JBGUSA on Covid-19?
4-25-2020
I am not a Michigander. I will try to explain though I am a liberal Democrat and not one "protesting with [my] MAGA hats and Trump float." My state is New York but my "beef" is similar.
The various "shelter in place", "safer at home" and "pause" orders did not drop out of the sky as virtually identical documents, with minor deviations. The thought process was to exercise control, i.e. that governors were doing things and entering orders because they can. Trump's declarations of disaster on March 13, 2020 gave them that ability. Sheltering in place and socially isolating were originally justified based on the necessity to "flatten the curve" and prevent hospitals from being overwhelmed. That objective was met relatively rapidly, for reasons I will explore below. As soon as the peaking in hospitalizations and diagnoses was in sight (deaths obviously lag behind) rather than rescinding or easing these orders, the goalposts were moved, to an unattainable snuffing out of the virus. That is the basis of the resentment; that people felt that they were lied to as the orders were being put in place.
Why was the "flattening" of the curve and peaking foreseeable; it is well known that viruses spread rapidly through any given population, indeed the exposure is virtually universal. This is being borne out by recent testing, even though those tests are tilted towards not showing antibodies. Few of those exposed are sickened to the degree of hospitalization or even diagnosis. Thus, the lowering of the death rate from a ruinous 4% to a rate below 0.5%.
People may not agree on or even know the details; they know that the carnage is not occurring on their street corners, but primarily on cruise ships, military ships and nursing homes. It is still grievously serious but one handles these hot spots by concentrating on them. One does beef up the ability of the health care system to deal with those who get sick. And not shutting everyone down.
4-23-2020
This morning the CDC posted Confirmation of COVID-19 in Two Pet Cats in New York. Also, 8 big cats confirmed tested positive for coronavirus at NY zoo. Fortunately, apparently, Coronavirus can infect cats — dogs, not so much. Besides the obvious humor element, this poses a serious question. People own cats and live at with them at close quarters. People can be made to socially distance. Ever hear the expression; herding cats? You can't do it. Question is, are we just destroying employment and wasting time by socially distancing? I have always had the instinct that this is theater, not something effective or worthwhile.
And that it's a bloody waste of time.
==============================
Many of these changes created by the Covid-19 pandemic are erasing our identity as human beings. We cannot send our children to school. We cannot send our preschool children to socializing nursery school. We cannot enjoy the benefits of the arts, including music and museums. The question is, what that distinguishes us from primates from which we emerged?
This is not far-fetched. When our state governors have thoughtlessly closed down businesses with no plan of reopening, they erase much of what distinguishes human being from the animals. From the point of view of appearance, how long can we all go without haircut? We are all going to be very messy look in short order, except of course those that surreptitiously have a “home visit” from a barber or hair stylist.
Much of what has made human society distinct from the animal kingdom comes from the socializing and collective experience of enjoying music and visual art. We don’t know why painting started, but it started on the walls of caves. Doubtless cave people got together to admire those we have created great works of art, by Michelangelo, Picasso and others. Now we’re stuck with viewing it on a computer
Live performance music is another collectively civilizing experience. From festivals such as Woodstock to the folk coffeehouses, in other venues, music is designed to be enjoyed in groups. The presence of applause or lack of applause shape what musicians do.
Religion is another such shaper of socialization. I cannot imagine the cheerlessness of a world without weddings, Bar or Bat Mitzvahs, confirmations, Christmas Mass, the Hajj in Mecca, and other such events. In s hort, humans are a gregarious species. We need people.
All of this is potentially lost in the mad dash towards “social distancing.” What is most alarming is it the same people who have fought hardest for social distancing fight hard against cures or ameliorative treatment They insist on lengthy testing interval that will make the proposed treatment irrelevant .
All such people are not created equal when it comes to distancing. Does one seriously think that Bill and Melinda Gates are doing their own house cleaning in there probably large house in Kirkland, Washington? Or are they using paid labor? Would Governor Gretchen Witham (sp) of Michigan approve?
Similarly, they can afford to have you musicians and comedians come to entertain them. There is a tradition for this; the royal house of Esterhazy in Vienna had Haydn as an in house composer for much of his life, and accompanying musicians. Do we want people only with the wealth of the House of Esterhazy to be able to afford to be entertained?
