Is Leaving California More Practical Than Water Rationing? (Los Angeles, San Diego: home, school)

[nightbird47]

Originally Posted by la_fuerza

I totally agree about the animals and the dying trees. The human impact on the environment is severe. One of the reasons I started this thread is if someone really loves California, perhaps the most ethical thing to do is leave and not be a drain on the resources. Not being there to use water is the ultimate rationing.

When I first moved to the IE from Orange county, Riverside had about 35k. A lot of the older areas still had the acre and half acre lots from long before. You could drive through it and see lots of open areas between areas of housing and the smog wasn't good but wasn't awful.

Then the boom hit. The empty spaces dissapeared. They got permission to break up the acre lots so they could put more houses per site. The traffic exploded, same number of roads as before. The smog got awful. It could take you an hour after three to drive from Riverside to Corona. The population was near three million.

This area had had farms, but not high water use things. When the drought hit, we just let the lawn die. But the smog was getting so bad I was having breathing problems. We broke up and went our own ways. I had LONG wanted to leave and eventually the chance to came.

Oklahoma is a very different place, but more like the socal I remember in my youth than socal is now. But what's refreshing is people are taking seriously the worries of water here, even if its not nearly so bad as socal. Maybe if socal had then it wouldn't be so bad. What if every person buried a drip irrigation hose under ther lawn, and ag was forced into using the least water they could get by when it wasn't an emergency. Maybe it wouldn't be.

People seem to grow blind about small problems until they get smacked in the face. But Karma can't be denied. It's always been a semi arid area and subject to dry and wet periods and nobody wanted to deal with it realistically and adjust to a dryer land. Adjust to the worse, save when its good, and let nature do its thing. Don't and karma will just smack your lawn dead as a warning for worse.

My son and family moved out, and some of my nephew's and neices as well, already. I wonder who will be next.

[xeric]

Originally Posted by revelated

The whole water rationing thing amuses me. The idea of not watering lawns is funny. It's like people don't understand the natural evaporation cycle. I mean water in lawns doesn't just disappear into thin air. Well, actually it does.

I've seen all of the various pictures of mountain peaks lacking snow, extended times of no rain, etc. So clearly there is a problem upstairs which is disrupting this cycle. But if anything, NOT watering lawns and gardens is just making the problem worse. There's waste (a broken sprinkler head, for example) and that's one thing, but just watering the lawn?

Except that you are forgetting why the lawns need water in the first place - so that the plants can consume it to keep themselves alive. So by definition, you are taking a percentage of that water out of the cycle to meet the needs of the plants you are irrigating. In the case of most of the western US then, what you are doing is pumping most of that water from it's source to the areas where people live (usually at least partially uphill), irrigating grass with it, releasing some percentage of that back into the atmosphere (through both evaporation and transpiration), and assuming that a percentage of that percentage will make it back to the mountains, where through orographic uplift it will add to the precipitation there. This is not an efficient way of utilizing a valuable resource.

[revelated]

Originally Posted by xeric

Except that you are forgetting why the lawns need water in the first place - so that the plants can USE it to keep themselves alive. So by definition, you are taking a percentage of that water out of the cycle to meet the needs of the plants you are irrigating. In the case of most of the western US then, what you are doing is pumping most of that water from it's source to the areas where people live (usually at least partially uphill), irrigating grass with it, releasing some small percentage of that back into atmosphere (through both evaporation and transpiration), and assuming that some percentage of that percentage will make it back to the mountains, where through orographic uplift it will add to the precipitation in the mountains. This is much less efficient than leaving it there in the first place especially since a percentage of the percentage (of the percentage) of the water vapor that gets back into the atmosphere is subject to even more evaporation on the journey back to the mountains.

Again I ask: What's the real reason the mountain areas are lacking in the first place? And are humans causing it with their artificial actions?

It doesn't make sense that in so many other areas they can manage with lawns and such just fine but California cannot. I'm simply saying that, as others have indicated, avoiding watering lawns isn't going to make much difference because watering soil and plants are part of a natural cycle anyway. Nothing's changed. Unless mankind has done something different in California than in other areas to cause that change. Some have said it's agriculture using the bulk of water, but that doesn't account for the lack of snow and water in the mountain regions. So then you blame bottling, but that doesn't account for the lack of rainfall.

