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Old 04-29-2021, 05:09 AM
 
4,698 posts, read 4,071,354 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greysholic View Post
Because of the massive investment and subsidies from the EU, aka Western Europe. EE countries that have not joined the EU are just as hopeless and poor as ever (e.g. Russia, Ukraine, Belarus, Moldova, Serbia etc.). Everyone knows that.
That is because EU reject countries that are too dysfunctional or too closed off.

Economic growth is mainly driven by internal factors, investments from abroad are never the main factor.
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Old 04-29-2021, 05:15 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 415_s2k View Post
Ah, okay, so this is actually a great thing for China... A leaner, meaner, more efficient, stronger nation.
It might drop too fast, which is not good.

But a slow reduction over time is positive for China and the environment, because the country is overpopulated.
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Old 04-29-2021, 05:30 AM
 
Location: Metro Phoenix
11,039 posts, read 16,854,315 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Camlon View Post
It might drop too fast, which is not good.

But a slow reduction over time is positive for China and the environment, because the country is overpopulated.
the issue is that it is dropping too fast. That's what the concern from the central government, banks, etc is from.

The ultimate result is that it is going to end up with more old than young people, which will create issues as the aged contribute less to the economy but still require resources. As the working-aged group age up into the elderly, there aren't enough people to replace them in the economy, and the aged require assistance in the form of medical care and services which take them out of other critical roles. As of right now, and as we saw over the course of the trade war and pandemic, manufacturing is still the backbone of China's economy. It's rushing to switch more focus to services and tech and well as trying to integrate AI and other high tech into daily life, but this is not an easy jump to make.

One way or the other, this is a massive headwind for China and its goals for the future. This decade really is the window with which it will set the stage for its role in much of the rest of the 21st century.
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Old 04-29-2021, 05:33 AM
 
Location: Metro Phoenix
11,039 posts, read 16,854,315 times
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And let's also not forget that this problem is confounded by a major inequity in the woman to man ratio, which further extrapolates the problem and moves the potential time for the population to stabilize further out, to say nothing of the potential social issues it will cause.
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Old 04-29-2021, 08:41 AM
 
4,698 posts, read 4,071,354 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 415_s2k View Post
the issue is that it is dropping too fast. That's what the concern from the central government, banks, etc is from.

The ultimate result is that it is going to end up with more old than young people, which will create issues as the aged contribute less to the economy but still require resources. As the working-aged group age up into the elderly, there aren't enough people to replace them in the economy, and the aged require assistance in the form of medical care and services which take them out of other critical roles. As of right now, and as we saw over the course of the trade war and pandemic, manufacturing is still the backbone of China's economy. It's rushing to switch more focus to services and tech and well as trying to integrate AI and other high tech into daily life, but this is not an easy jump to make.

One way or the other, this is a massive headwind for China and its goals for the future. This decade really is the window with which it will set the stage for its role in much of the rest of the 21st century.
I am not saying it is not a problem at all. I am just arguing against Greyscholic who seem to think China is heading for a demographic collapse while his own country is fine because it is developed. The reality is the opposite, Taiwan is in a much worse position to handle population decline, because it cannot compensate by increasing productivity.

In terms of workforce, China has 112 million manufacturing jobs and a lot of them are quite inefficient so it could be reduced substantially. Hence, there is enough labour, it just might get more expensive which will force labour intensive manufacturing to leave for cheaper countries.

I think a fertility rate around 1.5 would be optimal for China as it would slowly reduce the population. China fertility rate is lower than that, but not by a lot. I am more worried about South Korea, which has a higher optimal fertility rate, but has an actual fertility rate of 0.8. Taiwan is only a little bit better. It is pretty clear to me which countries have worse demographic problems, but some users really want China to collapse and therefore excaggerate every problem in China while ignoring problems in their own country.
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Old 04-29-2021, 08:54 AM
 
Location: San Diego CA
8,480 posts, read 6,882,429 times
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This is just a trend globally in developed nations where incomes rise and married couples don’t need lots of kids to support them in old age. Couples can focus on careers. Look at Japan which has had a sharply declining birth rate for years. Third world countries unchecked birth rates and over population.
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Old 04-29-2021, 09:18 AM
 
4,698 posts, read 4,071,354 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greysholic View Post
Zzzzz more nonsense quibbles. Only a puppet foreigner like you would attempt to argue that having a low birth rate is good for China.
Lol, puppet foreigner is not a word. Do you even know what puppet means?

It is not just good for China, it is good for every developing country. It is not a coincidence that the countries with the highest growth rates has low fertility rates. If you knew basic economics, you would know this.

Sure, there are dysfunctional countries with low fertility rate, but all developing countries with high fertility rate are dysfunctional.


Quote:
And China's labour participation rate is very high. There's no room for drastic increase.


First off, chinese retirement age is among the worlds lowest, so there is definitely room for increase. Secondly, the government is inflating the work participitation rate with almost useless jobs.

So no, China has plenty of potential productivity growth. Instead of being so worried about the demographics of China, maybe worry a little bit about your own country. Taiwan has a fertility rate of 1.07, which means population will drop by around 50% every 35 years.
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Old 04-29-2021, 12:25 PM
 
671 posts, read 315,216 times
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i don't think they need "census", it's almost impossible to live without a valid id in china

unlike the US, people without a valid presence gets no social benefits. census is not needed in china as the government of all levels knows the number of people in the country at any time.
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Old 04-29-2021, 02:37 PM
 
8,411 posts, read 7,406,022 times
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The official number of reported deaths in China from COVID is 4,636.

Perhaps the unofficial number of deaths was much higher, showed up as a significant effect in the latest census, and now the officials in China are seeking a way to either hide or rationalize away the numeric variation.
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Old 04-29-2021, 03:40 PM
 
12,022 posts, read 11,565,479 times
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They did a hard lockdown so the impact is also seen in totals for nearby locations, such as S. Korea, Japan, Taiwan, Hong Kong, Vietnam, Thailand, etc. Their main fear is the spread of the virus in India.

EU places a condition on privatization on prospective admission which is often opposed by those countries as it leaves them poorer.

Chinese officials may have been the source of the leak to build up expectations about the census. Lockdowns were found to also decrease the number of non-Covid deaths, such as violent crime and traffic accidents.
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