I am certainly not advocating a chaotic reopening however, we must have a time frame within which religious institutions, schools come a preschool, concert halls and alike will reopen. I watched the press conference yesterday with six Northeastern governors. All I heard was a vague plan to make a vague plan. Society and the world must open for the non-wealth.
============================
Thatnks for the
.
My views on Covid-19 are extremely serious. I think that in many areas, and all areas with a high population density, most of the population has been exposed. They fall into three categories: a) Exposed, never had symptoms and immune; b) Exposed, minor to moderate symptoms, then immune; ad c) Become seriously ill or die (but immune if they survive illness). I think most if not al of this "distancing," including use of masks, is theater designed to make people feel safe.
Analogous is a DM Rachel976 sent at the start of all this. She expressed concern as to whether I'll been in New Rochelle. If you remember that was the initial local hot spot before it hit NYC. I told her, truthfully, that I had spent lots of time there but wasn't even slightly worried. Similarly my wife did some work as an administrative assistant in a home where one of the children had attended Westchester Torah Academy, one of the first shut down for the virus.
My views are extremely serious and I hope not considered by the moderators as TOS violations.
================================================== ==============================
I don't think that CD is necessarily gospel but there is enough here that there is medical amelioration from the drugs. Why are we all like sheople? Why is everyone not all over their elected representatives? We were not born to live in cocoons. We were born to work, socialize, entertain and be entertained.
This "shelter in place" has to end, and soon. As in the show and movie "Network" the motto needs to be "I'm mad as hill and I'm not going to take it anymore."
https://www.city-data.com/forum/poli...l#post57743729
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodnight
Whitmer eased some of the restrictions but they are still out there protesting with their MAGA hats and Trump float. I don't think they even know what they want at this point, Michigan is #7 in infections, #3 in deaths and they aren't going anywhere fast.
The various "shelter in place", "safer at home" and "pause" orders did not drop out of the sky as virtually identical documents, with minor deviations. The thought process was to exercise control, i.e. that governors were doing things and entering orders because they can. Trump's declarations of disaster on March 13, 2020 gave them that ability. Sheltering in place and socially isolating were originally justified based on the necessity to "flatten the curve" and prevent hospitals from being overwhelmed. That objective was met relatively rapidly, for reasons I will explore below. As soon as the peaking in hospitalizations and diagnoses was in sight (deaths obviously lag behind) rather than rescinding or easing these orders, the goalposts were moved, to an unattainable snuffing out of the virus. That is the basis of the resentment; that people felt that they were lied to as the orders were being put in place.
Why was the "flattening" of the curve and peaking foreseeable; it is well known that viruses spread rapidly through any given population, indeed the exposure is virtually universal. This is being borne out by recent testing, even though those tests are tilted towards not showing antibodies. Few of those exposed are sickened to the degree of hospitalization or even diagnosis. Thus, the lowering of the death rate from a ruinous 4% to a rate below 0.5%.
People may not agree on or even know the details; they know that the carnage is not occurring on their street corners, but primarily on cruise ships, military ships and nursing homes. It is still grievously serious but one handles these hot spots by concentrating on them. One does beef up the ability of the health care system to deal with those who get sick. And not shutting everyone down.
4-23-2020
This morning the CDC posted Confirmation of COVID-19 in Two Pet Cats in New York. Also, 8 big cats confirmed tested positive for coronavirus at NY zoo. Fortunately, apparently, Coronavirus can infect cats — dogs, not so much. Besides the obvious humor element, this poses a serious question. People own cats and live at with them at close quarters. People can be made to socially distance. Ever hear the expression; herding cats? You can't do it. Question is, are we just destroying employment and wasting time by socially distancing? I have always had the instinct that this is theater, not something effective or worthwhile.
And that it's a bloody waste of time.
==============================
Many of these changes created by the Covid-19 pandemic are erasing our identity as human beings. We cannot send our children to school. We cannot send our preschool children to socializing nursery school. We cannot enjoy the benefits of the arts, including music and museums. The question is, what that distinguishes us from primates from which we emerged?
