Splitting land and gathering info. (Holualoa, Honokaa: for sale, houses, buying)

[jaysonsd]

Hi everyone,

I am interested in some land on the west side that I want to split with my parents and develop separately. The seller had originally bought a 7 acre L shaped plot and divided it into 2 2-acre lots and a 1-acre plot to keep for themselves.

I can't really afford the lots on it's own and it would require splitting (eventually) with my parents paying half. The land is zoned RA-.5a. Does anyone have recent experience with dealing with the planning department on this? Timelines, water meter issues, costs etc?

Was going to call the planning department but didn't know who to talk to. One person mentioned contacting Zendo Kern consultants as they advertise being a land planning consultant.

Thanks,
Jayson

[hotzcatz]

Since you're working with family it should be pretty easy to buy the land together with them at the beginning. Make your own plan of who's side is where, etc. Then develop yours on your own. Until you get the property subdivided, all the property owners will have to sign off on any building permits.

A two acre lot zoned RA.5a sounds like it could be subdivided down into four lots. Check what's allowed in that zoning. Also, each lot will have to have it's own access. You can't access one lot by going through another. You will need a driveway 8'-10' wide for each lot so if you're starting out with a flag lot, the flag will need to be forty feet wide for further subdivision.

Are there even water meters? A lot of land on the Kona side of the island doesn't have water service. There may or may not be electricity. Internet may or may not be available depending on location. Most likely no sewers and cesspools aren't allowed anymore so it will most likely be septic systems.

To actually subdivide, you make a plan of who's side is where and get a certified surveyor to set the pins. They usually work with someone to write up the new property descriptions.

Depending on how many lots you subdivide it into, you may or may not be required to put in streets, sidewalks, street lamps, etc. I think it's four properties? But it's been a long time since I've done a subdivision and rules change all the time. I'm just a draftsman, a hired pencil as it were, drawing up what folks want so I end up drawing a whole pile of different things.

[Dreaming of Hawaii]

I suggest that you go to the west side planning office and talk to someone in person. Come prepared with TMK information. Write down date and person’s name. What someone tells you today may be different than what someone else (or the same person) tells you on a different day. Get details of appropriate zoning code sections. Also talk with the health department about septic tank requirements. You should probably also talk with someone from Helco about the electricity.

[jaysonsd]

So there's two lots for sale, one's a flag and one standard semi-rectangular. It's in Holualoa, so really close to Kona actually.

Access road runs east to west off the main and it is a little rough, but has power and water lines running to half dozen homes west of the land I'm interested in. Cistern is literally across the street on main road.

Some of the houses are pretty big, so the road is useable for heavy equipment (or it was when the houses were built). I'm doing all of this remote from San Diego, won't go out until I talk to planning department and get a video.

I think I'm really trying to get a peep's past experience on timelines? Say I buy this land and have a plan submitted via a surveyor, how long's the county gonna take to approve? Weeks? Months? Years?

[hotzcatz]

Most likely month or more if it's done properly the first time. However, you'd not have to officially subdivide to start construction if all landowners sign off on the permit unless you have to sell off parcels in order to start construction.

Which direction is east to west? There's 'mauka' which is towards the mountain and 'makai' which is towards the ocean. Not sure which directions Kona folks use for towards Kohala (probably Kohala) and they may use Southpoint for the other direction, but Southpoint is a location, not a direction.


Holualoa is friable rocky 'soil' with lots of topography involved. Are you buying this lot sight unseen? There could be ravines and really steep hillsides involved. Not all of your lot may be buildable depending on the topography.

[jaysonsd]

Originally Posted by hotzcatz

Most likely month or more if it's done properly the first time. However, you'd not have to officially subdivide to start construction if all landowners sign off on the permit unless you have to sell off parcels in order to start construction.

Which direction is east to west? There's 'mauka' which is towards the mountain and 'makai' which is towards the ocean. Not sure which directions Kona folks use for towards Kohala (probably Kohala) and they may use Southpoint for the other direction, but Southpoint is a location, not a direction.


Holualoa is friable rocky 'soil' with lots of topography involved. Are you buying this lot sight unseen? There could be ravines and really steep hillsides involved. Not all of your lot may be buildable depending on the topography.

Hi hotzcatz,

The service road is kinda barely a road, however, it's off Hualalai Road, sitting at about 1000 ft. The road starts on the makai side of Hualalai road and continues west.

Definitely not site unseen, very risk averse buying w/o walking it myself and having some kind of topo/survey done. But it's in an area already heavily developed. If I had to guess, the owner bought all the land up and split themselves to pay for something else (given the cost they paid according to the county).

Pics show fair amount of trees and the lot hits google's 3D view on google earth. Wish we had checked it out last time we were there.

Thanks for the info! Will call planning today.

[Grassyknoll]

In my somewhat limited experience, I would say to plan on things taking twice as long as you anticipate and whatever you do, smile, smile, smile and be as nice as possible. Any hint of mainland attitude and you might see your project moved all the way to the back burner. Seen it happen to a few folks. In one instance a restaurant owner who was remodeling needed the final permit signed off on his restaurant; he ticked off someone at the health department and he had to wait another 6 months for inspection.

[hotzcatz]

Was that the restaurant guy in Honokaa? He got set back almost a year if not more, I thought? He kept arguing with them. His project took forever!

[Grassyknoll]

Originally Posted by hotzcatz

Was that the restaurant guy in Honokaa? He got set back almost a year if not more, I thought? He kept arguing with them. His project took forever!

Nope, it was a South Kona restaurant.
But that helps drive home how important it is here to swallow your pride and be humble when dealing with civil servants, they can and will make your life hell with almost no risk of repercussions on their end.
Welcome to the banana republic.

[Dreaming of Hawaii]

I had a heated discussion with a building official who refused to do his job. Luckily it didn’t concern my property, but a neighbor blatantly flaunting building code. The building official told me that if I didn’t like his answer, that I should “complain to the mayor”, knowing that there would be no repercussion. So, yes, knowing how to deal with County officials is a skill.