Lidl Plans First Two Stores in DC Region in Prince George's County (Crofton: 2013, prices)

[Mos82]

Originally Posted by selhars

I looked up the site of the proposed TJ's north of Rockville. It's only 7 miles from the one on Rockville Pike.
While it is "close" in location compared to how TJ's are usually located….I can see how it will pull from a different area as well.

That said…there is just NO EXCUSE whatsoever for PG county not to have a Tjs. They are just all around but not in PG. Sorry I just don't think that's accidental. You can't tell me the county can't support a Trader Joe's. The MOM's in Bowie is doing GREAT business. And I'm hardly ever elsewhere in the county, but I'd imagine the one in College Park and the Yes! Organic Market in Hyattsville are cleaning up as well.

Why do the "better" (dare I say more affluent?) parts of PG County have to "pay/suffer" because of the stigma of the rest of it. No one thinks all of Montgomery County is the same. Why does all of PG get broad brushed? (No answer needed, it's practically a rhetorical question at this point.) It's one of the reasons I really didn't want to move here. But I did so…..now I have to do most of my shopping -- and ALL of my fine dining outside my own county. I can't say I regret it, so I guess I'll stop bemoaning it now. (or should I say "for now")

It's skin color. When the Wegmens opened up in Woodmore area lots of highend food magazines were surprised by that location being selected. Even though the income and educational attainment were higher then most Wegmens spots. What cause the surprise was the racial demographic

[CBMD]

Originally Posted by Mos82

It's skin color. When the Wegmens opened up in Woodmore area lots of highend food magazines were surprised by that location being selected. Even though the income and educational attainment were higher then most Wegmens spots. What cause the surprise was the racial demographic

According to Wegmans own internal stats, some of which are publicly viewable near the checkout area, (last I checked about 12 months ago), the Woodmore store is not performing particularly well. I'm not saying it's a failure, just that it's not near the top of the pile. Their Fairfax sore was or is #1 in Wegmans, and all of the US. It surpassed the flagship home store in NY, in part because it sells beer and wine.

[lookingbutnotlost]

Originally Posted by CBMD

According to Wegmans own internal stats, some of which are publicly viewable near the checkout area, (last I checked about 12 months ago), the Woodmore store is not performing particularly well. I'm not saying it's a failure, just that it's not near the top of the pile. Their Fairfax sore was or is #1 in Wegmans, and all of the US. It surpassed the flagship home store in NY, in part because it sells beer and wine.

well the Wegman's is also close to a Whole Foods and a pretty crappy Safeway so there are a lot of markets in that area

[adelphi_sky]

Originally Posted by lookingbutnotlost

well the Wegman's is also close to a Whole Foods and a pretty crappy Safeway so there are a lot of markets in that area

Whole Foods? Where?

[gentlearts]

So, I've been reading the thread with interest, since we are getting one of the first LIDL stores in the US here in a suburb of Savannah GA.
Someone compared it to a cross between Harris Teeter and Aldi. This doesn't compute, since the Harris Teeters here are really upscale, and the Aldis are, bare bones and no frills.
Even those who are familiar with LIDL in Europe, wonder if the US version might be a different version entirely.
I'm a loyal Publix shopper, but I really can't wait to see the LIDL store.

[CBMD]

I've compared their US operation to a possible cross between Aldi and Trader Joe, but I'm 100% speculating about that. I've seen some recent commentary that might suggest otherwise.

Traditionally, in Europe both have had similar basic low price and smaller size stores, but both are now moving more upscale. Lidl at a faster pace it seems.

In the US Lidl stores will be about 30,000 sqf, that's about twice the size of an existing Aldi. The question arises as to how Lidl will use that extra space. One theory is that because Aldi also owns Trader Joe, Lidl in the US will offer something that is like an Aldi/Trader Joe hybrid, which doesn't appear too far removed from where they seem headed in Europe.

Don't believe they will be anything like a Harris Teeter or Publix.

[lukas1973]

Originally Posted by gentlearts

So, I've been reading the thread with interest, since we are getting one of the first LIDL stores in the US here in a suburb of Savannah GA.
Someone compared it to a cross between Harris Teeter and Aldi. This doesn't compute, since the Harris Teeters here are really upscale, and the Aldis are, bare bones and no frills.
Even those who are familiar with LIDL in Europe, wonder if the US version might be a different version entirely.
I'm a loyal Publix shopper, but I really can't wait to see the LIDL store.

I think I was the one that mention Lidl in the U.S. would be like a mix out of Aldi, Trader Joe's and Harris Teeter. I have read this statement somewhere on the internet. I have thought about that and I think it makes sense.

The similarity with Trader Joes's is in my opinion that Lidl offers a much wider range of international food specialties compared to Aldi. They are offered for a limited time, mostly in a weekly rhythm. The selection of such food products at Lidl is just wider and more exotic compared to Aldi. Lidl has significant more cooler and freezer space than Aldi and is able to offer more chilled and frozen international food specialties. The Greek week at Aldi normally consist just out of a selection of dried and other non-perishable goods, whereas Lidl offers a decent range of chilled and frozen Greek convenience food in addition to the dried and non-perishable selection. That was the reason why I think Lidl has some similarities with Trader Joe's.

