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First we have Brexit, and stop unlimited immigration from the EU. We pick and chose who we need for our economy by visa.
Once free of EU rules, we can make our own. No access to council waiting lists for foreigners. Start building homes for the people here, for rents that folks can actually afford. Citizens first before foreigners. Benefits have to be given now the same as citizens. We change the rules for foreigners. If they don't have a job after a certain period of time, benefits stop. No more benefits for children outside the country.
Immigration from outside the EU - an investigation to find out who and why. No more phoney students from Africa, and other places. Refugee family reunions........ go back home, and rejoin there.
If things get real difficult after Brexit, many of the EU immigrants will self deport. I am fully aware of just how difficult it may get. We still have to push on, for the sake of generations yet unborn.
How's that for ya?
Pie in the sky and straight out of Trumps manifesto
You can say no to immigrants now just like Italy but won’t.
You can check everyone’s psssports on entry and deny access to those you feel are not legal or have bad intentions but you don’t.
Benefits are ruining the uk and this needs stopping for everyone no matter where they come from, benefits should be for the needy not the can’t be arsed.
Pie in the sky and straight out of Trumps manifesto
You can say no to immigrants now just like Italy but won’t.
You can check everyone’s psssports on entry and deny access to those you feel are not legal or have bad intentions but you don’t.
Benefits are ruining the uk and this needs stopping for everyone no matter where they come from, benefits should be for the needy not the can’t be arsed.
You think Donald Trump came from nowhere? You think things can't change with a determined leader? After we leave the EU, it's going to get messy.
We pissed the Germans off after 1918. What did we get in 1933 - Adolf Hitler. If we get in a real financial mess after Brexit, instigated by the EU, there will be consequences. We will have an hardening of attitudes, and a leader will emerge.
We have people coming here in the back of lorry's. What sort of passport checks will stop them? All that will stop this mess is a new kind of regime. One that actually puts the people of this country first, before foreigners. If we don't do it, we're sunk.
In the early 80s, Margaret Thatcher and her determination to destroy the working class, caused long term employment. Most of the real damage comes from that time. Folks losing their jobs, and never working again. Their children growing up in unemployed households. Girls deliberately getting pregnant to get a council house. The feckless were allowed to flourish. When things improved, what did we do? Many of the new jobs went to eager foreigners. Well educated Polish people willing to work for minimum wage peanuts. That money went a long way when sent back to Poland with the exchange rate of that time. Our people? Left to rot. Thatchers government allowed this to happen, and the Major regime carried it on. They created a generation of unemployables. Who would even dream of giving a job to such people, when you have an ever growing army of eager foreigners? That's what was done to the people at the bottom of the pile in this country. They don't even know it, because it has been so their whole lives.
You stop benefits suddenly, and you'll have riots that will make those seen in London in 2011 look like a stroll in the park. We can't just do nothing, and bend to the EU's will. They don't give a damn about the future of my country, and will see us descend into civil unrest without even raising an eyebrow. Just as long as the four pillars are obeyed.
You are doing it again, your ranting at the EU for British politicians mistakes.
Everything you say is true, you just need to attribute the blame in the right direction.
Our politicians can do nothing. The EU is unwilling to move on any of the things that caused the Brexit result. They can't........ any attempt to do a real trade deal with us, would undermine the EU, and it's four pillars.
There never was a chance of doing a deal, and yes, we have wasted two years trying to get one. Yes, I agree, the politicians in charge in the UK are incompetent. So what do we do then? Vote in Corbyn's band of nut cases?
We have no choice but to stick with what we have. They may change the leader, but my concern is that we make it to Brexit, and then let the cards fall where they may. There is nothing more important than regaining our freedom from the suffocating EU. We can do nothing to change what's wrong in our country, until we regain the right to change laws to suit the citizens of this country.
Once we're free with no trade deal, we will have to do the best we can outside the EU to trade. It is going to be real hard, and difficult. Great damage will be done to our economy, and Europe's as well. It may take us years to recover. We will find out who our friends are, and our enemies also.
Better to have our enemies out in the open, than slyly stabbing us in the back like the French.
Our politicians can do nothing. The EU is unwilling to move on any of the things that caused the Brexit result. They can't........ any attempt to do a real trade deal with us, would undermine the EU, and it's four pillars.
There never was a chance of doing a deal, and yes, we have wasted two years trying to get one. Yes, I agree, the politicians in charge in the UK are incompetent. So what do we do then? Vote in Corbyn's band of nut cases?
We have no choice but to stick with what we have. They may change the leader, but my concern is that we make it to Brexit, and then let the cards fall where they may. There is nothing more important than regaining our freedom from the suffocating EU. We can do nothing to change what's wrong in our country, until we regain the right to change laws to suit the citizens of this country.
Once we're free with no trade deal, we will have to do the best we can outside the EU to trade. It is going to be real hard, and difficult. Great damage will be done to our economy, and Europe's as well. It may take us years to recover. We will find out who our friends are, and our enemies also.
Better to have our enemies out in the open, than slyly stabbing us in the back like the French.
The only options left are whether we should leave with a deal or no deal.
Given that the Chequers plan has been rejected by the EU, and it doesn't look like we can find common ground, then we should just move.
We can either try and get a free trade agreement like Canada and equivelency in terms of finance or we can just walk away that's the options left.
The Irish border is irrelevant, as we are not going to police a hard border and Southern Ireland won't either.
If the EU wan't to go to WTO rules and a hard brexit then it's going to cause them all kinds of problems, and a free trade and financial services equivalency agreement would mean they can still sell to the UK which isd one of their biggest markets and they will receive their £40 billion payment.