[expatCA]

Originally Posted by la_fuerza

I totally agree about the animals and the dying trees. The human impact on the environment is severe. One of the reasons I started this thread is if someone really loves California, perhaps the most ethical thing to do is leave and not be a drain on the resources. Not being there to use water is the ultimate rationing.

Well there are more trees in CA, particularly So Cal, than before people moved here. The ones dying are dying because of a lack of natural water and people have nothing to do with that. It does not rain or snow and they die. It is ............. natural.

I grew up in OC and the number of native trees or any tree other than an orange tree, was rare in the bulk of the county. Now tens of thousands have been planted by residents, cities and counties. Very arid areas have few trees and So Cal now has a LOTS of trees because of man. Then look at Murrieta and Temecual and there are more thousands of trees than before. Is man causing problems, yes, and on both sides of the issues.

[btownboss4]

It's suppose to rain 7/10 days in the 10 day here in New England, what a bummer.

[xeric]

Originally Posted by revelated

Again I ask: What's the real reason the mountain areas are lacking in the first place? And are humans causing it with their artificial actions?

It doesn't make sense that in so many other areas they can manage with lawns and such just fine but California cannot. I'm simply saying that, as others have indicated, avoiding watering lawns isn't going to make much difference because watering soil and plants are part of a natural cycle anyway. Nothing's changed. Unless mankind has done something different in California than in other areas to cause that change. Some have said it's agriculture using the bulk of water, but that doesn't account for the lack of snow and water in the mountain regions. So then you blame bottling, but that doesn't account for the lack of rainfall.

It's your population. Lawns are frivolous when water is in short supply. If Colorado had as many people, we'd be in even worse shape because our cities are less dense than yours and we've had no drought as extensive as yours to prepeare us (at least in my memory here). Basically it's supply. Most of your population (as with ours) live in areas too dry for lawns, and so you have to pipe the water from the wetter areas where fewer people live. The fact that some (very small) proportion of that water will eventually make it back to the source watersheds doesn't help when you have X amount that has to partitioned out to different sectors that want more water then the combined total storage can provide.

[things and stuff]

Don't low income people get their water bills paid for? They get their housing, and everything else paid for. Why would they leave? The wealthy will always have their way, and first dibs with natural resources.

So, I guess you're talking about middle class people leaving. Yes, it would technically help with the water shortage but most of it is used by farmers, anyway.

[Hardpan]

[quote=JeffSanDimas;39095439]

Originally Posted by Hardpan

I pay my water bill.

Tell me how my license (which is an Arizona State License, and my car is registered in Gilbert where my parents own a home - much cheaper insurance than LA metro) will be affected.


The city of Simi Valley is not going to lock my water.


Honestly, at this point. I hope California turns into a dry and uninhabitable wasteland and a major humanitarian crisis, compounded by looting, fires etc. Thousands dead, LA in ruins, shriveled up dehydrated prune people strewn across Ventura Boulevard. It would be biblical, a great lesson for the rest of the world - this is what happens when you turn your state into Nuevo Sodom.

Becuase in 1992 the states got tired of drunk drivers, people who didnt pay child support or alimoney, and others, from running off to other states to aviod paying
thier penalities and bills, so they use your DMV data to nail you.
All they need is your SS number to find out about your AZ status.

You had six months to get your cars and your license changed to CA. If you broke that law too,then you will be paying for that as well. States do not want residents using thier roads without paying for them with vehicle registration and license fees. You wont have to take a written test, just a photo and a thumbprint and you have
a CA drivers license, if you had an AZ license.

If you get pulled over by the cops with a license or registration that is older then six month out if AZ, you will be cited and if you dont pay that,you be arrested and have to make a court appearance. If not, you will have
a BOLO put out for your arrest and your car will be impounded and sold to pay for your own mistakes. This isnt the 1970's anymore. Computers have all your data these day, son.

[dtran103]

I find is hilarious that California is always talked about like it's on the verge of the collapse of civilization. States blocking off borders? Distributing out populations? How about returning to horses and carriages for transport?

[expatCA]

Originally Posted by dtran103

I find is hilarious that California is always talked about like it's on the verge of the collapse of civilization. States blocking off borders? Distributing out populations? How about returning to horses and carriages for transport?

Horses??? Lets see about 30,000,000 million plus people using horses. Do you know how much pollution those horses would create on every street????