The similarity with a more upscale grocery chain like Harris Teeter is in my opinion that the new Lidl stores are a lot nicer designed than the typical Aldi stores. Of course Lidl is not an upscale grocery store. It doesn't have a service deli department with cheeses, meat and fish. It's just a design thing that make Lidl appear more upscale. Compared to Aldi, the flooring at Lidl looks nicer, the store fixtures are anthracite colored with wooden elements instead of the shoddy beige ones that were common in older grocery stores. The fixtures in the bakery and the produce department are wooden. Intead of these awful strip lights they use nice spotlights. The new Lidl stores just look a lot more upscale than the old Aldi and Lidl stores. In addition to this the new Lidl stores are quite spacious. There is much more space for the customers and more space for special product placements.

From what I have seen the new Lidl stores look in my opinion nicer than most conventional grocery stores in the U.S. But that's probably just a different sense of what is considered good design between Europe and the U.S. I think conventional grocery stores in the U.S. are definitely different than in Germany. I think they are most comparable to Kaufland stores in Europe. Kaufland is often described as a big box discounter or compact hypermarket.

That's a newer Kaufland store in Romania:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qw4meAEEVnY



What makes a grocery store upscale or upscale looking?

Upscale means for me:
- store dominated by large and fancy service departments for meat, cheese and fish
- a wide selection of gourmet food
- a nice wine department with sit down area and wine tasting
- coffee lounge
- state-of-the-art fixtures
- pleasing illumination
- short aisles
- unobstrusive price tags
- overall well designed store
- well designed shopping carts
- well dressed and knowledgeable employees


An example for an ordinary to slightly upscale grocery store:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpw1bcsknMg

Weekly flyer:

https://edeka-paschmann.de/wp-conten...dnr=645#page/1

A more upscale grocery store:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60KXlsxIlbA

Weekly flyer (looks badly designed):
Blätterkatalog

And a really upscale grocery store:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhj-VyCU2Y0

Weekly flyer:
Angebote Düsseldorf KW 51



An older Lidl store in Spain:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ip7cURekemg


A newer Lidl store in Lithuania:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1uBS-IdKzA


Of course Lidl is not upscale. But like almost everything these days it's going more upscale design wise.

I don't have the impression that Publix stores look well designed or are upscale. I think the good service at Publix sets this chain apart from most competitors.

[adelphi_sky]

Originally Posted by lukas1973

From what I have seen the new Lidl stores look in my opinion nicer than most conventional grocery stores in the U.S. But that's probably just a different sense of what is considered good design between Europe and the U.S. I think conventional grocery stores in the U.S. are definitely different than in Germany. I think they are most comparable to Kaufland stores in Europe. Kaufland is often described as a big box discounter or compact hypermarket.

The Edeka store looked very upscale to me. lol The next three videos looked increasingly more upscale. I can certainly now see the difference between what Europe considers discount no-frills stores in Lidl and Aldi. But I think if Edeka is what Europe calls ordinary, they blow away your average Safeways, Giants, and even Harris Teeter in design and style. Kaufland reminds me of our regular stores here. Fiene Kost reminds me of a European style Wegmans. Huge with large departments within. Hieber's Frische reminds me of Balduccis or potentially Whole Foods.

I think that's where Wegman's and Whole Foods shines. They break away from the average bright incandescent lights and linoleum floor look. To me at least.

I personally like design and style when I shop. I know some people don't care. But the amount of time I spend in a store I'd at least want to have a pleasant experience. I guess I'm weird like that.

[CBMD]

The average Aldi or Lidl caries about 1,500 SKU's. The average EU grocery store 15,000. The average US grocery store, like a regular Safeway 40,000. That's one reason why in Europe grocery stores can be clustered closer together.

[lukas1973]

Originally Posted by CBMD

The average Aldi or Lidl caries about 1,500 SKU's. The average EU grocery store 15,000. The average US grocery store, like a regular Safeway 40,000. That's one reason why in Europe grocery stores can be clustered closer together.

True.
I think it's easier to find an example to show what a typical American grocery store looks like compared to for example in Germany. Typical American grocery store: About 3,500-4,000m² net sales area and number of SKU about 40,000.
It's seems impossible to find an example for a typical German grocery store. The Edeka stores (largest grocery chain in Germany) ranges in size from about 400m² to more than 6,000m² (net sales area) and the number of SKU from less than 10,000 to more than 50,000. My nearest Edeka store (a newly revamped Edeka Paschmann) has 3,700m² selling space and over 45,000 items. The independent grocer Paschmann operates 9 Edeka grocery stores. The one near me is the largest one. The smallest Edeka Paschmann grocery store is in Mülheim-Oberdümpten and has a selling area of just 780m² and about 12,000 items.


Meat deli department in the largest Edeka-Paschmann store:




Meat deli department in the smallest Edeka-Paschmann store:




Edeka stores, especially in villages in Southern Bavaria are even much smaller. The length of the combined meat and cheese deli counter is maybe just 5m. And they have surely less than 10,000 items.

Out of the 28,000 grocery stores in Germany 16,000 are discounters (Aldi, Lidl, Netto, Penny, Norma and a second Netto chain from a Danish retailer). Aldi and Lidl are already the best looking ones. Norma discount stores are by far the worst ones. I'm wondering that they are still able to be profitable. And why people are shopping there.
In Düsseldorf some city districts don't have a conventional grocery store, just discounters. That's really bad.