Houston vs. Dallas (The Woodlands: resale, transplants, 2015)

[f4shionablecha0s]

Originally Posted by TexasTallest

you honestly don't see how Dallas has no viable alternative to re-routing 200,000 vehicles a day through the city?

The horseshoe project, currently under construction, is adding I-345 equivalent capacity to the other side of the downtown freeway exchange. That's the solution for some of the traffic.

The huge expansion of LBJ will add a more viable alternative compared to transferring in the center of the city. That's another part of the solution.

For the more local traffic, there are a variety of arterial streets around 345 that are under capacity.

And finally, for traffic that absolutely, positively MUST use 345 there's going to be an at-grade boulevard that roughly follows the same route.

This has all been extensively discussed. Just because you're too lazy to do the Googling doesn't mean that it hasn't been considered.

The interesting thing is that I-345 is going to have to be rebuilt anyway. The entire structure will have to be replaced, we aren't talking about something where they can just close a few lanes and do it incrementally. Even if Dallas decides to replace I-345, people will have to find an alternate route while it's closed for construction. Some people, like you apparently, think that people won't adapt at all - they'll simply attempt to replicate their old route like mindless lemmings and the traffic will be a nightmare. Others, like me, think that the traffic will disperse in a variety of ways and we'll be fine. Time will tell.

[TexasTallest]

Originally Posted by f4shionablecha0s

The horseshoe project, currently under construction, is adding I-345 equivalent capacity to the other side of the downtown freeway exchange. That's the solution for some of the traffic.

The huge expansion of LBJ will add a more viable alternative compared to transferring in the center of the city. That's another part of the solution.

For the more local traffic, there are a variety of arterial streets around 345 that are under capacity.

And finally, for traffic that absolutely, positively MUST use 345 there's going to be an at-grade boulevard that roughly follows the same route.

This has all been extensively discussed. Just because you're too lazy to do the Googling doesn't mean that it hasn't been considered.

The interesting thing is that I-345 is going to have to be rebuilt anyway. The entire structure will have to be replaced, we aren't talking about something where they can just close a few lanes and do it incrementally. Even if Dallas decides to replace I-345, people will have to find an alternate route while it's closed for construction. Some people, like you apparently, think that people won't adapt at all - they'll simply attempt to replicate their old route like mindless lemmings and the traffic will be a nightmare. Others, like me, think that the traffic will disperse in a variety of ways and we'll be fine. Time will tell.

how does the Horseshoe project help with i345? its only for 35E over to 30W..?

so taking a detour around the semi-circle LBJ (approximately the radius of Beltway 8 as far as i can tell), provides a quick and easy way to get from 45 to 75?

ah. reducing a 200,000 vehicle highway to an at grade boulevard.. it all makes sense now...

i guess I'm looking for more official plans.. TxDot plans, if you will.. sure some dude can scheme up traffic patterns all he wants, but until TxDot starts making an initiative and getting behind the studies, this is all meaningless.

the interesting thing is that Houston rebuilt/trenched the elevated i69 lanes through Montrose just fine. its called doing half of the road at a time. sure people will "find an alternate", but those "alternate" routes will become even more congested than they already are (Dallas' traffic is already pretty bad..). like I've been saying. suddenly getting rid of a 200,000 vehicle a day highway isn't a very good idea. at least Houston can keep the Pierce open while they build new i45 lanes along side i69/i10 so that traffic can basically flow uninterrupted through most of the construction..

[TexasTallest]

Midtown Redevelopment Authority, Camden Property Trust to hold groundbreaking for 'SuperBlock' - Houston Business Journal

Midtown Park is a six-acre site that will be developed into a mixed-use facility including a public park, retail space, residential facilities and a public parking garage, according to the Midtown Redevelopment Authority.

Camden began work in 2014 on the $90 million Camden McGowen Station, an eight-story, 315-unit apartment complex along Main and McGowen streets near downtown Houston.
The Midtown Redevelopment Authority project consists of two park spaces covering a total of three acres, including food and beverage anchors, pedestrian-oriented streetscapes and the underground parking garage, which will have 400 spaces.

[dallasboi]

Originally Posted by TexasTallest

how does the Horseshoe project help with i345? its only for 35E over to 30W..?

so taking a detour around the semi-circle LBJ (approximately the radius of Beltway 8 as far as i can tell), provides a quick and easy way to get from 45 to 75?

ah. reducing a 200,000 vehicle highway to an at grade boulevard.. it all makes sense now...

i guess I'm looking for more official plans.. TxDot plans, if you will.. sure some dude can scheme up traffic patterns all he wants, but until TxDot starts making an initiative and getting behind the studies, this is all meaningless.

the interesting thing is that Houston rebuilt/trenched the elevated i69 lanes through Montrose just fine. its called doing half of the road at a time. sure people will "find an alternate", but those "alternate" routes will become even more congested than they already are (Dallas' traffic is already pretty bad..). like I've been saying. suddenly getting rid of a 200,000 vehicle a day highway isn't a very good idea. at least Houston can keep the Pierce open while they build new i45 lanes along side i69/i10 so that traffic can basically flow uninterrupted through most of the construction..

You

Thats 200,000 a day.....not all at once.....


So what are houstonians gonna do when they are rerouting everything?

[TexasTallest]

Originally Posted by dallasboi

So what are houstonians gonna do when they are rerouting everything?

