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Here is what happened to me:
Yellow light, I know it's a photo because A: GPS tells me and B: I can see the white box.
I slow down, make the stop. Girl behind me slows down, makes the stop. Guy behind her completely doesn't see the light turning red, slams into teenage girl which slams into me.
My truck didn't take much damage (thank you massive customized steel bumper), her car was totaled, and buddy's front end of his truck was totaled. So, what could I have done differently?
Nothing.
Sometimes it's gonna happen. I was going the speed limit - actually a little slower because traffic was heavy. I had ample time to slow down. I could have ran it and still have gotten a ticket.
So what. if you chop off your finger with a ax will your kid do the same?
"I got read ended at a stop light"
Because the kid behind me was not going to stop because the car behind him intimidated him.
That kind logic sounds kind of flawed to me?
People die doing what you say to do it puts everyone in danger. Your advise is flawed and dangerous to everyone on the road.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnolia Bloom
I've been rear-ended by doing that. My advice to my son stands.
The only time I can see running a light or stop sign is if the road conditions are so poor (ice) that the vehicles coming up behind you have already lost control and are skidding out of control and then only if is is clear and safe to do so.
Then a judge or a cop would/ might be sympathetic, but just because the car behind you was intimidating you isn't going to work for the judge or your insurance.
You still ran the semaphore and if your actions cause a accident you are responsible for it not the folks driving the vehicles behind you that is why they are ticketing for it.
It doesn't matter how short the yellow light is
as you are not allowed to enter the intersection when it comes on (in every state, see the uniforn traffic laws)
The yellow light is , it is to clear the intersection of traffic for when the light changes it's not so a few more cars can sneak threw.
The only time your allowed to enter a intersection is on a green light.
Unless there is signage at that intersection saying other wise.
like yield on a yellow turn arrow
I don't know about "every state", but I do know from experience that Colorado statute allows legal entry into an intersection on the yellow signal with the provision that you must be clear of the intersection when the light turns red.
I've assisted two friends who got ticketed in Englewood and Littleton for being in the intersection when the light turned red; in both cases, they legally entered the intersection just as the light turned yellow.
We went back and timed the "yellow" cycle time, and it was shorter than the time it would take to clear the intersection at the posted legal speed. So it was impossible to legally enter and clear before the red light came on. Apparently, the local PD knew this because they were sitting at the intersections and ticketing many drivers on the days that we went back to document/video the traffic signal timing; as well, they were there with radar checking the speeds there.
My friends weren't cited for speeding, so it inferred that they were not exceeding the speed limit.
Another friend got a ticket at those intersections ... Hampden and University Ave's ... where she was cited for speeding and running the red light, having entered on the yellow. We timed that one, too, and it wasn't possible that she entered just as the light turned yellow at the speed she was cited and was still in the intersection when it turned red. So the citations, per the officer, conflicted. Either she was speeding or she ran the light, but not both.
The judges threw the tickets out, and yes, the officers did appear in court.
The Littleton judge had a full, standing room only, courtroom on the day we appeared, and asked for a show of hands as to how many of the folk there that day had been cited for the same offense (not clearing the intersection by the time it turned red); over half of the people there raised their hands. The judge directed them all to step over to the court clerk, where their tickets would be thrown out and commented that until the city engineers set the "yellow cycle time" to allow a vehicle to legally clear the intersection, he wasn't going to uphold any of the tickets. The city attorney present agreed to take the matter up with the department and report back to the judge when they'd made the appropriate cycle time change. From what I understood about the proceedings, the judge had seen hundreds of folks in his courtroom with the same citation in the weeks prior and was not happy that the Littleton PD was apparently turning the short cycle light into a revenue producing venture.
I've not had experience with Wyoming law, but I have observed many times in Cheyenne that folk do enter intersections on yellow and have seen officers at the intersection not ticketing anybody. With the 20 mph speed zones throughout downtown Cheyenne, it's prevalent in the traffic patterns there to see traffic continue to enter the intersections on the yellow light when they are at the legal speed and it would be an abrupt maneuver to stop rather than enter the intersection. Given the high accident rate at a number of major intersections in Cheyenne, it must be acceptable to enter on yellow or the officers witnessing such driving would be ticketing the folks doing so.
Exactly what the laws I cited say.
" you must be clear of the intersection when the light turns red."
(or you are now running a red light and a red light ticket is issued)
It also does not mean you can enter the intersection like the light is green
as stated in the statutes I cited.
Nor does it say it is ok to run any light because you are intimidated by the vehicle behind you.
Those yellow light times are outlined in the uniform traffic code I cited by the GOVT.
As for your clients, Sure, they got off as there was not sufficient time allowed to clear the intersection as lined out in the uniform traffic code.
If you stop for the yellow you will never have to worry if you can clear the intersection thus getting a red light ticket.
