CALEXIT: Would you support a secession? (relocate to, hot, sell)

[mysticaltyger]

Originally Posted by StanleysOwl

It absolutely would be tougher on immigration. Your protest to that shows you have no understanding of sanctuary city policies which do not exist to encourage open borders at all.

OMG, this is totally delusional.

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by mysticaltyger

OMG, this is totally delusional.

Lol. This from the forum's preeminent conspiracy theorist! Wonderful!

So, tyger - and Shooter - name a country anywhere in the world that has open borders. No immigration restrictions. Welcomes anyone. Even super liberal countries. I'll wait.

When nations have autonomy, they exercise it. The U.S. is perhaps the world's most lax and welcoming with regard to immigration. California is the rest of the world's dream migration. It couldn't handle a day without controls. And, liberal as you think California is, it's not as much so as you infer would cause disaster. Neither would the new leadership be a bunch of dopes.

By the way, Shooter, I am very much enjoying the irony of your objections to the notion of an independent California nation, given you are a full-blooded Libertarian / states' rights advocate.

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by shooting4life

I don't need to because it won't happen. I doubt you could even get 1/2 of Californians to vote one to leave.

Shooter, the national rate for citizens who favor secession for their respective states is 22%. In California it jumped to 32% (Reuters poll in January) in the past year, and climbing.

Hilariously, here's what Herman Cain's (remember him?) blog website reports supportively:

Oh please, please, please...
The dream is alive! According to a new Reuters/Ipsos poll, there are now more Californians than ever who support the idea of seceding from the United States. Dubbed the "Calexit" movement, the goal is to make California its own country, thus bestowing upon the world a happy, prosperous, California-free, America where it will be virtually impossible to elect a Democrat President.
Oh wait, sorry, that's our goal, not theirs.
https://www.hermancain.com/new-poll-...ssion-movement

So, for all you doubters that say it's impossible that the rest of the United States would approve California's exit, take note. You know all those folks who voted for the Moron in Chief who now occupies the Oval Office? Pretty much every one of them would love to see California out of the union. For starters.

[shooting4life]

Originally Posted by Tulemutt

Lol. This from the forum's preeminent conspiracy theorist! Wonderful!

So, tyger - and Shooter - name a country anywhere in the world that has open borders. No immigration restrictions. Welcomes anyone. Even super liberal countries. I'll wait.

When nations have autonomy, they exercise it. The U.S. is perhaps the world's most lax and welcoming with regard to immigration. California is the rest of the world's dream migration. It couldn't handle a day without controls. And, liberal as you think California is, it's not as much so as you infer would cause disaster. Neither would the new leadership be a bunch of dopes.

By the way, Shooter, I am very much enjoying the irony of your objections to the notion of an independent California nation, given you are a full-blooded Libertarian / states' rights advocate.

FInd where I said I do t support California leaving. I havnt given my personal opinion on the scenario. I have described how it will never happen and be bad for both current California and for the USA.

Being for liberty and personal freedom, handing over the reins to California democrats without any sort of check isn't a good idea. Parenting that the leading democrats will all of the sudden become fiscally responsible and control immigration is laughable.

[shooting4life]

Originally Posted by Tulemutt

Shooter, the national rate for citizens who favor secession for their respective states is 22%. In California it jumped to 32% (Reuters poll in January) in the past year, and climbing.

Hilariously, here's what Herman Cain's (remember him?) blog website reports supportively:



So, for all you doubters that say it's impossible that the rest of the United States would approve California's exit, take note. You know all those folks who voted for the Moron in Chief who now occupies the Oval Office? Pretty much every one of them would love to see California out of the union. For starters.

Think of it this way. If California left the union the federal government would become even more conservative. Republicans would dominate the house, senate and presidency for the foreseeable future. The same republicans would then be in charge of establishing trade partnerships with California. Do you think US first trade policy that has become dominate in this administration would all of the sudden give California an equitable trade agreement? All this state has to offer to the federal government would be the port of LA, that is the only leverage this state has. Over time that leverage would dwindle as the port in Washington state expands. Everything else is easily replaced with either developing markets in other states (tech and agriculture) or trade with other nations (agriculture).

