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Try reading the whole post carefully before arguing.
Or maybe you should reread what you wrote and look at the contextual misrepresentations you've made ....
I did, and it's why I responded categorically to your assertions.
"Many of these are in the northwest part of the state" ... No, only two mentioned, Cody and Powell are in the NW. All the others are in the central or eastern parts of the state. Sheridan and Buffalo are in the N Central area, east of the Big Horn Mtns and well to the East of the NW area. Casper is way to the East in the mid-Central area, and Gillette way to the NE area of WY. And Cheyenne is most definitely way in the SE corner of the state ... I just drove to Cody and back a week ago from Cheyenne and it's a rather long haul. Worland, Thermopolis, Lander ... are all quite some distance away from the NW portion of WY, in the big basin central are of Wyoming.
You did assert that Casper is "very windy", but described Cheyenne as "I think Cheyenne is also windy". Anybody with a working knowledge of the region ... or access to a wind energy density chart, which has been frequently posted on these pages ... would know that Cheyenne is not only windy on par with Casper, but frequently has stronger winds than Casper. Your language specifically diminished the relative wind characteristics of Cheyenne compared to Casper, which gave a false impression of the winds/gusts so prevalent in Cheyenne.
Similarly, to bring up weather issues in the Eastern Wyoming area ... but limit your description soley to tornados and not hailstorms is splitting hairs by not giving the whole picture of climate conditions in the area. The thread isn't about what's happening in Kansas (which doesn't even adjoin Wyoming), it's about Wyoming ... where there are a lot more tornadoes than NY. And recorded history is rife with tornadoes in the Eastern Wyoming area; the reason you don't hear about them as major tragic national disasters is because the area is so sparsely populated and not highly built up. Hence, tornadoes frequently come through without newsworthy loss of life or structures, and the hailstorms typically result in minor damage to vehicles and roofs, although farmers bear significant losses almost every year from this source. IIRC, a tornado hit Torrington in 2008 with significant damage. I'd add that I've spotted lots of small twisters as I fly around this area; I generally see a funnel of dirt a few hundred feet high moving around plowed fields. As a pilot, generally flying only about 1,500' AGL in this region, it's a matter of survival to look out for this type of condition to avoid a close encounter with them.
Read your own post and response: "I'll give you this one although if you look carefully I didn't say "wilderness" ... yes, you did. You stated "places to camp in wilderness the mountain ranges are in the northwestern part of the state mostly (although I'm told there are nice areas in the southeast part of the state)". The context here is to "camp in the wilderness" re "nice areas in the southeast part of the state"; but there are no wilderness areas in the southeast part of the state. There is camping between Cheyenne and Laramie (Veedauwoo), and the balance would be in the Medicine Bow's up by Centennial, Woods Landing, west of Laramie, or Encampment, south of Saratoga.
Or maybe you should reread what you wrote and look at the contextual misrepresentations you've made ....
I did, and it's why I responded categorically to your assertions.
"Many of these are in the northwest part of the state" ... No, only two mentioned, Cody and Powell are in the NW. All the others are in the central or eastern parts of the state. Sheridan and Buffalo are in the N Central area, east of the Big Horn Mtns and well to the East of the NW area. Casper is way to the East in the mid-Central area, and Gillette way to the NE area of WY. And Cheyenne is most definitely way in the SE corner of the state ... I just drove to Cody and back a week ago from Cheyenne and it's a rather long haul. Worland, Thermopolis, Lander ... are all quite some distance away from the NW portion of WY, in the big basin central are of Wyoming.
You did assert that Casper is "very windy", but described Cheyenne as "I think Cheyenne is also windy". Anybody with a working knowledge of the region ... or access to a wind energy density chart, which has been frequently posted on these pages ... would know that Cheyenne is not only windy on par with Casper, but frequently has stronger winds than Casper. Your language specifically diminished the relative wind characteristics of Cheyenne compared to Casper, which gave a false impression of the winds/gusts so prevalent in Cheyenne.
Similarly, to bring up weather issues in the Eastern Wyoming area ... but limit your description soley to tornados and not hailstorms is splitting hairs by not giving the whole picture of climate conditions in the area. The thread isn't about what's happening in Kansas (which doesn't even adjoin Wyoming), it's about Wyoming ... where there are a lot more tornadoes than NY. And recorded history is rife with tornadoes in the Eastern Wyoming area; the reason you don't hear about them as major tragic national disasters is because the area is so sparsely populated and not highly built up. Hence, tornadoes frequently come through without newsworthy loss of life or structures, and the hailstorms typically result in minor damage to vehicles and roofs, although farmers bear significant losses almost every year from this source. IIRC, a tornado hit Torrington in 2008 with significant damage. I'd add that I've spotted lots of small twisters as I fly around this area; I generally see a funnel of dirt a few hundred feet high moving around plowed fields. As a pilot, generally flying only about 1,500' AGL in this region, it's a matter of survival to look out for this type of condition to avoid a close encounter with them.