This is not far-fetched. When our state governors have thoughtlessly closed down businesses with no plan of reopening, they erase much of what distinguishes human being from the animals. From the point of view of appearance, how long can we all go without haircut? We are all going to be very messy look in short order, except of course those that surreptitiously have a “home visit” from a barber or hair stylist.
Much of what has made human society distinct from the animal kingdom comes from the socializing and collective experience of enjoying music and visual art. We don’t know why painting started, but it started on the walls of caves. Doubtless cave people got together to admire those we have created great works of art, by Michelangelo, Picasso and others. Now we’re stuck with viewing it on a computer
Live performance music is another collectively civilizing experience. From festivals such as Woodstock to the folk coffeehouses, in other venues, music is designed to be enjoyed in groups. The presence of applause or lack of applause shape what musicians do.
Religion is another such shaper of socialization. I cannot imagine the cheerlessness of a world without weddings, Bar or Bat Mitzvahs, confirmations, Christmas Mass, the Hajj in Mecca, and other such events. In s hort, humans are a gregarious species. We need people.
All of this is potentially lost in the mad dash towards “social distancing.” What is most alarming is it the same people who have fought hardest for social distancing fight hard against cures or ameliorative treatment They insist on lengthy testing interval that will make the proposed treatment irrelevant .
All such people are not created equal when it comes to distancing. Does one seriously think that Bill and Melinda Gates are doing their own house cleaning in there probably large house in Kirkland, Washington? Or are they using paid labor? Would Governor Gretchen Witham (sp) of Michigan approve?
Similarly, they can afford to have you musicians and comedians come to entertain them. There is a tradition for this; the royal house of Esterhazy in Vienna had Haydn as an in house composer for much of his life, and accompanying musicians. Do we want people only with the wealth of the House of Esterhazy to be able to afford to be entertained?
I am certainly not advocating a chaotic reopening however, we must have a time frame within which religious institutions, schools come a preschool, concert halls and alike will reopen. I watched the press conference yesterday with six Northeastern governors. All I heard was a vague plan to make a vague plan. Society and the world must open for the non-wealth.
============================
Thatnks for the
. My views on Covid-19 are extremely serious. I think that in many areas, and all areas with a high population density, most of the population has been exposed. They fall into three categories: a) Exposed, never had symptoms and immune; b) Exposed, minor to moderate symptoms, then immune; ad c) Become seriously ill or die (but immune if they survive illness). I think most if not al of this "distancing," including use of masks, is theater designed to make people feel safe.
Analogous is a DM Rachel976 sent at the start of all this. She expressed concern as to whether I'll been in New Rochelle. If you remember that was the initial local hot spot before it hit NYC. I told her, truthfully, that I had spent lots of time there but wasn't even slightly worried. Similarly my wife did some work as an administrative assistant in a home where one of the children had attended Westchester Torah Academy, one of the first shut down for the virus.
My views are extremely serious and I hope not considered by the moderators as TOS violations.
================================================== ==============================
Quote:
Originally Posted by beach43ofus
I agree 100%, but its not actually a cure, only a vaccine can be a cure. Its a treatment, or a therapeudic to treat the symptoms.
The Dems are scared to death that the Trump Drugs will be highly effective, and his pal Benjamin Netahyahu over in Israel will be pumping out Milions of doses to save American lives. This is their worst mightmare
If this comes about, the election is even more in the bag than it was before, and they'll have Trump on steroids for 4 more years.
The Dems are scared to death that the Trump Drugs will be highly effective, and his pal Benjamin Netahyahu over in Israel will be pumping out Milions of doses to save American lives. This is their worst mightmare
If this comes about, the election is even more in the bag than it was before, and they'll have Trump on steroids for 4 more years.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Indentured Servant
You damn right I would!!! I have been rooting for the drug all the time. I will give credit to the first doctor or researcher who discovered that it was effective to COVID patients. Apparently that person deserves no credit. Trump should get the credit for being told by someone, who was told by someone who had read the research of someones, who had heard of some doctor using it.
This "shelter in place" has to end, and soon. As in the show and movie "Network" the motto needs to be "I'm mad as hill and I'm not going to take it anymore."
https://www.city-data.com/forum/poli...l#post57743729
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