Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Cobblers old son. I didn't watch the vid, but I am pretty confident that choice is real enough but Freewill (free choice} is an illusion, not because it isn't there, but because we don't understand what it really is - most of us.
But the freewiill you talk about is another argument entirely and a bullcrap one. It is a few stepping stones - or faith -leaping stones, more like - from God did everything but is responsible for nothing, by way of this 'Freewill confusion' to 'we are going have to be judged and pay for our choices'. And let me ask you old mate (not that I expect a straight answer) about these "Choices" of which you speak.
Is it about how we acted in our lives or about whether we believed in God?
And which God -choice do we make? BibleGod or QuranGod or one of the others...just so it's some kind of god?
And if so, is the choice is not apparently which god and religion, but whether one used the brains they were given to evaluate the evidence (wrong choice), or flushed their wits down the toilet and just swallowed some Faith -claim or other?
Like I say, Cobblers; brightly polished cobblers, old banana.
Last edited by TRANSPONDER; 01-16-2018 at 09:50 PM..
I know the world testifies for its creator as verifiable evidence but that doesn't mean we can generalize that everyone doesn't want to know the truth. Most don't, so true, but some do. There are some who do become Christians
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclist1968
It isn't my truth. It is called substantiated evidence which I see each day in the world around me. I see nothing you don't.
The above is all your truth and not mine at all. I don't know what the world testifies for it's creator. I don't generalize about others either.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclist1968
You choose to pretend otherwise
I don't need to pretend anything. I deal with reality without wearing rose colored glasses.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclist1968
Sorry but we are both members here allowed to post
So let's not tell each other not to post, please
I did not tell you not to post. I simply stated that you should keep your non-objective truths to yourself vs. trying to pin them on others through generalizations and thinking you know what the world testifies for it's creator.
I ask this because I just can't make that choice. I was basically a skeptic from the time I was very young. If it's not tangible, I won't believe in it. Yet, if you talk to devout Christians, they try to convert people like it is a choice. Granted, these are also people who think you can choose to stop being gay, so whatever...
Even though it would be easier to get though loss of loved ones and "furbabies" if I believed the common dogma, I simply cannot "choose" to believe something that makes no sense at all, and has nothing to back it up.
Logic has rules and brings you to truth, as long as you start from correct suppositions and don't make errors of logic along the way. You'll never get to "Grandma is waiting for me on the other side of the veil" using logic. And considering how poorly thought out the vast majority of religions are, I'd much rather choose a well thought-out sci-fi / fantasy paradigm if I was going to abandon reason and logic and adopt a philosophy of "wouldn't it be nice if...."
How did you miss this from the poster Mordant was responding to?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclist1968
Sorry but your argument is of a developmentally disabled person.
You would literally need to be "retarded" not to see what is around you
Quote:
Originally Posted by ApeFace
You two are talking over one another. Someone who doesn't see the sun isn't mentally defective per your words. Defective wasn't used by anyone until you introduced it. Someone who cannot graps how the sun sustains life is mentally disabled. Those of average cognitive ability are able to grasp that concept.
"You would need to be almost retarded to not see what is around you?" I didn't miss it.
Someone would be cognitively declining if unable to see and process whats in view. Whether it is the sun, sky, etc...You agree with this right?
No since I don't use such sick dark descriptives for people who have trouble processing the world around them due to being retarded or having failing mental faculties.
Only a dark sick mind uses such harsh words against others who don't see through the same lens.
Yep the Hitler who oppressed all other races for who he deemed to be cognitively inferior/retarded.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ApeFace
I didn't see that but alright.
Well according to you most can process what they see...this is a fine example that most don't process what they see in the same manner as the person next to them processes it. I clearly saw it, but you didn't.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ApeFace
Another person used the term defective but no matter what, the point was made. Most can process what they see
No the point was not that most can process what they see...the point that was trying to be made is that a person who does not process intelligent design when they look around them is developmentally disabled or retarded.
wow. hitler the killer? hmmm... I didn't see that but alright. Another person used the term defective but no matter what, the point was made. Most can process what they see
According to your post above...the point was made that most can process what they see.
When Cyclist1968 posted the following dark sick judgmental words that reek of a Hitler regime mentality.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclist1968
Sorry but your argument is of a developmentally disabled person.
You would literally need to be "retarded" not to see what is around you
You cannot escape the evidence and proof, again, unless you have a severe developmental delay.
You responded that you did not see the Hitler like mentality in Cyclist1968's words. I saw it, but you did not...therefore most don't process what they see. You did not process Cyclist1968's words to be of the same mindset as what Hitler used to justify genocide.
I instantly processed it as such...this should tell you that most don't process what you think they should be seeing. I clearly saw it, but you didn't.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ApeFace
Well it didn't all happen by accident but I didn't read into it what you did.
Please clarify what you are talking about when you say "it" didn't "all" happen by accident. Define "it" and "all".
Quote:
Originally Posted by ApeFace
That's a major stretch. Hilter is a mass killer.
It's not a far stretch in the least. He killed those who he deemed to have severe developmental delay or those who were developmentally disabled or "retarded".
Then if it's all around you'll have no problem producing it will you.
Quote:
I have no need to prove what is already proven and there.
No, it isn't proven. It is simply what you see because that is what you want to see. So, well take it that you don't produce it because it isn't there.
Quote:
Unless you are blind, of course. Then you cannot see intelligent design of how nature operates
What do you say about the obvious 'unintelligent' design that can be found in nature?
You two are talking over one another. Someone who doesn't see the sun isn't mentally defective per your words. Defective wasn't used by anyone until you introduced it. Someone who cannot graps how the sun sustains life is mentally disabled. Those of average cognitive ability are able to grasp that concept.
That the sun sustains life is a scientific fact, not a proof of the existence of some generic god much less the poster's particular god. Where we actually ARE talking past each other is that he sees self-evident "proof" where a simple scientifically explicable fact of life exists. And regrettably we'll continue to talk past each other until he quits conflating the two and committing various logical fallacies, particularly, ad hominem fallacies at the expense of the mentally challenged.
Again, he killed those he deemed USELESS for various reasons. Not just your retarded people or those with a developmental delay. I only gave you 3 examples I recall, there are others Hitler killed in which he wasn't finding any use within their genetic code to avoid torturing and murdering them. Hitler has no place in this conversation, sorry. Sometimes discussions just get a bit too dramatic that there is no common sense anymore. My opinion if you wish to pay me a penny for it or dock me a cent
LOL I agree with the no common sense part.
There was no drama...I was simply seeing a comparison with him. Cyclist views others as having severe developmental delay or are developmentally disabled or "retarded" simply because they don't "see" things his way. Hitler held the EXACT same views. You don't "see" the analogy? *shrug*
Don't you find it interesting that a person who identifies themselves as being religious and is on this forum posting about their religious beliefs makes dark statements as Cyclist does? Just goes to show you why religious fundamentalists are viewed in the manner we view them.
Can you please clarify what you are talking about when you say "it" didn't "all" happen by accident. Define "it" and "all".
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
or dock me a cent