Read your own post and response: "I'll give you this one although if you look carefully I didn't say "wilderness" ... yes, you did. You stated "places to camp in wilderness the mountain ranges are in the northwestern part of the state mostly (although I'm told there are nice areas in the southeast part of the state)". The context here is to "camp in the wilderness" re "nice areas in the southeast part of the state"; but there are no wilderness areas in the southeast part of the state. There is camping between Cheyenne and Laramie (Veedauwoo), and the balance would be in the Medicine Bow's up by Centennial, Woods Landing, west of Laramie, or Encampment, south of Saratoga.
Have a nice day.
I'm not going to split hairs with you on this so this will be the last statement I make about this. I'm sure the OP is intelligent enough to look at a map and figure out what part of the state the towns are in. I'm also thinking maybe he isn't going to be hung up on what area of the state he is in as much as he will be concerned about whether he can make a living in a certain town.
So many come here expecting the hollywood image of the place to be the entire state, and it's simply not so ... despite being misrepresented by so many land brokers, who put gorgeous mountain vista with lakes/streams views into their Wyoming ads and what they've really got is a bunch of barren scrubland without much water from an old ranching property that was very low production/acre to sell.
Visual representation. These 2 photos are from the same county (Fremont), in the middle of the state but at sorta opposite ends:
Your Hollywood version:
And the reality of what you see without a couple hour hike after several hours drive (in an off-road capable vehicle... which includes some Subarus ~ good ground clearance, awd/4wd):
Ironically, I think the 2nd photo is at a higher elevation too (closer to the Divide), but it's sorta flat up there in spots.
I'm a newbie here, and a moderator on another very busy forum, so I know better than to start tangling with people in terms of opinions. However, I would like to make a couple of comments:
First, I was born and raised in WNY in dairy farm country, so I am familiar with exactly the issues being brought up by OP.
I have several concerns for OP to consider:
1. The poster who stated that an electrician and LPN would have no problem finding a job in Wyoming is making somewhat of a generalization that varies tremendously from community to community.
It depends on the local housing market whether or not a self-employed electrician will be able to find enough work in Wyoming. In the Sheridan, Buffalo & Gillette area for example, there are layoffs like crazy going on here right now and there is virtually NO construction going on. A self-employed electrician would soon find out how hard it is to scratch out a living when there are already a plethora of electricians right now working odd jobs to scrape out a living.
Next, an LPN license is not going to qualify anyone to teach nursing students, so a job in nursing education is out of the question unless you have a master's degree in Nursing. Furthermore, hospitals are not hiring LPNs as much as they used to, and don't need to in our area because we crank out a new set of RNs every year from our local community college (I used to teach there).
Next, with the size of family we are talking about here, housing will be a huge issue. Median home prices in our part of the state are around $300K. For a home large enough to house a large family, you will have a very hard time finding suitable housing for <$300K. Any home under $250K large enough to accommodate a family of that size would probably have structural or other kinds of problems.
And finally, if you are bringing a large family of kids to Wyoming, this is a hard place for kids to assimilate. Wyoming has a suicide rate (and teenagers are most at risk) that is nearly twice the national average. This is an extremely hard place for kids to come in from other places and adapt.
People who think "rural" is the same thing in NY as WY quickly find out there is a world of difference. 'Rural' back east means one little burg after another little burg. Rural here means little burg with NOTHING for at least 100 miles in every direction. Not even CLOSE in comparison. Unless you live in the Casper or Cheyenne area, you will literally be at least 100 miles to any medium sized town of >50K.
Having grown up and left WNY for the west the day after I graduated from college, I'm pretty darn familiar with the frustration the OP expressed about living in NYS. However, if the reason for moving is more philosophical (don't like the taxes and/or prices of cigarettes) than practical (you already have a job waiting for you), then I would use extreme caution and suggest that you take your time and make certain that your family would be able to survive out here first.
Bring your family out here. Take a trip around the state and start talking to the locals. If you speak with people who have lived here for more than ten years, they can tell you a WHOLE lot more about what you would be facing by moving here than any data or map can show you.
Best of luck in your search for an escape from NYS. I left back in the early 80's and never looked back. Still miss the sports and good Italian food though!
1. The poster who stated that an electrician and LPN would have no problem finding a job in Wyoming is making somewhat of a generalization that varies tremendously from community to community.
Everything's location specific. I have decades in the IT field, had run departments, have had 7 figure yearly budgets, etc.... there isn't an IT job within 60 miles of me.
But, an Electrician and an LPN are 2 marketable trades that are present in every community. And you don't need a masters in Nursing to get an educator position, you just need to be Working on one and obtain it within 5 years. My mother has helped roughly 6 programs through the accreditation process (all Nursing specific, starting with CWC who was the FIRST 2-year to manage that accomplishment.) I've learned about this over the dining room table for 20+ years now. Her most recent comment (last week) was that WY colleges have to "grow their own" because you just can't recruit... makes it an even more open market for getting into the EDU field... do it once locally, then there are Dozens of opportunities online.
