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Just for kicks I looked up the various busses MUNI runs in San Francisco.
Our trolley's (electric overhead powered) come in two types. New Flyer makes the long accordion style buses and the standard length are made by Flyer or ETI. A good portion of our older diesel buses are being replaced with hybrid buses made by Daimler Chrysler. Our diesels are made by AC Transit and the MUNI Metro rail cars are made by Boeing-Vertol (older) and Italian Breda (newer).
Last edited by iTsLiKeAnEgG; 08-04-2009 at 12:25 PM..
Interesting information, Egg. Thanks for reporting!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crew Chief
Sirocco22, I read a couple of years ago that the Columbus (OH) transit system (COTA)restored a Fishbowl and run it on a different route every day. I sure hope they are still doing it; It's definitely on my "bucket list"! (I also love fire apparatus partly because many of them also are equipped with Detroits!)
(WOW...who'd have ever thought that a thread on transit busses, of all things, would've gone on this long!!!)
Thanks for the report on COTA, Chief ...interesting. I read somewhere that some other transit agencies were contemplating running vintage buses in service similar to what you describe in Columbus but one of the things that prevented them from doing so was that they were required to have accessible service at all times on their routes as per the ADA edict ...no wheelchair lifts on older buses.
Some cities keep one model of a popular bus in a separate vintage fleet and run them at community events or for special occasions such as to view Christmas lights, etc.
Yeah, I'm surprised too at the handful of folks participating in this thread. I wouldn't think there'd even be this many interested in this subject at City-Data forums. Some consider people interested in transit buses as nerds. It's just that I've been interested in buses since as early in my childhood as I can remember. I've never considered myself a nerd or a sissy.
I'm thinking that they are probably Orions. As Andros did mention the Federal funding issue pertaining to content, I'd have to guess that MANs are no longer being considered in bids by U.S. municipalities. Unless they agree to use some U.S. parts and assemble them here, I'm sure there's not much of a chance we would see MAN coaches in the U.S. anymore anytime soon.
MAN urban coaches still have that boxy look. It's very distictive, IMO. I liked it as we used to call them breadboxes. Their updated look still appears to keep that boxed-look but with very modern details.
Orions, on the other hand, always seemed to me to have a perpetual outdated and awkward look. Even their new low-floor coaches, to me, don't seem as nice looking and updated as New Flyer or Gillig low-floors.
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I checked today and they are made by Orion. They may not look the best, but for passengers in wheelchairs (that's me) they are really some of the best I have seen. I like the way some other buses look better too, but that doesn't mean that they are better.
I checked today and they are made by Orion. They may not look the best, but for passengers in wheelchairs (that's me) they are really some of the best I have seen. I like the way some other buses look better too, but that doesn't mean that they are better.
Oh, absolutely. Functionality over looks any day. I was just commenting based on the assumption that functionality was equal.
Most lifts on buses today are similar as is the width of the coach itself. The buyer has the ability to set some interior isle configuration and measurement, seat size, driver compartment configuration, the location of the farebox and other necessities up front, etc. so that a wheelchair can maneuver more easily into the designated tie-down area.
I like the lift mechanics on the low-floor coaches where the lift (aka ramp) either slides out or folds out. Much more reliable than the actual mechanical lift that elevates up to isle level by a motor and hydraulics that the coaches of one generation earlier where you had to go up steps.
How do you like the accessibility of the newer low-floor buses?
Thanks for the report on COTA, Chief ...interesting. I read somewhere that some other transit agencies were contemplating running vintage buses in service similar to what you describe in Columbus but one of the things that prevented them from doing so was that they were required to have accessible service at all times on their routes as per the ADA edict ...no wheelchair lifts on older buses.
Some cities keep one model of a popular bus in a separate vintage fleet and run them at community events or for special occasions such as to view Christmas lights, etc.
Yeah, I'm surprised too at the handful of folks participating in this thread. I wouldn't think there'd even be this many interested in this subject at City-Data forums. Some consider people interested in transit buses as nerds. It's just that I've been interested in buses since as early in my childhood as I can remember. I've never considered myself a nerd or a sissy.