Originally Posted by TexasTallest

... at least Houston can keep the Pierce open while they build new i45 lanes along side i69/i10 so that traffic can basically flow uninterrupted through most of the construction..

Can you not read..? From the last sentence in my comment YOU QUOTED..

[f4shionablecha0s]

Originally Posted by TexasTallest

how does the Horseshoe project help with i345? its only for 35E over to 30W..?

so taking a detour around the semi-circle LBJ (approximately the radius of Beltway 8 as far as i can tell), provides a quick and easy way to get from 45 to 75?

ah. reducing a 200,000 vehicle highway to an at grade boulevard.. it all makes sense now...

i guess I'm looking for more official plans.. TxDot plans, if you will.. sure some dude can scheme up traffic patterns all he wants, but until TxDot starts making an initiative and getting behind the studies, this is all meaningless.

the interesting thing is that Houston rebuilt/trenched the elevated i69 lanes through Montrose just fine. its called doing half of the road at a time. sure people will "find an alternate", but those "alternate" routes will become even more congested than they already are (Dallas' traffic is already pretty bad..). like I've been saying. suddenly getting rid of a 200,000 vehicle a day highway isn't a very good idea. at least Houston can keep the Pierce open while they build new i45 lanes along side i69/i10 so that traffic can basically flow uninterrupted through most of the construction..

45 to 75: You can exit 20 and take the loop. If that doesn't work, then go around the other way on the mixmaster (that's where the horseshoe project comes in). If that doesn't work, then take one of the arterial streets such as Good-Latimer. If that doesn't work, THEN you'd be relegated to the boulevard.

There's no TXDOT plan because we aren't building another freeway. That's the entire idea. We have TOO MANY freeways. Freeways are not the answer. I know that's going to be hard to process for someone from Houston, but we're trying to reduce the number of freeways. Building another freeway to replace the freeway we're demolishing is pointless.

[TexasTallest]

Originally Posted by f4shionablecha0s

45 to 75: You can exit 20 and take the loop. If that doesn't work, then go around the other way on the mixmaster (that's where the horseshoe project comes in). If that doesn't work, then take one of the arterial streets such as Good-Latimer. If that doesn't work, THEN you'd be relegated to the boulevard.

There's no TXDOT plan because we aren't building another freeway. That's the entire idea. We have TOO MANY freeways. Freeways are not the answer. I know that's going to be hard to process for someone from Houston, but we're trying to reduce the number of freeways. Building another freeway to replace the freeway we're demolishing is pointless.

the Horseshoe project doesn't address traffic along 30 between 45 and 35, or traffic along Woodall Rodgers between 35 and 75..?

oh right.. i wouldn't understand because "I'm from Houston". last i checked you are from DALLAS, which is just as car-centric/suburban of a city as Houston (possibly even more so). pot calling the kettle black? you can't be that naive to think you can just remove a highway that carries 200,000 people a day, consequence free, from a thriving community thats adding over 100,000 people a year.

[RonnieinDallas]

Originally Posted by TexasTallest

the Horseshoe project doesn't address traffic along 30 between 45 and 35, or traffic along Woodall Rodgers between 35 and 75..?

oh right.. i wouldn't understand because "I'm from Houston". last i checked you are from DALLAS, which is just as car-centric/suburban of a city as Houston (possibly even more so). pot calling the kettle black? you can't be that naive to think you can just remove a highway that carries 200,000 people a day, consequence free, from a thriving community thats adding over 100,000 people a year.

It has worked in every city it's been done, and FYI 200,000 is the inflated TxDOT number of cars, not the actual number.

I know it's counter intuitive and you obviously don't understand how traffic works, so why not admit you haven't actually done any research on the topic and move on?

[dallasboi]

Originally Posted by RonnieinDallas

It has worked in every city it's been done, and FYI 200,000 is the inflated TxDOT number of cars, not the actual number.

I know it's counter intuitive and you obviously don't understand how traffic works, so why not admit you haven't actually done any research on the topic and move on?

+1

[TexasTallest]

Originally Posted by TexasTallest

After years of fighting, METRO and their toughest opponent have (finally!) reached an agreement regarding transit in Houston.

(Rail through Culbersons district on Richmond and Post Oak would have to be approved by voters before moving forward)

Culberson will work towards securing hundreds of milliions (possibly over a billion?) of dollars in federal funding for projects ranging from a 90A commuter rail line ($587 million); new busses, park and ride expansions, HOV lane improvements ($300 million); and getting whatever money is left over from the kitty ($900 million) Houston received for light rail, to implement towards these future transit projects.

Metro, Culberson announce agreement on transit - Houston Chronicle



info on the 90A line..



METRO Current Projects - US 90A/Southwest Rail Corridor

Originally Posted by TexasTallest

Midtown Redevelopment Authority, Camden Property Trust to hold groundbreaking for 'SuperBlock' - Houston Business Journal

as noted above.. i've been trying to "move on" and discuss other things for some time now. but instead of discussing the articles linked the boi keeps going on about the i345 removal. congrats on Ronnie proving me wrong.. y'all got me. apparently a few cities have removed freeways successfully. I'm not sure what point y'all are proving though? i agreed it was possible to remove i345. i just didn't think it would work very well redirecting all of that traffic onto a couple downtown streets like the video Ronnie originally linked showed. and obviously i understand the positive of freeway removal from a developer and urbanist standpoint.. I've been clamoring for the Pierce removal for years for those very reasons the recent i345 plan is trying to replicate.