But I'm amiable with agreeing to disagree. Just don't want the OP to be mis-informed. No employment opportunity is just going to magically fall in anyone's lap these days, nothing is a "sure thing". But knowing that there are options is all that's really needed for the motivated to find a job. My wife managed to get into a local position that only has 3 employees simply by being persistent. That's more than anyone else had done in the prior decade, it did take nearly a year and is only part-time but it's a fantastic work environment and worth the little sacrifices.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RattleSnakeHeaven
Next, with the size of family we are talking about here, housing will be a huge issue.
I think you mis-read:
Quote:
We have seven kids and the youngest is going to be sixteen soon...
By the time of their planned move, it will be just 2 people. A normal home size ought to suffice, might be cramped at the holidays but no sense in over-spending just to have empty rooms for 350 days of the year.
Thanks, Brian. I was skimming the OP and multi-tasking when I posted. I hadn't considered the online teaching opportunities, which I have taught in the past, and they do present some opportunities. The pay is lousy though.
As far as teaching in nursing, yea, the opportunities are there but they are extremely limited, and if you have an LPN license without a college degree, you aren't going to be able to teach in an RN program, period. Most LPNs do not have a bachelor's degree in nursing or they would already be an RN. They are also moving away from hiring BSN for educator positions as much as possible. Those jobs that are available at that level are extremely competitive and most often if someone with a bachelor's degree gets one, it's because they already know someone who helped them get a foot in the door.
Electricians are starving right now in our part of the state because there is absolutely NOTHING going on in terms of construction, and as you know Wyoming's economy is feast and famine, boom and bust. So I guess I respectfully differ from your opinion a bit in that I've seen way too many people move here over the last 20 years thinking they know what they are getting into but find themselves unhappy because the lifestyle is different than what they expected.
This part of your post I struggled with a bit:
But knowing that there are options is all that's really needed for the motivated to find a job.
I respectfully disagree with this statement. You can be highly motivated with all the credentials in the world, but if you move into a small town in Wyoming (or anywhere in isolated areas) looking for work as a self-employed person in a competitive field, look out. In an area with a very small population to serve, one more person in a crowded field is going to take money out of the pockets of those already working in the same field. It can be very cut throat.
I'm right in the middle of Manhattan....
New York City is the only place in the USA where you need a license for a rifle or shotgun.
But get this.... you can be turned down if your credit rating is not up to par.....as well as a host of other reasons not related to gun ownership.
You still need to apply even if you already have a pistol permit....
Pistol permits and rifle permits are handled by different agencies.
You might get one but get turned down by another.....
I was turned down for the rifle permit with no reason given.
I have never been convicted of any crime....go figure!
Thinking of Sheridan.... less windy as I understand it.
Two hospitals, one a VA hospital. (I'm 75 and a veteran)
I understand the fishing and hunting are very good.
The tax situation is very appealing.
No personal income tax and no business taxes.
I plan on starting a Melaleuca at home business so that is important to me.
In New York city, you get hit with State and City taxes.
A sales tax of almost 9% and other assorted hidden taxes such as high gas taxes.
I recently rented a car and drove to Philadelphia for business.
I was hit with a higher car rental fee just because it's New York City but get this.
They have a hidden 10% car rental tax together with that almost 9% sales tax hitting me for almost 20% ..... let's talk about tolls. To go to Philly and back was about $37 just in tolls.
As I understand it there are no toll roads or bridges in WY correct?
Need to park a car in NYC...? Wild prices and again super taxes.
I expect that I will go through a culture shock but I believe either you live in the middle of a great city or you should live in the country. I hate the suburbs.
You are correct. There are no toll roads or bridges in Wyoming. The state legislature considered making I-80 a toll road for awhile, but instead just last week voted to increase the fuel tax by 10 cents per gallon. The roads need repairs and the feds are providing less and less funding for them. This isn't just a Wyoming problem of course, but with the low population it makes it difficult to fund some things like Interstate Highways. The additional gas tax, as much as I dislike it, should go a long ways toward maintaining the roads, and theoretically it'll come from those using the roads, be they Wyoming residents or others passing through. (Long-haul truckers, who do the most damage to the interstates, could opt to buy their fuel in the surrounding states, but the increased fuel tax mostly brings Wyoming more inline with them anyway.)
Visual representation. These 2 photos are from the same county (Fremont), in the middle of the state but at sorta opposite ends:
Your Hollywood version:
And the reality of what you see without a couple hour hike after several hours drive (in an off-road capable vehicle... which includes some Subarus ~ good ground clearance, awd/4wd):
I personally like both, and from Laramie they're both close, at least by my standards.
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I'm also in New York and moving to WY