California leaving the union weakens the union. Why would 2/3 of states vote to weaken the union?

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by Tulemutt

Lol. This from the forum's preeminent conspiracy theorist! Wonderful!

So, tyger - and Shooter - name a country anywhere in the world that has open borders. No immigration restrictions. Welcomes anyone. Even super liberal countries. I'll wait.

When nations have autonomy, they exercise it. The U.S. is perhaps the world's most lax and welcoming with regard to immigration. California is the rest of the world's dream migration. It couldn't handle a day without controls. And, liberal as you think California is, it's not as much so as you infer would cause disaster. Neither would the new leadership be a bunch of dopes.

By the way, Shooter, I am very much enjoying the irony of your objections to the notion of an independent California nation, given you are a full-blooded Libertarian / states' rights advocate.

The cognitive dissonance is strong with those two.

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by shooting4life

Think of it this way. If California left the union the federal government would become even more conservative. Republicans would dominate the house, senate and presidency for the foreseeable future. The same republicans would then be in charge of establishing trade partnerships with California. Do you think US first trade policy that has become dominate in this administration would all of the sudden give California an equitable trade agreement? All this state has to offer to the federal government would be the port of LA, that is the only leverage this state has. Over time that leverage would dwindle as the port in Washington state expands. Everything else is easily replaced with either developing markets in other states (tech and agriculture) or trade with other nations (agriculture).

California leaving the union weakens the union. Why would 2/3 of states vote to weaken the union?

13% of the US GDP. You keep leaving that out. Now take that into consideration then ask about the trade agreement again.

[shooting4life]

Originally Posted by Gentoo

13% of the US GDP. You keep leaving that out. Now take that into consideration then ask about the trade agreement again.

Or would California want access to the 87% of GDP they are leaving?

Not to mention how California would be dependent on US for both energy and water to a lesser extent.

California has no leverage. Especially with its history of poor tax structure for business, over regulation and an unwillingness to utilize natural resourcee and desire to increase the welfare state. It is a recipe for disaster.

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by shooting4life

FInd where I said I do t support California leaving. I havnt given my personal opinion on the scenario. I have described how it will never happen and be bad for both current California and for the USA.

Your opposition has been unmistakably tacit ... and you just affirmed it (bold above).

Originally Posted by shooting4life

Being for liberty and personal freedom, handing over the reins to California democrats without any sort of check isn't a good idea. Parenting that the leading democrats will all of the sudden become fiscally responsible and control immigration is laughable.

So, you are for liberty as long as it's not liberal liberty. Roflmfao.

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by shooting4life

Think of it this way. If California left the union the federal government would become even more conservative. Republicans would dominate the house, senate and presidency for the foreseeable future. The same republicans would then be in charge of establishing trade partnerships with California. Do you think US first trade policy that has become dominate in this administration would all of the sudden give California an equitable trade agreement? All this state has to offer to the federal government would be the port of LA, that is the only leverage this state has. Over time that leverage would dwindle as the port in Washington state expands. Everything else is easily replaced with either developing markets in other states (tech and agriculture) or trade with other nations (agriculture).

California leaving the union weakens the union. Why would 2/3 of states vote to weaken the union?

Does the U.S. have favorable trade relationships with Japan and Germany? And France and Great Britain? And ... Why wouldn't it have favorable trade relationships with California? That's what Stanley and Gentoo have been pointing out for 60 or so pages here. This assumption of adversarial relationships is completely unfounded.

All California has to offer is the port of L.A.? Nuts. Literally and figuratively. We have almonds. Everyone knows the nation is addicted to almonds and we grow almost the whole world's supply. Case closed. End of story. ... But, seriously, you do not understand the difference between a single market size of 40 million (CA) compared to 7 million (WA)? Okay, add Oregon to Washington as area served by the Ports of Seattle and Tacoma. Now you are up to a market 1/4 the size of California. But wait, there's more! as they say on late night tee-vee informercials. There's Idaho and Montana! Maybe even Wyoming!

Com'on Shooter. Get real.

Why would 2/3rds of the states vote to oust California? Ask Trump supporters. Ask Herman Cain. They hate us out there, bub. "They'd" love to get rid of blue California to advance the chances of conservative federal control. For starters.