All the UK needs is a free trade and financial equivalency deal and lots of countries around the world already have free trade agreements and financial equivalency with the EU.
As for a General Election, that's not going to happen, and has been ruled out.
A more likely scenario is a post-Brexit Tory leadership battle, however once we leave we leave.
The Italians have said no more and they mean it, no boats going there now and they’ll remain in Europe.
The Uk can do the same, you’ve got natural boarders to protect you so you should have the least immigrants getting through out of all of Europe.
The UK really need to follow others countries take on being on the EU, enjoy the good bits and ignore the stupid parts, Spain’s great at kicking things down the road, they’ve done that with every EU law they don’t like so far.
There really is no reason to leave the EU and all it’s benefits to fix immigration.
I think what Dave is driving at is that in Europe if the UK had the most strict anti-immigration government ever. We could not limit our inward immigration.
While we don't have this, without having a real means of reinforcing UK immigration restrictions, it doesn't matter a whole lot what we have.
Step 1 is to enable the UKs govt. to reduce inward immigration. Doesn't matter what step 2 may be until step 1 is performed.
Personally I don't agree with preventing immigration, but, I also don't agree that immigrants (or anyone) should be able to rely on tax payers to fund their lifestyles without significant contribution to the country/community etc.
I said it before, you can have open borders or a welfare state, you can't have both. There are probably 6B people worse off than the average Brit, that's a lot of folks who would kill for the chance to have what the average Brit has, and you can't tax enough to support that entire 6B.
The Italians have said no more and they mean it, no boats going there now and they’ll remain in Europe.
The Uk can do the same, you’ve got natural boarders to protect you so you should have the least immigrants getting through out of all of Europe.
The UK really need to follow others countries take on being on the EU, enjoy the good bits and ignore the stupid parts, Spain’s great at kicking things down the road, they’ve done that with every EU law they don’t like so far.
There really is no reason to leave the EU and all it’s benefits to fix immigration.
We are leaving, so it's a bit late for that
If you remember Cameron went to Europe before the Brexit vote to get us a deal where we could ignore some bits of the EU'S grand plan for a federal Europe but it still didn't wash with the electorate.
Our options now are a deal or no deal, as there is no chance of a second referendum and there is now only 6 months left to go before we leave.
A deal will most likely be a free trade deal based on a similar deal offered to Canada with an added financial services equivalency deal.
As for Ireland, it's not really important because unless you are willing to properly police a hard border then it won't happen, and neither side is willing to establish a hard border, so the EU is just being stupid. There are borders that work very well between EU and Non EU countries that are fairly frictionless in other parts of Europe.
Other than that the only other real option is a hard brexit.
There is nothing really to left to argue about, as that's the reality of the situation as a softer brexit via the Chequers plan has been rejected.
Last edited by Brave New World; 09-23-2018 at 06:07 AM..
I said it before, you can have open borders or a welfare state, you can't have both. There are probably 6B people worse off than the average Brit, that's a lot of folks who would kill for the chance to have what the average Brit has, and you can't tax enough to support that entire 6B.
And this is why the UK is having so many issues with immigration that are not being felt elsewhere around Europe.
We're in a mess whatever we do. But I will never vote for continued unlimited immigration. I won't sit back comfy in my paid for house, going on my foreign holidays, and ignore what's going on all around me. All I have is a vote.
Have you ever seen a film called 'Soylent Green'? It was made in the early 70s, and showed a world destroyed by pollution. Folks living on the streets, and only the privileged having even a roof over their heads. The younger people of that time only knew this way of living. An old guy in the movie was played by Edward G Robinson.
The government wanted rid of all these old people who had memories of when things were different. They remembered clean water, and green fields. When an old person had enough of this living hell, they could go to a certain building to die. Edward G decided to do this. He was strapped to a bed, and given poison. But, before he died, he was shown a film on a huge screen of life as it was when he was young. He lay there dying, and looking at the world of his youth.
Another character played by Charlton Heston had made his way there to try and stop the suicide. He went into the room Edward G was dying in, and he saw the film. He realised everything he had been told by Edward G was true. The world he had described actually really did exist.
I feel this is what we're dealing with the young of Britain today. They have been brought up hearing the mantras, 'the EU is of benefit to us all.' 'Multiculturism and diversity is good.' 'Being packed like sardines, and paying through the nose for a season ticket on trains is normal.' 'Being unable to afford a home is your own fault. Work harder.' 'Being surrounded by foreigners who wish us harm has always been so.' Just stare at your phone all day, and don't think for yourself. Just obey Big Brother. This is where we're at in this country. Stupid young people who think an education makes them intelligent. Older people who just look on in amazement and despair. The kids just don't know any better, or any different.
But, as in America, many have had enough. The powers that be, thought, give 'em a vote to shut them up on the EU once and for all. We'll scare 'em to death, and they'll vote as we say. Get some bankers to scare 'em, and even the American President. Icing on the cake, get the Chancellor of the Exchequer to threaten an immediate budget if they vote leave, and tell 'em the country will collapse.
They did all that, and we still voted to leave. Now, the EU is twisting the knife, and trying to force another vote. You think it's in the bag for remain? I don't, and what we will see on the streets won't be pretty.
You missed mentioning the set piece and final irony of that film being the old were, after death, processed into an edible called "solylent green" which was the only sustenance available in quantities to sustain the massive over-population.
Slowly but surely...…...we're on that track.
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