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I'm not disagreeing with you, Kruetz. We've started looking seriously at Greenwich and the more we see, the more we just don't get the mentality in Westchester. They shrug their shoulders at 2%+ property taxes that rise 2-3x the rate of inflation with no end in sight. It's already insanely expensive to live here, so it's not like they need to tax at a high percentage to get by.
There is no logical reason not to combine the services to the county level. We are not that big that we can't have one school district, one police force, etc. But you know the unions will never allow that.
I moved to Charlotte and we returned in a year. The women there were the worst social climbers I have ever encountered- and "nice"- ha!
I have to agree - I don't think Westchester is the worst in this regard, by far. As I've noted before, I found it much worse in Los Angeles, even in the middle or upper mid communities just not Brentwood or Beverly Hills (where I worked, and in the entertainment business no less). The social climbing, materialism and competition are endemic to most of this country. No matter what the relative wealth of an area, those who perceive themselves to be at the top of the social order will flaunt whatever they have - the best pickup truck or whatever the case is. The others will do whatever they can to convince people they belong there. The result is that many of the people with the nicest "things" more likely than not have leased everything, mortgaged their house to the hilt, and don't have $2 in savings.
I just don't see this happening so much here (again - we are in northern Westchester). People take pride in their homes and in their kids' education and accomplishments. Those are admirable qualities as long as it's not taken to the extreme, and I just haven't experienced this extreme yet. As a matter of fact, I've found that most people here are sensible, real, hardworking, and just as likely to drive an older car (even if it was expensive at one point) rather than the newest Porsche. The downside is if they don't like you, you will probably know it. I don't mind that so much. I'm tired of people being "nice" on the surface without being sincere - this is so typical of LA where so much of what you get from people is a facade. I am much happier here!
I really hope they do not combine services here. One of the things that made me choose Westchester over CT was size of schools. Greenwich high school has almost 3000 kids. I am not leaving the city to place my kids in gigantic schools. I wanted a small town feel and I couldn't find that in CT. I know others feel differently buy I would rather pay high taxes so that my children can go to a small school. Some people would rather pay less and move to other parts of the country and I would pay more to be near NYC. Everyone is different.
There is no logical reason not to combine the services to the county level. We are not that big that we can't have one school district, one police force, etc. But you know the unions will never allow that.
A lot of why they don't is the extreme "NIMBYism" that exists here. Let's take even some "bordering" districts. Do you think that Bronxville will want to be in the same schoold district as Yonkers? Or Pelham in the same one as Mt. Vernon? Or Briarcliff Manor the same one as Ossining, etc.? Ditto police and fire to some extent.
A lot of how Westchester works (and while it will sound "racist" it is somewhat more "classist") is people pay more to be away from "them", whoever "they" may be (it's a lot of complicated things) by being in the more expensive towns and villages. In few other places are "rich" and "poor" places so close to one another without a gradual mix in between the two.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lan3
I really hope they do not combine services here. One of the things that made me choose Westchester over CT was size of schools. Greenwich high school has almost 3000 kids. I am not leaving the city to place my kids in gigantic schools. I wanted a small town feel and I couldn't find that in CT. I know others feel differently buy I would rather pay high taxes so that my children can go to a small school. Some people would rather pay less and move to other parts of the country and I would pay more to be near NYC. Everyone is different.
Actually, CT (particularly Fairfield County, which borders Westchester) is very similar to Westchester in the aspects I gave above, in some ways more so ("county" government does not exist in CT at all except for the court system, whereas outside of schools and police/fire, Westchester actually has a fairly strong county gov't.....for example the county park system). It just happens that for whatever reason all of Greenwich (which population-wise is actually about the size of White Plains but much more spread out) has one high school. But most of the smaller towns in Fairfield have their own high school too, there are actually more "small" school districts in Fairfield than in Westchester, only very "rural" areas consolidate into a regional school district in CT, none of which are in Fairfield county. While there's a little less of the "NIMBY" and "us vs. them" vibe that many towns in Westchester has, it does exist to a significant extent there too, especially in the towns and villages closer to NY.
"Do you think that Bronxville will want to be in the same schoold district as Yonkers? Or Pelham in the same one as Mt. Vernon? Or Briarcliff Manor the same one as Ossining, etc.?"
This part I don't get...you still have to attend the school zoned for your house, which factors into your home's ultimate value. Nearly everywhere else in the country does it this way, and they do just fine. Kids in Mt. Vernon will never go to Pelham schools, unless they are ever combined.
BTW, even though Greenwich High is 2600 kids or so, they are broken into a few blocks, so really, it's not as bad as it sounds. But again it is always personal preference.
