
Here, when you complete a degree in teaching, student teach and pass your state exams, you get a provisional certificate which allows you to teach for 6 years. During that time, you are expected to complete 18 credits of coursework or a masters degree and acquire minimum of three years teaching experience. Once you have done so, you convert your provisional certificate to a professional certificate.
I think other states call a temporary certificate (the kind they used when there was a real teaching shortage as a stop gap measure) as a provisional certificate. Mine is considered full certification but there's a time limit to how long I can teach on a provisional certificate without meeting the requirements for a professional certificate and that is 12 years for the schooling portion. Indefinite for the experience portion.
You can renew once because you haven't completed the education requirements. If you have the education done but haven't gotten the experience, you can renew an unlimited number of times. This is for people like a friend of mine who finished her degree in teaching and then decided to stay at home for 6 years. All she had to do was apply for her provisional certificate and now she has six years to finish her ed requirements. If she doesn't clock three years of experience in the next six years, she can renew again until she does.
I'm not sure what the requirements are for keeping a professional certificate as I'm not there yet. I just know I need one class and three years experience to convert my certs. Then I'll figure out what it takes to keep them. I'm not sure what difference the professional certification makes but I would think more experience would help with marketability. I do not see jobs posting asking for professional certs. Some will post asking for a minimum number of years experience though.
It isn't so much what other teachers think but what decision-makers who hire think. There are lots of principals who are biased against teachers who did alternate certification...it makes it more tough for teachers who take this route to land jobs.
Why are they biased against AC as opposed to the traditional route? That's what I can't seem to understand.
I never knew principals who were biased against alternative ed certified teachers. In fact most wanted them.
Only when there is a teacher shortage. When there is an oversupply of teachers compared to openings, the principals tend to get more conservative and hire teachers with traditional certification.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mimimomx3
Why are they biased against AC as opposed to the traditional route? That's what I can't seem to understand.
Because the quality of the alternative certification programs has been all over the map. Unless the principal is familiar with particular programs and respects them, he/she may just exhibit bias against all alternative certification candidates.
If anyone is considering alternative certification, you have to make sure that the program has a strong relationship with the schools where you are interested in working.
Perhaps as alternative certification programs become more standardized, the bias against them will decrease.
As popularity soars, teacher certification programs get more oversight from Texas (http://www.star-telegram.com/metro_news/story/1506683.html - broken link)
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