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Front wheel drive is a good set up for getting a car out of a snowy parking spot, or up a little hill at the bottom of the street. But, it is a really crappy set up for safety and for difficult driving. Understand that front wheel drive is one front wheel. And, the only reason it is better starting off than rear wheel drive is that there is a 600 pound engine sitting over the axle instead of a 200 pound rear seat. One could have exactly the same effectiveness of front wheel drive by putting 400 pounds of stuff in the trunk, like sand bags. And then not have the adverse handling of front wheel drive. AWD actually helps in all situations, handling, and acceleration and start off. I don't like AWD, but it is a lot better than FWD.
i 2nd that..anyone who claims awd is a waste of money or gas hasnt driven a good awd system in bad weather especially a good awd system with winter tires.
there is no contest in stability and control compared to fwd in snow or rain..
One could have exactly the same effectiveness of front wheel drive by putting 400 pounds of stuff in the trunk, like sand bags. And then not have the adverse handling of front wheel drive.
FWD does have one big advantage over RWD in the snow - it will understeer instead of oversteer if you apply too much power. Not that it's much of an issue anymore with traction and stability control.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107;
there is no contest in stability and control compared to fwd in snow or rain..
Snow yes. Rain not really. I'd personally take FWD + snow tires to AWD with all-season tires. And let's be honest, how many people who say they need AWD are driving around with all-season tires that perform marginal at best in the snow?
good points; i'd say that from my experience all the years in WI snow, when we had awd suv's (yes we left the all season m+s tires on) once they'd slip that first instance and transfer the power across both diffs, then that traction aws far better then our fwd had with snow tires. Helped taking off from starts on corners/intersections as well--as you could steer in the direction you wanted to go.
Yes I grew up with beasts for cars (polaras, ltd's,impalas) with recap snow tires and sand bags on the back, and made it where i needed to. But i had far more confidence with the drivetrains available now then before. If it's out there why not use it
FWD does have one big advantage over RWD in the snow - it will understeer instead of oversteer if you apply too much power. Not that it's much of an issue anymore with traction and stability control.
Snow yes. Rain not really. I'd personally take FWD + snow tires to AWD with all-season tires. And let's be honest, how many people who say they need AWD are driving around with all-season tires that perform marginal at best in the snow?
i loved the handling of my bmw 328xi in the rain. not a hint of sway or motion when hitting puddles on the highway. the bmw x3 was the same. cant say that about my jeep sahara or altima though. those puddles are felt.
Snow yes. Rain not really. I'd personally take FWD + snow tires to AWD with all-season tires.
But an AWD with snow tires is far better than a FWD with snow tires.
My wife needs her AWD (or my 4X4) because she is an Emergency Room Nurse and when she is needed it doesn't matter what the weather is doing. She has a 24 mile commute one way to the rural hospital she works at, we have dedicated snow tires all the way around on both vehicles. Most who claim they "need" the AWD do run the crappy all-season tires. All-season my butt, they are 3 season tires at best.
Taking into consideration similar types of tires, and assuming that both vehicles are of similar design, weight, etc.: for driving on icy roads a FWD vehicle does a lot better that a RWD vehicle. The added traction improvement is one of the primary reasons why FWD automobiles were introduced to the market. The next steps would be AWD, 4WD, and such.
That said, I drive both FWD (Honda Civic with over 257,000 miles) and a Suzuki Sidekick 4x4 on RWD most of the time, and on 4X4 when the roads are very slippery.
But an AWD with snow tires is far better than a FWD with snow tires.
My wife needs her AWD (or my 4X4) because she is an Emergency Room Nurse and when she is needed it doesn't matter what the weather is doing. She has a 24 mile commute one way to the rural hospital she works at, we have dedicated snow tires all the way around on both vehicles. Most who claim they "need" the AWD do run the crappy all-season tires. All-season my butt, they are 3 season tires at best.
as good as the awd was on the bmw when i put a set of blizzaks on it there was a world of difference,.
the winter tires make a big difference on any car but it becomes especially nice on 4x4 or awd systems.
Taking into consideration similar types of tires, and assuming that both vehicles are of similar design, weight, etc.: for driving on icy roads a FWD vehicle does a lot better that a RWD vehicle. The added traction improvement is one of the primary reasons why FWD automobiles were introduced to the market. The next steps would be AWD, 4WD, and such.
That said, I drive both FWD (Honda Civic with over 257,000 miles) and a Suzuki Sidekick 4x4 on RWD most of the time, and on 4X4 when the roads are very slippery.
Front wheel drive vehicles were introduced into the US market in spite of their faulty handling characteristics for two reasons: (i) cost and (ii) more flat rear floor for seating room.
The experiment with the Toronado had failed miserably and ended badly and there was considerable controversy at the time (and still is in my book) about whether to turn these poorly designed cheapo front wheel drive cars loose on a population not well known for their driving skill.
Front wheel drive ignores really bad physics (drive wheel = steering wheel) and uses brute force (600 pound engine sitting on the axle) to gain a small straight ahead traction advantage. You FWD fans can huff and puff all you want, but there is nothing else there to support FWD as a better system.
FWD does have one big advantage over RWD in the snow - it will understeer instead of oversteer if you apply too much power. Not that it's much of an issue anymore with traction and stability control.
this is true, but FWD if it starts to understeer can snap VERY quickly into oversteer if the driver doesn't know what to do.
Instinct is to just keep turning the wheel, if you do this and suddenly find grip, the back can easily snap around
FWD is all well and good, but it most certainly has it's limitations. Why do you think luxury, sports, performance saloons, and supercars are all RWD ? (or 4WD)
It' s to do with power transferrance. The wheels which steer can't always handle transmitting power too.
In terms of performance cars, there is a school of thought which says you cannot have more than 300 bhp through fwd, because it's unable to cope. This has been exceeded, but only with advances in traction control and stability control. Otherwise understeer and torque steer are massive.
I realise we aren't talking about performance issues here, but what we are talking about is the power vs traction equation. In snow and ice, it doesn't matter if you have 50 bhp or 500, it's no use if you can't get grip.
So far as all the haters of 4WD, given the choice, would you rather have safety, or fuel economy?
Exactly why is it that you think that nearly all modern rally cars are 4WD, when according to you, FWD is better ? Do you think you know something they don't ?
Remember, all the old cars in days of yore which handled better in the snow weighed about 15 tons ! There's an advantage atraighaway!
They also had skinnier tyres. The fashion now is for tall wheels with fat low profile rubber. While these look good, and are fine on dry roads, they are useless in icy conditions, and are much more likely to aquaplane in the wet. They tend to "float" on top of the snow/ice/water, rather than cutting through like a skinny trye.
Again, look at the World Rally cars, watch some videos of them on snow tyres, they are super skinny, and with tall sidewalls.
Pretty much any car with snow tyres all round will outperform any other car on all seasons. A 4WD on all seasons may outperform a FWD or RWD on snow tryres, but it won't happen the other way around unless it's a very gifted, or very lucky driver !
No matter what car you buy, always make sure you are on the correct rubber.
Simple answer to the OP's question is to buy an SUV which has switchable 4WD..
Granted, you willl switch between 4WD and RWD, but it gives you so many more options.
You can have either economy, or grip, depending what you require.
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