Sigh...I firmly believe in the ADA and support it wholeheartedly. But there's something that's just not right about modifying a vintage vehicle beyond the equipment available when it was new. I can't remember any Fishbowls modified to be ADA-compliant; I'm guessing most of the Fishbowls were well on their way to retirement before the ADA.
I didn't think of the ADA when I read about the COTA Fishbowl. Nothing was mentioned about ADA accesability in the article about it's restoration. maybe they run it as a "second section" on it's route; as Greyhound does when extra paasengers are headed inthe same direction.
Nerdy? Nah!!! I've met folks from all backgrounds athat enjoy old busses, truck and fire apparatus. Most of 'em are really great folks! (And there's a LOT more of us than anyone outside our hobbies would ever imagine...
Oh, absolutely. Functionality over looks any day. I was just commenting based on the assumption that functionality was equal.
Most lifts on buses today are similar as is the width of the coach itself. The buyer has the ability to set some interior isle configuration and measurement, seat size, driver compartment configuration, the location of the farebox and other necessities up front, etc. so that a wheelchair can maneuver more easily into the designated tie-down area.
I like the lift mechanics on the low-floor coaches where the lift (aka ramp) either slides out or folds out. Much more reliable than the actual mechanical lift that elevates up to isle level by a motor and hydraulics that the coaches of one generation earlier where you had to go up steps.
How do you like the accessibility of the newer low-floor buses?
Love the lowered floor Orions in Montgomery County, MD with the ramps. They are very well designed. I actually can hold on to the folded up seats to feel more secure. I hate the older Orions with the lifts because they don't have proper tie-downs and there is no place to hold on to anything to stay steady. I refuse to use those unless I'm pressed for time. I've noticed DC's Metrobus uses a different manufacturer;s bus, not sure which, but it is not as good as the Orions in MC. They work, but I'm just not as comfortable in those.
Sigh...I firmly believe in the ADA and support it wholeheartedly. But there's something that's just not right about modifying a vintage vehicle beyond the equipment available when it was new. I can't remember any Fishbowls modified to be ADA-compliant; I'm guessing most of the Fishbowls were well on their way to retirement before the ADA.
I didn't think of the ADA when I read about the COTA Fishbowl. Nothing was mentioned about ADA accesability in the article about it's restoration. maybe they run it as a "second section" on it's route; as Greyhound does when extra paasengers are headed inthe same direction.
No, you're right, Chief. In the cities that I'm familiar with, when a route or a trip is designated "accessible," they are now more-or-less obligated to provide that service. So to purposely run a vintage bus with no lift on a trip that is designated as being accessible would not be an option. Yes, it would be silly to spend the money on retrofitting an older coach such as a fishbowl with a lift as they weren't designed to have a lift for as you say, it was WAY before requirements for public transportation to be ADA compliant.
I remember reading that the RTS lost a lot of orders initially because their lift was on the backdoor and many agencies wanted their lifts on the front door. I think it wasn't until their 8th revision that they finally offered the lift on the front door.
Love the lowered floor Orions in Montgomery County, MD with the ramps. They are very well designed. I actually can hold on to the folded up seats to feel more secure. I hate the older Orions with the lifts because they don't have proper tie-downs and there is no place to hold on to anything to stay steady. I refuse to use those unless I'm pressed for time. I've noticed DC's Metrobus uses a different manufacturer;s bus, not sure which, but it is not as good as the Orions in MC. They work, but I'm just not as comfortable in those.
Yes, I understand. I'm glad they're making progress to make it easier for those using wheelchairs to ride buses. I've heard it from more than one wheelchair user that the new low-floors with the ramps are much better than the older buses with lifts. Using the ramp and the kneeling feature, it's "almost" a flat ingress and egress.
Peggy Anne, thanks! *lol* I wasn't expecting that. When mentioning Flxible, I'm picturing the "new-look" coaches that were so popular back in the 60s.
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