I really hope they do not combine services here. One of the things that made me choose Westchester over CT was size of schools. Greenwich high school has almost 3000 kids. I am not leaving the city to place my kids in gigantic schools. I wanted a small town feel and I couldn't find that in CT. I know others feel differently buy I would rather pay high taxes so that my children can go to a small school. Some people would rather pay less and move to other parts of the country and I would pay more to be near NYC. Everyone is different.
Greenwich covers a wide geographic area, including not only Greenwich proper but also Cos Cob, Riverside and Old Greenwich, hence the reason for the large enrollment at Greenwich High School.
Did you look at smaller towns in Fairfield county such as New Canaan and Darien, both of which have their own train stations and high schools? Yes, they're farther away from NYC, but people do commute from these areas into NYC.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjinla
This part I don't get...you still have to attend the school zoned for your house, which factors into your home's ultimate value. Nearly everywhere else in the country does it this way, and they do just fine. Kids in Mt. Vernon will never go to Pelham schools, unless they are ever combined.
I don't have kids, but if what you say above is true, then why do I see so many of those small school bus vans out on the highway shuttling kids around way beyond the school district that is printed on the side of the van? Seems to me like kids are being shuttled around all over the county between districts, based on all of the little school bus vans I see on the highways around Westchester.
"I don't have kids, but if what you say above is true, then why do I see so many of those small school bus vans out on the highway shuttling kids around way beyond the school district that is printed on the side of the van?"
I would guess that many of these are for special ed kids. I was told by a teacher in Ardsley, for instance, that many kids in Bronxville and Scarsdale are tuitioned out to their schools because their own district cannot service them properly in some cases. My son actually takes one of those from his preschool, but it doesn't have a school district name on the side.
I can bet you, nobody from Mt. Vernon is attending Scarsdale schools unless they have a relative in the area and are lying about their address. You can only attend the district that you pay taxes to.
We actually love Old Greenwich and find it to have a very small town feel. New Caanan and Darien are totally different animals, though. Very little diversity...too little for us to feel comfortable, even though we aren't minorities.
BTW, Cali...now I get why we had totally different experiences in LA. Entertainment is a very tough industry to work in there. We were in advertising...totally different animal. The CEOs there make a million a year and come to work wearing flip flops in their Prius.
"Do you think that Bronxville will want to be in the same schoold district as Yonkers? Or Pelham in the same one as Mt. Vernon? Or Briarcliff Manor the same one as Ossining, etc.?"
This part I don't get...you still have to attend the school zoned for your house, which factors into your home's ultimate value. Nearly everywhere else in the country does it this way, and they do just fine. Kids in Mt. Vernon will never go to Pelham schools, unless they are ever combined.
In a "county" system, that may not be so true. But even so, I wasn't saying it's a reality, it's just how many people would think and thus why you'd never see an effort to consolidate school systems, etc. And they already don't do it the way you describe in Yonkers or Stamford, I think they use a lottery based on your 1st thru 3rd choices, etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjinla
I can bet you, nobody from Mt. Vernon is attending Scarsdale schools unless they have a relative in the area and are lying about their address. You can only attend the district that you pay taxes to.
There's more of that than you think (though it's not common)......I hear of quite of few cases each year where there are students in the Bronxville and Pelham systems using a relative's address who live in Mt. Vernon.......even more common is people in the Bronx trying to "sneak" their kids into Mt. Vernon, figuring that since it's "better" but not "elite" they have a less likely chance of getting "caught" (you can actually attend other school districts if you don't live there, but you usually have to pay a "tuition fee" that is similar to the cost of private school so it's not worth it).
In terms of the home prices, I've been visiting realtor websites and it looks like home prices are taking a hit in good neighborhoods like Armonk, Chappaqua and Pleasantville, albeit in small increments. I would like to move to Westchester myself if home prices come down a little bit more.
I really hope they do not combine services here. One of the things that made me choose Westchester over CT was size of schools. Greenwich high school has almost 3000 kids. I am not leaving the city to place my kids in gigantic schools. I wanted a small town feel and I couldn't find that in CT. I know others feel differently buy I would rather pay high taxes so that my children can go to a small school.
If you didn't have these tiny schools that everyone had to participate in whether or not they wanted to, you would have a much lower tax bill and could send them to a private school. Seems more equitable to me.
The high schools my kids will be going to when they're older is ranked 6th in the state of Virginia (it holds its own against the wealthiest schools in Fairfax and Loudon counties), and the elementary schools are fantastic which was our biggest concern being they're little kids now.
Total property tax is just shy of 2k/year. No unions and having only one layer of consolidated government accomplishes wonderful things.
And you know what? The streets are far cleaner and safer than Westchesters. Go figure.
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