You stop for a yellow so the intersection will be clear for those with the right-of-way when the light changes or you are running a red light and putting lives in danger and causing congested roadways ,all because you could not wait your turn.
Last edited by snofarmer; 10-13-2012 at 02:42 PM..
Problem is that the state is shortening the yellow so you either have to slam on the brakes or get a ticket, which is one way to get more revenue for the government. I suggest slowing down at the lights.
Coincidentally, I just got a ticket from one of these cameras because of this exact situation. I should have slammed on the brakes.
How much are the tickets? And do you always get a ticket if your photo is taken when you are in the intersection?
I work in Chicago occasionally for a week or more at a time. Several months ago in one week I got caught in the intersection four different times and my photo was taken. However, I never received even one ticket in the mail. I thought that might be because I don't have a front license plate since I live in Indiana.
I was there again for work this past week and my coworker got caught several times. He wasn't worried at all because he thought that you can't get a ticket if you don't have a front plate. As for me, I am extra careful in the intersections and slow down for stale green lights.
So what. if you chop off your finger with a ax will your kid do the same?
"I got read ended at a stop light"
Because the kid behind me was not going to stop because the car behind him intimidated him.
That kind logic sounds kind of flawed to me?
People die doing what you say to do it puts everyone in danger. Your advise is flawed and dangerous to everyone on the road.
Going through a borderline yellow is not going to hurt anyone. The other poster's logic is correct. You have to adjust accordingly to the situations around you.
Exactly what the laws I cited say.
" you must be clear of the intersection when the light turns red."
(or you are now running a red light and a red light ticket is issued)
It also does not mean you can enter the intersection like the light is green
as stated in the statutes I cited.
Nor does it say it is ok to run any light because you are intimidated by the vehicle behind you.
Those yellow light times are outlined in the uniform traffic code I cited by the GOVT.
As for your clients, Sure, they got off as there was not sufficient time allowed to clear the intersection as lined out in the uniform traffic code.
If you stop for the yellow you will never have to worry if you can clear the intersection thus getting a red light ticket.
You stop for a yellow so the intersection will be clear for those with the right-of-way when the light changes or you are running a red light and putting lives in danger and causing congested roadways ,all because you could not wait your turn.
No, what you said is different:
"The only time your allowed to enter a intersection is on a green light."
My experience is different; ie, it is legal to enter the intersection on a yellow light. In the statutes I've read, the yellow light is merely then to warn you that the signal is about to turn red.
BTW, I'm not a lawyer ... but as a concerned citizen when I see officers turning a poor traffic situation into a revenue enhancement game rather than performing their task of traffic safety, IMO, it's time to speak up. That's what was going on in Littleton for several months with their traffic light cycle timing. As well ...
I've mentioned in another thread on C-D, years ago ... I assisted my ex when she got cited at the annual city Christmas Lighting display at downtown Denver. The area leading into the intersection and the intersection was iced up that evening, and she was part of the endless parade of folk driving past. As the light turned red and she attempted to stop ... and she was only driving about 5 mph ... she slid into the crosswalk area before the car stopped. A group of Denver PD were there, not directing traffic to safely negotiate the attraction, but busily writing tickets for all the folk who slid into that intersection that night.
Same deal ... we went to C&C Denver traffic court, and she testified that it was a busy night with all the traffic for the major attraction, and the police weren't directing traffic, but spending their time citing folk for entering the intersection on the ice ... which was adjacent one-way streets, a left turn situation requiring a full stop on the red light before turning left. The judge was somewhat incredulous that the PD on the scene was not directing traffic, but taking advantage of the icy situation. This was the first time I'd seen a judge query the packed courtroom of traffic violations: "Please raise your hand if you were cited for entering that icy intersection on the red light". Most everybody in the courtroom raised their hands. The judge looked at the Denver cop and asked him why they weren't directing traffic in an obviously congested popular attraction that night, but instead just writing tickets with a known problem street condition. The cop had no defense for ignoring traffic safety in the obvious situation. The judge directed all with those tickets from that night to head to the court clerk where the tickets would be dismissed, much to the chagrin of the officers who stood by the curb that evening in the cold waiting to write their next citation.
I am 43, when I was 16 in CA getting my license I was taught that if you broke the white line entering intersection on yellow you are good.
Fast forward Denver Metro has a lot of these photo enforced red lights and speeding. The red lights tickets from photo have been deemed not enforceable in most cases so most people here just ignore them unless they get a formal summons and then they have to show up for court. They word it so stupid for themselves. It says were you the driver in the photo? If you answer no you are off. They ask you then who is it and if you say I don't know, when it's most likely your kid driving parents car or spouse, you get off.
Here in NC it's something like "entering an intersection while a traffic signal in the defendant's direction of travel is emitting a steady red light". I've never heard of any offense related to a yellow light. I imagine that if a LEO sees and hears me downshift and blast through a yellow, even below the speed limit, he/she can find something to cite me for.
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